Blackpool - Manchester Electrification

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Are there any plans for extra tracks to be installed in-between Salford Crescent and Salford Central in future years to allow for improved express service patterns that may well ensue? In my youthful days in the early 1950's, there were quite a number of running lines in that particular area.

 

[snowball]

Where does that put the Salford Crescent-Salford Central/Orsdall Lane spurs then?

Both part of phase 4. Which like phase 5 (except for the Guide Bridge part of phase 5) is now supposed to finish before phase 3.

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Are there any plans for extra tracks to be installed in-between Salford Crescent and Salford Central in future years to allow for improved express service patterns that may well ensue? In my youthful days in the early 1950's, there were quite a number of running lines in that particular area.

None that I am aware of; it would require wholesale reconstruction of Salford Crescent station to do it (I have previously investigated this, would you believe).

That said, if you watch closely you might notice that the OLE structures on the East side of Crescent station all look a bit far away from the track, as if someone was leaving space for a third platform ...

Also, the TfGM scheme at Central appears (currently) to have five operational platform faces.
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Both part of phase 4. Which like phase 5 (except for the Guide Bridge part of phase 5) is now supposed to finish before phase 3.

Mostly. Phase 4 looks like it's going to deliver to Deal Street and Ordsall Lane Junctions exclusive, just some fascinating technical issues to resolve with the current designs and the inclusive bits first, let alone DC immunisation scope ...

 

[edwin_m]

I seem to remember there is space for an eastern platform at Salford Crescent, but its length is limited by a brick wall supporting the Manchester North signalling centre. I guess when this is replaced there may be scope for a full-length platform.

 

[Elecman]

Only if you demolish the entire equipment room, the signalling centre is the wooden shack at the Pendleton end of the building!

 

[edwin_m]

Only if you demolish the entire equipment room, the signalling centre is the wooden shack at the Pendleton end of the building!

Yes - depends if the interlocking is replaced or just re-controlled from somwhere else. Does anyone know what is intended for Manchester North?

 

[Senex]

Does anyone know why Salford Crescent took the form it did, with the single island platform and an up through line but no down through line, also with the marked speed differential between down and up? Given that they were starting with quite a lot of space available because of track simplification it all seems a little surprising. Or was it that this was a job done at a time when everything was being pared back as much as possible just to get it authorised, regardless of the fact that the planners could already expect problems in the future?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Does anyone know why Salford Crescent took the form it did, with the single island platform and an up through line but no down through line, also with the marked speed differential between down and up? Given that they were starting with quite a lot of space available because of track simplification it all seems a little surprising. Or was it that this was a job done at a time when everything was being pared back as much as possible just to get it authorised, regardless of the fact that the planners could already expect problems in the future?

There could have been another platform built on the other side where quite a wide width of available land occurs if viewed as being in the existing location, but even better, a four platform junction station should have been erected where the "V" of the line bifurcation occurs that sees lines going to Atherton and to Bolton.

 

[ianhr]

There could have been another platform built on the other side where quite a wide width of available land occurs if viewed as being in the existing location, but even better, a four platform junction station should have been erected where the "V" of the line bifurcation occurs that sees lines going to Atherton and to Bolton.

Agree with you Paul. A northbound island and a southbound island would have allowed easy cross platform interchange (for Victoria or Oxford Road/Piccadilly, and Bolton or Atherton going north) without the platforms becoming as crowded as they are now with the single platform. This would have been a genuine improvement in connectivity without sacrificing capacity. If the platforms were carefully positioned it might even have left space for flyovers or dive-unders for the junctions.

Also why not re-name it Salford University, the students must comprise most of the traffic apart from passengers changing trains. Salford Crescent is meaningless to anyone not intimately familiar with the area.

 

[snowball]

NR press release

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.c...ose-on-5-January-as-rebuild-resumes-2203.aspx

Broughton Road bridge in Salford will close to traffic on 5 January as work resumes to rebuild it as part of a £1bn investment to improve the railway in the north of England.

Network Rail temporarily reopened the bridge between Friday 19 December and Sunday 4 January 2015 to minimise the impact the closure had on local businesses over Christmas.

The closure is necessary to rebuild the bridge to accommodate overhead lines underneath as part of the electrification of the railway through the area.

A spokesman for Network Rail said: “The bridge replacement is an essential part of our work to electrify the railway which will help to provide a better service to passengers. There is never a good time to close roads and we do all we can to minimise the impact as much as possible. A diversion has been agreed with the local authority and a diversion will be clearly signposted. We apologise for any inconvenience caused.”

Once complete, the new bridge will not need any major work for over 100 years, providing additional benefits to the local road network. Electrification of the railway will provide faster and more frequent services, with more seats for passengers, and help support economic growth across the north west of England.

The bridge is due to reopen on 16 July 2015.

I'm not sure when the work started, I didn't see a press release at the time.

 

[edwin_m]

Agree with you Paul. A northbound island and a southbound island would have allowed easy cross platform interchange (for Victoria or Oxford Road/Piccadilly, and Bolton or Atherton going north) without the platforms becoming as crowded as they are now with the single platform. This would have been a genuine improvement in connectivity without sacrificing capacity. If the platforms were carefully positioned it might even have left space for flyovers or dive-unders for the junctions.

Moving it northwards was proposed a few years ago, though if it was north of the junction it would certainly not have had islands paired by direction. This idea seems to have been abandoned, possibly because the station would then have been inconveniently far from the main road so of little use to anyone other than the University.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Just to amplify the electrification progress at Salford Crescent:
- there are mast bases on all 3 legs being electrified (towards Victoria, Ordsall Lane and Bolton)
- there is at least one mast on the north west side of the station alongside Windsor Bridge North Jn.
- the bases towards Victoria run out alongside the stone terminal

I still have to travel on the Bolton-Ordsall Lane axis to see the full extent of the work, but it looks as though the messy bits through Salford Crescent are done.

 

[Darren R]

Does anyone know why Salford Crescent took the form it did......was it that this was a job done at a time when everything was being pared back as much as possible just to get it authorised, regardless of the fact that the planners could already expect problems in the future?

Bingo!

To be fair, I don't think anyone at the time could have predicted the station was to become as busy as it has done.

 

[L+Y]

Here's a question regarding Salford Crescent: why, on the new steps, are there "walls" but no roof? It's a long, wet run from the ticket office to the platforms now!

 

[WatcherZero]

There wasnt enough money in the NR project budget for the ramp to have a roof, TFGM insisted that NR leave passive provision for one to be add d in the future.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

There wasnt enough money in the NR project budget for the ramp to have a roof, TFGM insisted that NR leave passive provision for one to be added in the future.

What would the cost be for the roof to be added now that the success of this station has been recognised?

 

[Jonny]

Are there any plans for extra tracks to be installed in-between Salford Crescent and Salford Central in future years to allow for improved express service patterns that may well ensue? In my youthful days in the early 1950's, there were quite a number of running lines in that particular area.

Many of which are now sidings used by a well-served construction materials terminal...
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Agree with you Paul. A northbound island and a southbound island would have allowed easy cross platform interchange (for Victoria or Oxford Road/Piccadilly, and Bolton or Atherton going north) without the platforms becoming as crowded as they are now with the single platform. This would have been a genuine improvement in connectivity without sacrificing capacity. If the platforms were carefully positioned it might even have left space for flyovers or dive-unders for the junctions.

It's actually rather cosy as it is; the nearest points are almost at the north/down end of the platform so the options would be an additional single-face platform with only trains from Bolton able to reach it (and unable to turn back under current signalling and track arrangement) on the east/southbound/up through line or something else but with a massive (and probably very expensive) rebuild of the entire junction. Development also appears to be rather close to the line on the east/up side.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Many of which are now sidings used by a well-served construction materials terminal.

My reference was not to that area, but to the the land area on the left-hand side of the now-existing running lines where the engineering-brick retaining wall is currently situated.
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It's actually rather cosy as it is; the nearest points are almost at the north/down end of the platform so the options would be an additional single-face platform with only trains from Bolton able to reach it (and unable to turn back under current signalling and track arrangement) on the east/southbound/up through line or something else but with a massive (and probably very expensive) rebuild of the entire junction. Development also appears to be rather close to the line on the east/up side.

This is why I made my previous posting submission of a normal four-platform junction station built in the "V-area" of the running lines to both Atherton and Bolton.

 

[CAF397]

There's what looks like a site compound being constructed the Manchester side of Kearsley station, presumably this will be for the Farnworth Tunnel works. Plenty of Orange Army activity between the station and the compound today.

I've seen the mast bases at Wondsor Bridge South, that's good to see.

With regards to the Blackpool line, all the bridges have been rebuilt, and there are two with OLE support brackets fitted, from when the bridges were finished 12-18 months ago.

I'm up and down the line roughly weekly so I'll try to update anything I see that may be of interest.

 

[Inox]

Hiya

Are you talking about the bridge replacement activity between bolton and Euxton Jct?

I read this today:
http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/11710354.Traffic_chaos_warning_as_Orlando_Bridge_to_close_for_8_months/

It's an old knackered bridge that's had a weight restriction on it as long as i can remember - looks as if it's being replaced as part of the electrification. Doubt work required for clearance, but i think they've lumped in the work with the electrification of the line. The bridge is located just up from Bolton Station

 

[TheKnightWho]

Hiya

Are you talking about the bridge replacement activity between bolton and Euxton Jct?

I read this today:
http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/11710354.Traffic_chaos_warning_as_Orlando_Bridge_to_close_for_8_months/

It's an old knackered bridge that's had a weight restriction on it as long as i can remember - looks as if it's being replaced as part of the electrification. Doubt work required for clearance, but i think they've lumped in the work with the electrification of the line. The bridge is located just up from Bolton Station

The comments on that are quite amusing, if totally irrelevant.

 

[Inox]

It's Bolton for you mate. most of the comments are directed at how 'poor' the Bolton News journalism is. Lived there for 30 years and haven't looked back

What we keep seeing from them is TRAVEL CHAOS!!! due to the electrification moan moan moan. It's a poor rag as they miss the point entirely about what's trying to be achieved.


anyway back to topic.

 

[Hophead]

Well, yes, it's out of the special local paper thesaurus where you put in 'minor inconvenience' and it spits back 'chaos'.

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Hiya
It's an old knackered bridge that's had a weight restriction on it as long as i can remember - looks as if it's being replaced as part of the electrification. Doubt work required for clearance, but i think they've lumped in the work with the electrification of the line. The bridge is located just up from Bolton Station

Not for electrification as it is already clear. it's just part of Network Rail's normal business. It will fall down on its own in the medium term if nothing is done (one span is already propped from underneath). The new bridge design is co-ordinated with the electrification requirements and does not jeopardise the potential future platform 5 alignment.

From the article, which businesses do they mean? there aren't any between Manchester Road and Moncrieffe Street, and they'll need to leave the car park ramp open for access to site anyway. Journos :roll:
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With regards to the Blackpool line, all the bridges have been rebuilt, and there are two with OLE support brackets fitted, from when the bridges were finished 12-18 months ago.

I'm up and down the line roughly weekly so I'll try to update anything I see that may be of interest.

You won't see much else happen for at least 6 months!

 

[CAF397]

You won't see much else happen for at least 6 months!

I know, just posting some work that has already been undertaken.
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Farnworth Tunnel will be closed from Saturday 5th May to Monday 5th October 2015.

 

[Inox]

Hi

Just travelled back from manchester this afternoon and it appears concrete bases have been installed south of Salford Crescent half dozen or so over the points at windsor junction.

ta.
Dave.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Just travelled back from manchester this afternoon and it appears concrete bases have been installed south of Salford Crescent half dozen or so over the points at windsor junction.

Already noted on posts #537/#552 - they must have gone in over Christmas. Maybe there are more now?
Apart from those at Windsor Bridge South and towards Victoria there is also one at Windsor Bridge North.
And a foundation kit ("toilet seat" template + reinforcing rods) lying against the bank to the east of Salford Crescent P1.
(That was a week ago.)

 

[Inox]

i think you've already spotted them (post 537) sorry!

The ones i saw were on the left of the track shown here:
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/821136

There were four blokes in high viz standing and pondering one of them. Thought maybe it was more recent work, but i think you're right. old news.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I counted 17 bases today installed on the Up line from Windsor Bridge South Jn towards Salford Central, running out opposite the stone terminal.
Also on the Up, over most of the country sections from Lostock Jn to beyond Adlington the lineside has been prepared for mast foundations.
There are initial excavations (some of them in pairs) at regular intervals, ready for concreting.
The concreting train itself was parked at Edge Hill, so the work must still be being managed from there.
All good signs of progress.

 

[DJH1971]

Decided to pay another visit to Sankey Viaduct today.

Still no sign of the essential fourth mast I'm afraid.
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Oops

Posted in the wrong thread.