What happened to Request stops?

[Ian Hardy]

With that logic you could say that all bus stops should be compulsory stop as well, since buses need to keep to a timetable. But rarely used stops being only on request have their benefits - less stopping/starting needed (which, while minimal in its impact, does have its effects on the vehicle) plus delayed services can make up time without requiring authorisation to skip stops (which is worse for the passenger, who has to backtrack, and the operator, which has to pay out delay repay).

On London's Buses, all the request stops were changed to become compulsory stops a few years ago.

 

[cf111]

The train will still need to slow to stopping speed, it won't go through at line speed.

If nobody has pressed the button or asked the guard for a request stop on the Far North Line then the train sails through at line-speed.

What happens once you press the button?

There's a display in the cab that tells the driver they need to stop at Scotscalder/Invershin/Culrain etc.

It doesn't interact with the signalling as the RETB system means that at these request stops there isn't any infrastructure, so no stop boards or TPWS installations. The exception might be Rogart where if the driver doesn't have the long-section token for Lairg-Brora the train will have to stop to cross/exchange tokens.

As an aside I think the totem at Altnabraec has been installed now, I passed through today and am sure I caught a glimpse of it.

 

[thenorthern]

I thought the onus was on the train driver to look for anybody on the platform?

The "official" guidance from National Rail is "To board, please give a clear hand signal to the driver as the train approaches." this is a screenshot from National Rail. This is a screenshot for Braystones on the National Rail website.

 

[Ashley Hill]

I tell people who get off at request stops to treat it like a bus when you return, stand where you can be seen and stick your arm out. And it will only stop if it is timetabled to stop there. I`ve dealt with request stops for nearly 40yrs and have had hardly any issues with them. If you cant remember what passengers you have on board then stop anyway.
The good thing about request stops is that if you are running late and nobody wants to join or alight you make up time by not stopping.

 

[izvor]

Can't believe this thread has gone to 3 pages in just 8 hours!

 

[JWK]

I’m not entirely sure why the rather over-engineered approach of sending radio messages to the train needed to be adopted for the Far North Line, when the much more simple ‘push button illuminates a signal just in advance of the station’ system has been used in Switzerland (normally two flashing lights on a white diamond sign with a black stripe across the middle) and other places for many decades - doesn’t need to be interlinked with the safety-critical signalling at all, just a very basic light switch (albeit with some sort of cancelling system for after the train has passed).
Unfortunately, I can’t immediately find a picture of one of these signals, so will have to make do with my favourite even more low-tech request stop system - a semaphore for getting the steamer to stop at request piers on Lake Mälaren in Stockholm, as demonstrated by my wife.

 

[Djgr]

In this part of Wales the local MS petitioned to have the ones on the North Wales Coast in her constituency removed, and was successful.

They're confusing for non-regular, and ultimately pointless in the modern era (I assume their very existence is a relic of a long gone time where there may have been a reason not to stop)

Plenty on the Blaenau Ffestiniog - Llandudno line...and also Hawarden Bridge on the Borderlands

 

[edwin_m]

Don't know much about Danish or Swiss railways but I've never encountered anything on German railways that enables you to board a train at a request stop by any means other than making your presence obvious and sticking your hand out (ie no buttons on the platform etc).

I've seen a light on a pole on the Karlsruhe tram-train network marked "Stadtbahn Haltewunsch".

 

[35B]

There aren’t all that many stops that aren’t either Token Exchange Points (where the driver has to stop for the unitiated) or protecting some sort of level crossing/bridge on the West Highland Line. Locheilside, Lochailort, Roy Bridge, Loch Awe & Falls of Cruachan are the only ones.

Ardlui, Connel Ferry, Dalmally, Corrour, Loch Eli Outward Bound & Arisaig are Intermediate Token Exchange Points, which allow for the possibility of them being passed through at line speed if a Long Setion time is issued

That didn’t stop Rogart (a passing loop on the Far North) being timetabled as a request stop.

 

[The exile]

I've seen a light on a pole on the Karlsruhe tram-train network marked "Stadtbahn Haltewunsch".

If it exists anywhere it’s going to be on a system like that. Be interesting to know whether it was on one of the sections operated under railway regulations or one of the bits under tramway rules (which isn’t just the urban bits).

 

[43096]

Quite. There'll be a reason most request stops also have no ticket machine, so why would you to put in a far more complicated machine in that has to interact with signalling? When that goes wrong...

Why does it have to interact with the signalling? It’s as simple as having a “do not stop at station” indicator (so it is fail safe if the system fails) - nothing to do with the signalling.

All feels like a solution looking for a problem to me!

Yet it works reliably on the Rhätische Bahn in Switzerland.

 

[The Planner]

To stop only when necessary. Say we have a branch line of 11 stops, 10 en-route, all on request only. The train company knows the train stops at an average of 4/10 stops. It can timetable accordingly and occasionally a train will stop at more than average and be a few minutes behind, or a few minutes early and stop at less than average. It allows a faster service without having to add time into the timetable to stop at every halt on the line.

Germany and Switzerland have long stretches of stations more lightly used than here in the UK, so over there it's a bit more justified but Scotland and Wales especially would benefit. England not so much due to its much higher density meaning where it's only one or two halts on a route and not every station on a route being a halt.

What normally happens is that adjustment time will be added at the open stops to cover request stops and you wait time.

For timetabling purposes, a request stop has to be treated as a normal stop, so it may lead to timetabling issues.

Not quite. Its usually a stop with no dwell.

 

[edwin_m]

If it exists anywhere it’s going to be on a system like that. Be interesting to know whether it was on one of the sections operated under railway regulations or one of the bits under tramway rules (which isn’t just the urban bits).

I think it was right on the transition from tramway to railway - which probably doesn't help much with your question...

I’m not entirely sure why the rather over-engineered approach of sending radio messages to the train needed to be adopted for the Far North Line, when the much more simple ‘push button illuminates a signal just in advance of the station’ system has been used in Switzerland (normally two flashing lights on a white diamond sign with a black stripe across the middle) and other places for many decades - doesn’t need to be interlinked with the safety-critical signalling at all, just a very basic light switch (albeit with some sort of cancelling system for after the train has passed).
Unfortunately, I can’t immediately find a picture of one of these signals, so will have to make do with my favourite even more low-tech request stop system - a semaphore for getting the steamer to stop at request piers on Lake Mälaren in Stockholm, as demonstrated by my wife.

Providing any equipment at trackside is likely to be very costly, especially if there is no existing cable route that can be used. Rather like how the economics of mobile phones are likely to make landlines obsolete, but even more so given the complications of working on and around the track.

 

[styles]

ScotRail have the request to stop machines on the Far North Line (Inverness to Thurso/Wick) request stop stations.

Not at Altnabreac

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Feb 2026 ==

I don't think they have. As I understand it all the Far North request stops now have RTS buttons except for Altnabreac, where you still have to stick your arm out like you do for a bus or taxi. (You could say it's as easy as ABC)

Network Rail were to have installed them at Altnabreac in April 2023. The reasons they were unsuccessful have been thoroughly documented in another discussion here

They were planned for it, but it seems like they never actually made it.

 

[Western Lord]

On London's Buses, all the request stops were changed to become compulsory stops a few years ago.

Did they change all the request stop signs, which were red with a white roundel rather than white with a red roundel for compulsory stops?

 

[Krokodil]

it’s that sticking your hand out (or informing a guard) is an old fashioned way of doing things

Nothing wrong with that. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

which doesn’t take into account scenarios where you can’t stick out your hand

Such as?

or if you can’t find a guard on the train in time

If the guard hasn't made their way through, they will stop anyway.

 

[birchesgreen]

Such as?

If you have escaped a kidnapper and have your hands tied behind your back.

 

[godfreycomplex]

That didn’t stop Rogart (a passing loop on the Far North) being timetabled as a request stop.

Rogart loop was secured out of use for a good while I believe

 

[Tetchytyke]

On London's Buses, all the request stops were changed to become compulsory stops a few years ago.

Other way around- they did away with compulsory stops because they found that, in practice, everyone was already treating them as request stops.

Did they change all the request stop signs, which were red with a white roundel rather than white with a red roundel for compulsory stops?

They kept the compulsory flag (white on red) for all bus stops, but made them request stops.

Its interesting that throughout most of England request stops are being removed but in Devon and Cornwall Great Western Railway still serve many request stops on the branch lines.

Request stops only really make sense in extremely rural locations where, chances are, nobody will want to board or alight the train.

In the north west a lot of request stops have gone but, to be quite honest, a good chunk of them should never have been request stops anyway. Having places like Aspatria or Dalston (on the Carlisle-Workington line) as request stops never made sense because there was always someone waiting to get on or get off. Same with all the request stops in east Lancashire on the Preston-Colne line.

 

[VT 390]

Request stops only really make sense in extremely rural locations where, chances are, nobody will want to board or alight the train.

In the north west a lot of request stops have gone but, to be quite honest, a good chunk of them should never have been request stops anyway. Having places like Aspatria or Dalston (on the Carlisle-Workington line) as request stops never made sense because there was always someone waiting to get on or get off. Same with all the request stops in east Lancashire on the Preston-Colne line.

I agree request stops do not make sense where services will usually be stopping for someone.
I just find it strange GWR still have so many as while they make sense on routes line the Looe branch on other routes like the Newquay branch I have never been on a service that skips Bugle or St Columb Road, not saying it doesn't happen. Some of the more well used GWR request stops could do with becoming compulsory stops (similar to Copplestone).

 

[35B]

Rogart loop was secured out of use for a good while I believe

It was in use at that time; staying locally, I used both platforms

 

[Cell2025]

Nothing wrong with that. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.


Such as?


If the guard hasn't made their way through, they will stop anyway.

If people can't stick out their hand or are in some way impaired from seeing/hearing the train.

Someone above said that trains will slow down anyway, especially, I presume, in cases where the approach is curved or otherwise obscure in some way.

 

[Craig1122]

Something no one has mentioned yet as a reason they were established is the cost of stopping. There is a figure for each stop which is a combination of fuel and brake wear. I did see an actual number years ago but can't remember what it was but it was surprisingly high when set against the minimal revenue many of the stations generate. I would imagine the switch to disc brakes and greater efficiency in modern units mean that number has dropped in real terms.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Nothing wrong with that. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

If the sightlines approaching the station are poor (such as southbound at Altnabreac), then having advance warning of whether someone wants the train to stop can allow the train to maintain speed if there isn't. Particulary helpful in saving fuel if, as in that case, the station is on a rising gradient.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Feb 2026 ==

What happens once you press the button?

A radio signal is sent (either direct to the train or via the signalling centre, I'm not sure) to cause an indication in the driver's cab

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Feb 2026 ==

I’m not entirely sure why the rather over-engineered approach of sending radio messages to the train needed to be adopted for the Far North Line, when the much more simple ‘push button illuminates a signal just in advance of the station’ system has been used in Switzerland (normally two flashing lights on a white diamond sign with a black stripe across the middle) and other places for many decades - doesn’t need to be interlinked with the safety-critical signalling at all, just a very basic light switch (albeit with some sort of cancelling system for after the train has passed).

Power may be an issue. A solar panel with battery storage is probably sufficient for a radio signal plus the push button kiosk. Supplying signals in both directions, visible at sighting distance (plus the cabling to reach them) starts to get expensive. One of the issues at Altnabreac was that the electricty supply was not sufficient even for the RTS system, and the access required to install a beefier one was obstructed.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Scotrail's website says anyone boarding at a request stop must press the magic button five minutes prior to the arrival of the train, and that if it is pressed less than five minutes before arrival the train "will NOT stop". Is that what happens in practice?

 

[godfreycomplex]

It was in use at that time; staying locally, I used both platforms

Ah well

 

[chris53]

Also by their very nature, they are not well patronised stations - perhaps just a few passengers each day and probably focussed around certain periods - so the cost/benefit ratio will be very low as opposed to the "Do Nothing" approach which seems to work broadly fine.

I remember Conwy and Llanfairfechan both being request stops but when I used them regularly between 2004 and 2009 almost every train stopped there due to someone getting on or off so it seemed a pointless excercise maintaining it as a request stop

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Feb 2026 ==

The "official" guidance from National Rail is "To board, please give a clear hand signal to the driver as the train approaches." this is a screenshot from National Rail. This is a screenshot for Braystones on the National Rail website.

Not wishing to be awkward but what if you are unable to give a hand signal due to some sort of disability?

 

[cf111]

I’m not entirely sure why the rather over-engineered approach of sending radio messages to the train needed to be adopted for the Far North Line, when the much more simple ‘push button illuminates a signal just in advance of the station’ system has been used in Switzerland (normally two flashing lights on a white diamond sign with a black stripe across the middle) and other places for many decades - doesn’t need to be interlinked with the safety-critical signalling at all, just a very basic light switch (albeit with some sort of cancelling system for after the train has passed).
Unfortunately, I can’t immediately find a picture of one of these signals, so will have to make do with my favourite even more low-tech request stop system - a semaphore for getting the steamer to stop at request piers on Lake Mälaren in Stockholm, as demonstrated by my wife.

The signalling system is based on radio messages, adding lights on poles would actually result in more engineering rather than piggybacking on the RETB system which has worked for decades.

 

[Krokodil]

Not wishing to be awkward but what if you are unable to give a hand signal due to some sort of disability?

Might you also have trouble with pressing a button at least five minutes before departure? We're getting into "RUK Standard Minority" territory here, I think.

 

[chris53]

Might you also have trouble with pressing a button at least five minutes before departure? We're getting into "RUK Standard Minority" territory here, I think.

No idea what that means. Thought I was raising a perfectly legitimate point. I do actually have a friend who has no arms, he uses public transport a great deal though happily doesn't have to deal with any request stops