Rishi's Manchester hotel room cut back planning team were unaware there are protected sight lines from Primrose Hill and Parliament Hill (and other locations as well that don't affect HS2 at Euston) to Parliament and St Pauls. This limits wat can and can't be done with land at Euston and the far west side of the site that the team were salivating over is very problematic for tall buildings hence a 10/11 track HS2 station with over track development actually produces more building square footage when you take into account sight lines...
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HS2 Euston - Development, design and construction news (not speculation, please)
- Thread starter Nottingham59
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That is not surprising as most politicians have zero grasp of planning constrains, engineering constrains etc. Most of them studied humanities.
If for a monument we discount political anti-rail views of Sunak and his team there are too few folks around government who have any sort of technical background.
Tezza1978
Member
I knew about the sightline issue from previous posts on here, but didn't realise that meant there can actually be more development on top if the 10/11 track version is built.
If the govt had any brains then surely the larger "box" will then be built with passive provision for the extra platforms at least. It may not be up to them anyway given the election is < 6 months away - as any "plan" they have can be amended by the next govt before work starts on the station build
Fazaar1889
Member
On the assumption that the 6 platform stations goes ahead and then later the rest of HS2 is built in full. How would they expand it? Would they just knockdown the housing they just built?
If anything, that just seems to me like rishi is saying "haha look at me, I care about you guys! I'm building housing! See!" while contributing almost nothing to counteract the housing crisis.
No the aim was to have small footprint station leaving more land clear for other development unfortunately unbeknownst to Rishi's hotel room team those potentially "clear" areas can't have very tall buildings, hence tall buildings are needed to maximise overall development floor space (which they they are when sightlines are included) then you have to have you have to have tall building over the new HS2 station further east if possible where the top of the building can be much taller.
The problem is that this is expensive and Camden council viewed all this extra cost for over station development as something that meant they should get more S.106 benefit from based on % value of overall non rail exclusive development where as everyone else view was that Camden should get less because of the restrictive planning conditions.
In reality Rishi didn't get any real vote bounce out of it and Euston tunnelling isn't meant to start till summer 2025 so not much cost impact now (cheaper than cancelling for short term cashflow which is mostly what they care about at the moment).
Euston tunnelling should start shortly after the eastbound TBMs from Northholt complete their work.
chris2
Member
So if you can’t really develop the land why would they not put the new station there?
Surely the only alternative to this is knocking more of the existing Euston down? Won’t that trash the capacity and bring even more disruption and delay? Not to mention be an awful kick in the teeth for anyone who lost their home for a station that never got built and became someone else’s home instead??
Much easier for the next government to come to that conclusion, but then Kier is the local MP which also causes many complications... (more than when Boris's dad lived locally.)
Rishi hotel room team were also severely lacking in knowledge of compulsory purchase legalisation - there will be legal action if Rishi's plans get much further
chris2
Member
So is the smart money on a return to the original plan then?
poffle
Member
I think a lot of the issues with Euston is with the HS2 station being a standalone project whereas there actually needs to be an integrated plan for the HS2 and Network Rail station. And the potential Crossrail 2.
Bingo!
The Planner
Veteran Member
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There is though, there is a Euston redevelopment team that is working with HS2.
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
But the original plan was "unaffordable" and "unachievable", which is where we came in.
Rishi also took the project off HS2 Ltd as a punishment for screwing it up.
Fazaar1889
Member
So.. what happens now? Is it still with Rishi or is it going back to HS2?
Snow1964
Established Member
Sort of stuck in the middle at the moment
HS2 can do token amount of work, ticking over during the 2 year construction pause, but without finance can't really go any further. The Government controls the finance.
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
It's very definitely with Rishi and his advisors, together with the consortium they put together to redesign (and fund) Euston.
But is does look like the approach tunnels from OOC (still with HS2 Ltd) will be completed, so HS2 will reach Euston somehow.
Snow1964
Established Member
Info on Euston from TfL Board papers (for meeting 26 June)
section 5.1.2 (a) Old Oak Common now expected to be temporary HS2 terminus for around 10 years
section 5.1.2 (c) Government expecting 10,000 new homes as part of Euston development
section 5.1.2 (d) looking at reducing costs at Euston in relation to interchanges
section 5.1.2 (a) Old Oak Common now expected to be temporary HS2 terminus for around 10 years
section 5.1.2 (c) Government expecting 10,000 new homes as part of Euston development
section 5.1.2 (d) looking at reducing costs at Euston in relation to interchanges
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
If its going to be ten years before Euston is complete that makes in 2040 much point bothering with the terminus. What a mess the Torys have made of this.
jfowkes
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Waterloo was the terminus for Eurostar for 13 years before HS1 and St Pancras came along. Yeah it sucks that HS2 has been extremely badly mishandled by the government, but looking long term there's still a possibility of a brighter, better future.
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
Waterloo was in central London mind you Elizabeth line will at least provide far more suitable connectivity for long distance travellers than the Northern or Bakerloo line did.
chris2
Member
New drone footage of the Euston approaches / throat. Lots of activity.
Fazaar1889
Member
What's happening now? I was under the impression that it was in a kind of limbo state?
Nottingham59
Established Member
This is the March 24 Construction look ahead for Camden.
12LDA28C
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The Tunnel Boring Machines are being delivered to Old Oak Common in the coming months before commencing tunneling towards Euston. So HS2 is planned to still go to Euston.
The Planner
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They still have to sort the over bridges in the throat.
Fazaar1889
Member
Thanks guys
chris2
Member
So in terms of activity this is what HS2 themselves say they are doing during the ‘pause’…
The first of these - the bridge extension - can be quite easily seen in the video. The construction of the supports appears to show four parallel channels for tracks to run in underneath the future bridge deck.
Looking further ahead…
- TBMs will set off from OOC in due course. Funding is committed.
- a large cavern will be built in order to get the TBMs out when they get to Euston approaches.
- three spray-lined tunnels that fan out from the cavern are due to start in 2026 according to the look ahead doc linked above.
- this activity will shut Mornington St bridge until 2031, so presumably that means the spray-lined tunnels will take quite a while.
I’d say pretty liberal interpretation of a ‘pause’, in other words.
The first of these - the bridge extension - can be quite easily seen in the video. The construction of the supports appears to show four parallel channels for tracks to run in underneath the future bridge deck.
Looking further ahead…
- TBMs will set off from OOC in due course. Funding is committed.
- a large cavern will be built in order to get the TBMs out when they get to Euston approaches.
- three spray-lined tunnels that fan out from the cavern are due to start in 2026 according to the look ahead doc linked above.
- this activity will shut Mornington St bridge until 2031, so presumably that means the spray-lined tunnels will take quite a while.
I’d say pretty liberal interpretation of a ‘pause’, in other words.
Snow1964
Established Member
Construction Wave is reporting that the £450m contract for enabling works at Euston have been completed
constructionwave.co.uk
Skanska completes £450m enabling works at Euston Station
Skanska has completed £450 million enabling works for London Euston station in preparation for HS2.
constructionwave.co.uk
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
so 450m has bought us a hole in the groundConstruction Wave is reporting that the £450m contract for enabling works at Euston have been completed
Skanska completes £450m enabling works at Euston Station
Skanska has completed £450 million enabling works for London Euston station in preparation for HS2.