Class 185 refurbishment for TPE.

[CosherB]

Six weeks of school holidays now... I reckon they'll all be done by early-mid September when or just after the kids go back

Does that mean TPE are using cheap child labour over the summer break to revinyl 185s?!

 

[ash39]

185132 has been done, so we are now looking at this:

185101, 185102, 185103, 185104, 185105, 185106, 185107, 185108, 185109, 185110, 185111, 185112, 185113, 185114, 185115, 185116, 185117, 185118, 185119, 185120, 185121, 185122, 185123, 185124, 185125, 185126, 185127, 185128, 185129, 185130, 185131, 185132, 185133, 185134, 185135, 185136, 185137, 185138, 185139, 185140, 185141, 185142, 185143, 185144, 185145, 185146, 185147, 185148, 185149, 185150, 185151.

185145 is definitely in the old livery as it was working a Liverpool to Scarborough service yesterday with 185109 (which is a repainted unit).

126 is also still old livery, just seen at Oxford Rd

 

[scottie]

148 been done. Saw it at York tuesday

 

[Platform9]

134 should be next out

 

[IanXC]

Much as I think there is a bit of a build quality issue at times, Turbostars are quite a bit cheaper, would have been more useful for cascading to other TOCs, have a better interior layout with excellent window alignment, are more fuel efficient and can use SP differentials. I would suggest they should actually have ordered (at least some) 4-car Turbostars instead of 3-car 185s.

Siemens no doubt cut costs to get in on the bid (hence the design issues), but I personally think they made the wrong economies in doing so.

So having worked out that they could come up with a potentially winning design for the TP DMU, you're saying Siemens should have thrown up their hands and said they're not going to because a Turbostar 'would be better'? I'm sorry but you're clearly living on another planet.

 

[Fudgefrog]

Would 170s have been powerful enough on the steeper Pennine climbs to match the speed and acceleration of the 185s, though?

It's worth remembering that the eco mode enabled a few years after introduction reduces fuel consumption quite a bit by effectively switching an engine off when it isn't needed. It'll also be interesting to see if the trains are judged to be better when new engines are fitted.

I personally don't see an issue with the windows. The only legitimate problems with them came down to spec - too short.

 

[BMIFlyer]

The class 170 on two engines was slow up the hill from Huddersfield to Marsden. On one engine they were utterly shambolic and were mostly caped at Huddersfield or Stalybridge due to the performance issue in that respect.

From a standing start the class 170s weren't much better than a class 158, when TPE had both fleets for a period before the 185's arrived.

 

[Bletchleyite]

So having worked out that they could come up with a potentially winning design for the TP DMU, you're saying Siemens should have thrown up their hands and said they're not going to because a Turbostar 'would be better'? I'm sorry but you're clearly living on another planet.

No, I'm saying that TPE selected the wrong bidder, or possibly set their criteria wrongly.

 

[BMIFlyer]

185101 will be in traffic on Monday. Unable to confirm the diagram yet however.

Next unit for the internal refurbishment is 185150.

 

[darloscott]

185101 will be in traffic on Monday. Unable to confirm the diagram yet however.

Next unit for the internal refurbishment is 185150.

185101 then 185150?
Does this suggest all of the 51 units may be staying in the fleet?...

 

[BMIFlyer]

185101 then 185150?
Does this suggest all of the 51 units may be staying in the fleet?...

All units (regardless of where they eventually end up) are being refurbished to the exact same standard.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

So if we caped 170s due to the performance over marsden why do we send single engined 185s across the hills?

 

[BMIFlyer]

So if we caped 170s due to the performance over marsden why do we send single engined 185s across the hills?

Because they can make it over the hills to (usually) return to Ardwick or York.

The 170 engines are awful power wise in comparison, running a unit on single engine over the hills usually made it overheat, hence why on occasion you would end up seeing the errant unit coupled up to a working unit - 3 engines ok out of 4 was doable.

The 170 didn't have the advantage of electrical cross feed so you would lose either head or tail lamps depending on which engine died if you let a single unit work on one engine only. Hence why they were fitted with an emergency headlamp in the tool cupboard.

 

[Philip]

185101 will be in traffic on Monday. Unable to confirm the diagram yet however.

Next unit for the internal refurbishment is 185150.

It'd be funny if it ends up on a Blackpool diagram!

 

[BMIFlyer]

It'd be funny if it ends up on a Blackpool diagram!

Shouldn't happen, as it will commence its working from York. I should probably think it will be on a York to Airport shuttle diagram or attached to another unit and sent to Liverpool.

 

[Philip]

Shouldn't happen, as it will commence its working from York. I should probably think it will be on a York to Airport shuttle diagram or attached to another unit and sent to Liverpool.

Just had a look at TRUST; the 185 booked to work the first Blackpool (05:27 from the Airport) starts off from York depot and works the 02:52 from there to the Airport. Perhaps they will deliberately not diagram it for this working, although I seem to remember 185108 ended up on a Blackpool working rather soon after it had been unveiled in silver.

 

[BMIFlyer]

Just had a look at TRUST; the 185 booked to work the first Blackpool (05:27 from the Airport) starts off from York depot and works the 02:52 from there to the Airport. Perhaps they will deliberately not diagram it for this working, although I seem to remember 185108 ended up on a Blackpool working rather soon after it had been unveiled in silver.

Yep, sorry I should have stated hopefully it will not be allocated onto a crossover diagram. I know that those in HQ are keen to showcase it on the main TPE network this week. So...

 

[ValleyLines142]

126 is also still old livery, just seen at Oxford Rd

This goes back to what I mentioned in Post #298, where photos of supposedly revinyled units have been uploaded but it isn't actually those units!

So, pending all uploads are accurate, we should be as follows:

185101, 185102, 185103, 185104, 185105, 185106, 185107, 185108, 185109, 185110, 185111, 185112, 185113, 185114, 185115, 185116, 185117, 185118, 185119, 185120, 185121, 185122, 185123, 185124, 185125, 185126, 185127, 185128, 185129, 185130, 185131, 185132, 185133, 185134, 185135, 185136, 185137, 185138, 185139, 185140, 185141, 185142, 185143, 185144, 185145, 185146, 185147, 185148, 185149, 185150, 185151.

 

[Philip]

This goes back to what I mentioned in Post #298, where photos of supposedly revinyled units have been uploaded but it isn't actually those units!

So, pending all uploads are accurate, we should be as follows:

185101, 185102, 185103, 185104, 185105, 185106, 185107, 185108, 185109, 185110, 185111, 185112, 185113, 185114, 185115, 185116, 185117, 185118, 185119, 185120, 185121, 185122, 185123, 185124, 185125, 185126, 185127, 185128, 185129, 185130, 185131, 185132, 185133, 185134, 185135, 185136, 185137, 185138, 185139, 185140, 185141, 185142, 185143, 185144, 185145, 185146, 185147, 185148, 185149, 185150, 185151.

My call that '110 would be the final unit to be done still looks on! It'll be in the vinyl shop next week now that I've said this...

 

[TC60054]

So if we caped 170s due to the performance over marsden why do we send single engined 185s across the hills?

The only time that I personally have seen a 185 running on only one engine, it was on a Hull service that was "looped" at Marsden to let the Liverpool past, terminated at Huddersfield and given a helping hand by the ex-Middlesbrough service behind it through to Piccadilly so that it could return to Ardwick.

 

[IanXC]

No, I'm saying that TPE selected the wrong bidder, or possibly set their criteria wrongly.

So the claim changes yet again eh!

As has been said by a number of people these units are eminently suitable for the route and are performing exactly as intended on a challenging route.

The fact that you don't like them is neither here nor there, and the sooner you accept that the better!

 

[Bletchleyite]

The fact that you don't like them is neither here nor there, and the sooner you accept that the better!

If people can't post their opinions, what is the point of having a discussion forum?

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Because they can make it over the hills to (usually) return to Ardwick or York.

Had one a few weeks ago. Wet and slippery tracks as it was raining on a 2 engined unit which drops to one at Guide bridge. Managed to get second engine fired up on the curve but had conked out again at stalybridge. "Keep going" came the call from control so up towards Diggle we went. 30mph we struggled to reach until inside standedge some 10 mins late. After that with the downhill run to Huddersfield she moved like the proverb until the second climb to morley tunnel lost a further 5 minutes and the service was caped at York.

Managed to push a 185 up to 88mph with just the rear engine on the ECML one new year's day. Came off York with 3 engines, lost one at thirsk and the second died at Thornaby on the way back - both no coolant. F&S out of Yarm we slipped and struggled up the bank into Northallerton where I disgorged the punters on to the following EC service just in case the final engine gave up. No flux capacitor was fitted but you could feel the heat coming through the saloon floor from that effort!

 

[Blindtraveler]

Makes you wonder if empty with akl 3 engines and a streight run what sort of speed they could do?

 

[driver9000]

Makes you wonder if empty with akl 3 engines and a streight run what sort of speed they could do?

100mph is reached in around 4 or 5 miles. You can't take full power until speed reaches 20mph.

 

[driver9000]

For those interested 185101 is out in service today and currently working 05:54 Middlesbrough to Manchester Airport due in at 08:40 which is then booked to work 08:55 to Cleethorpes.

 

[Blindtraveler]

For the first time in my entire life I wish I lived near Manchester

 

[Jamesrob637]

For the first time in my entire life I wish I lived near Manchester

It's really not a bad place to live in/near these days

 

[Clansman]

Noticed this has just been posted on Twitter.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's really not a bad place to live in/near these days

It wasn't years ago either, though in the 1990s it was a bit more dark and grimy than today

Noticed this has just been posted on Twitter.

That does look classy.