TfW 175 shortages

[Fletcj10]

Probably complete rubbish however…. if Chiltern are struggling for parts with it’s 165 fleet meaning they are looking to take the 175s to replace them

What about GWR taking the 165s from Chiltern (i’ve not heard they are struggling with parts like Chiltern)

If GWR took them could they then not replace ageing Sprinter Stock on either Devon services or even West of England and with all the sprinter stock going off lease (except 158s)

Could the 158s then go northern to replace their Sprinter stock?

I don’t know if this makes sense my mind says yes but i don’t know realistically if it would but 3 companies benefit from some simple cascades?

 

[craigybagel]

This is all probably best moved to the class 175 speculation thread at this point as it has little to do with the current situation at TfW....

 

[Fletcj10]

This is all probably best moved to the class 175 speculation thread at this point as it has little to do with the current situation at TfW....

Right O! Will Copy And Paste thank you

 

[Jez]

An increase in 175s in service today compared to yesterday with 8 in service.

001 and 009 - 2 cars and 102, 103, 105, 108, 110, 114 - 3 cars.

One turned up on a Llandudno-Manchester Airport (102) and Ebbw Vale (009). The rest on Holyhead to South Wales and Manchester-West Wales.

 

[Bevan Price]

An increase in 175s in service today compared to yesterday with 8 in service.

001 and 009 - 2 cars and 102, 103, 105, 108, 110, 114 - 3 cars.

One turned up on a Llandudno-Manchester Airport (102) and Ebbw Vale (009). The rest on Holyhead to South Wales and Manchester-West Wales.

Also 175.106 worked an e.c.s. from Chester to Longsight this morning.

 

[Wolfie]

Probably complete rubbish however…. if Chiltern are struggling for parts with it’s 165 fleet meaning they are looking to take the 175s to replace them

What about GWR taking the 165s from Chiltern (i’ve not heard they are struggling with parts like Chiltern)

If GWR took them could they then not replace ageing Sprinter Stock on either Devon services or even West of England and with all the sprinter stock going off lease (except 158s)

Could the 158s then go northern to replace their Sprinter stock?

I don’t know if this makes sense my mind says yes but i don’t know realistically if it would but 3 companies benefit from some simple cascades?

I asked the question about GWR and was told (can't find it) that they were equally struggling to get obsolescent if not obsolete electronic parts.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I asked the question about GWR and was told (can't find it) that they were equally struggling to get obsolescent if not obsolete electronic parts.

It would certainly seem very odd if Chiltern were struggling for parts but GWR weren't.

 

[Wolfie]

It would certainly seem very odd if Chiltern were struggling for parts but GWR weren't.

Found it - see post #159

Chiltern electrification alternatives being studied...

There's nothing saying Chiltern have to take every Class 175 or none of them. Indeed not, but they're an option - and the presence of them in the franchise agreement makes it clear they are a serious option - to replace both the LHCS and some of the 165s, with others being cut up for parts to...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Dan G]

... though GWR are now, apparently, on top of those issues

 

[Jez]

I see the Shrewsbury-Crewe stopper is a 3 car 175 today. That's almost as rare as one turning up on the Heart of Wales Line!

Seems to be 10 of the 175s in service today. 2 x 2 car and 8 x 3 car.

 

[390112A]

The current site at Chester as people cram on to the 2*153 Cardiff to Holyhead.

Don’t think I would fancy this trip.

 

[Andy Pacer]

The current site at Chester as people cram on to the 2*153 Cardiff to Holyhead.

Don’t think I would fancy this trip.

Does 2x 153 have more seats than a 2 car 175 out of interest?

 

[390112A]

According to the TFW fleet guide a two car 175 has 122 seats and 2*153 would have 2*56 = 112 seats so no

(also further comparing a 158 has 134 seats)

 

[Topological]

For completeness what are the current capacities of the 150s that they like to give us in lieu of the proper service?

With the 153 allowance has to be made for one of them having the accessible toilet. That takes up a lot of space. Always feels like the 153 pairing has more space than the 150 on the Manchester trains though.

 

[pokemonsuper9]

For completeness what are the current capacities of the 150s that they like to give us in lieu of the proper service?

With the 153 allowance has to be made for one of them having the accessible toilet. That takes up a lot of space. Always feels like the 153 pairing has more space than the 150 on the Manchester trains though.

Source: TfW Fleet Guide (it's great, if only a slight bit inaccurate)
Including the "additional tip-up" seats.

Train -------- Seats
150 ----------> 144
Double 153 -> 110
158 ---------> 134
2 car 175 ---> 128
2 car 197 ----> 121

 

[Topological]

150 = 108 + 36 tip up.

That fits closer to my experience of the line, the 150 really feels like it has less seats than a 2 car 175.

Admittedly the 153 pair at 112 + 6 tip up is lower than I thought. That must be having the doors at the ends which messes with my perception.

Either way the service needed the 175/1s and none of the substitutes comes close to that. We are really waiting on the 197s.

 

[Anonymous10]

150 = 108 + 36 tip up.

That fits closer to my experience of the line, the 150 really feels like it has less seats than a 2 car 175.

Admittedly the 153 pair at 112 + 6 tip up is lower than I thought. That must be having the doors at the ends which messes with my perception.

Either way the service needed the 175/1s and none of the substitutes comes close to that. We are really waiting on the 197s.

Where are the 36 tip ups on a class 150 not noticed that many on a tfw example post refurb.

 

[Topological]

Where are the 36 tip ups on a class 150 not noticed that many on a tfw example post refurb.

It is from the fleet guide. I cannot think where they are and I use the 150s too often.

 

[Anonymous10]

It is from the fleet guide. I cannot think where they are and I use the 150s too often.

I wonder if its not been updated since before the tfw refurb

 

[Caaardiff]

Realtime Trains | 5Z75 1740 Chester to Holyhead | 19/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 5Z75 1740 departure from Chester to Holyhead on 19/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

It seems 175001, 175112 and 175116 have moved ECS from Chester - Holyhead. More reliability issues and being put into storage?

 

[Bob Price]

Realtime Trains | 5Z75 1740 Chester to Holyhead | 19/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 5Z75 1740 departure from Chester to Holyhead on 19/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

It seems 175001, 175112 and 175116 have moved ECS from Chester - Holyhead. More reliability issues and being put into storage?

A number of new 197's are being sent to Chester so it may be to make room. Is Holyhead a fueling point? Could they operate from there or is it just stabling.

 

[Andrew*Debbie]

Source: TfW Fleet Guide (it's great, if only a slight bit inaccurate)
Including the "additional tip-up" seats.

Train -------- Seats
150 ----------> 144
Double 153 -> 110
158 ---------> 134
2 car 175 ---> 128
2 car 197 ----> 121

I had a miserable ride on ex Northern 150270 with 2+3 seating. Has to be more seats then the rest of the 150 fleet. TfW must be desperate to put that into long distance service.

 

[Jez]

I had a miserable ride on ex Northern 150270 with 2+3 seating. Has to be more seats then the rest of the 150 fleet. TfW must be desperate to put that into long distance service.

I saw a Northern 150 was allocated to one long distance diagram too. Apparently operationally they are just allocated as a 150 so its totally random which route it ends up on. But you would think they would keep them off the Manchester route, given its long distance and possible confusion at Manchester given Northern operate so many services out of there.

Going back to the 175s and I see there are about 7 in service yet again today. Is there any plan to bring anymore back to service or is this pretty much the plan now until they get withdrawn? Given TFW said recently almost all were back in service that doesnt seem to be the case. Infact the availability is still very poor.

 

[childwallblues]

Yesterday I travelled on the 0920 all stations from Crewe to Shrewsbury and the 1419 again all stations return. The unit was 175009.

 

[Topological]

Back of another inadequate 150. Seemed to be various things falling over from Manchester so it is something that the TfW ran, but it should not be like this.

The TfW 150s are nice enough, but 4 hours 40 on a route that needs 3 carriages minimum is not good.

 

[childwallblues]

Back of another inadequate 150. Seemed to be various things falling over from Manchester so it is something that the TfW ran, but it should not be like this.

The TfW 150s are nice enough, but 4 hours 40 on a route that needs 3 carriages minimum is not good.

On Tuesday at Shrewsbury I noted 150240/58/59/64 all on Marches Line services whilst 153362/968 were paired with a 158 on Birmingham Internationals.

 

[FrodshamJnct]

Just got on a 175 bound for Chester for the first time in a long time. 175110.

Edit - it’s being taken off 1D32 at Chester and replaced by a 197. The guard made an announcement stating that this is due to the train being “very poorly”.

 

[Anonymous10]

Just got on a 175 bound for Chester for the first time in a long time. 175110.

Edit - it’s being taken off 1D32 at Chester and replaced by a 197. The guard made an announcement stating that this is due to the train being “very poorly”.

Not great news but glad the 197s are coming into their own.

 

[Jez]

Just got on a 175 bound for Chester for the first time in a long time. 175110.

Edit - it’s being taken off 1D32 at Chester and replaced by a 197. The guard made an announcement stating that this is due to the train being “very poorly”.

Blimey, so even the ones actually in service arent doing great.

At least the 197s can work the majority of the services in North Wales (aside from those linked to Cambrian but they can still be swapped)

 

[Wyrleybart]

Blimey, so even the ones actually in service arent doing great.

Not really surprised Jez. We know the 175s are being handed back, and are late handed back because of delay delivering the 197s. Would you be lashing out much cash on 175s which should have been toast months ago ?

TfW are continuing to suffer huge growing pains and I do feel for them in a way, probably because they are the devolved government with the most diverse portfolio of rolling stock in their marketplace. Hopefully six months from now once the 2023 tourist season is over, the 170s and 175s are gone, maybe the LHCS has settled down and the Cardiff tramtrain stuff is forging ahead - just maybe things will be better.