TfGM Bee Network - fleet discussion

[Class 466]

There’s two or three having full engine rebuilds and another having its axles and suspension totally replaced, plus a couple of scania’s that look ‘dead’ with bits being removed to aid others running.

Interesting - I guess GNW still need them in good nick for their future use in East Yorkshire/North East

 

[darylyates17]

Interesting - I guess GNW still need them in good nick for their future use in East Yorkshire/North East

Are Go Ahead getting all of their loans back? I thought TfGM owned them all now.

 

[Class 466]

Are Go Ahead getting all of their loans back? I thought TfGM owned them all now.

TFGM don't own the B9TL Geminis in Go North West Livery. They have only ever been medium term loans to cover late delivery of new vehicles.

 

[Russel]

TFGM don't own the B9TL Geminis in Go North West Livery. They have only ever been medium term loans to cover late delivery of new vehicles.

I'm losing track of what is happening; are these the ex-First B9TLs?

Are they off to Go North East or East Yorkshire once the loan is over in Manchester?

 

[darylyates17]

TFGM don't own the B9TL Geminis in Go North West Livery. They have only ever been medium term loans to cover late delivery of new vehicles.

Looks like I was correct first time so just the Scanias and B5s then.

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I'm losing track of what is happening; are these the ex-First B9TLs?

Are they off to Go North East or East Yorkshire once the loan is over in Manchester?

Correct, they are the ex First batch. It's possible they could end up at both East Yorkshire and North East.

 

[Class 466]

Looks like I was correct first time so just the Scanias and B5s then.

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Correct they are the ex First batch its possible they could end up at both East Yorkshire and North East.

Just as a point of clarity they’re not vehicles that were with First up until 23 March 2024 - those B9s at Oldham all left Manchester overnight pretty much. The B9s still in the city transferred to Go Ahead with the Queens Road Depot sale in June 2019 and then went on Loan to Stagecoach from 24 March 2024.

 

[978wta]

Have any more new buses been delivered to Queens Road recently? Most if not all have gone to Stagecoach south Manchester in recent months.

 

[Class 466]

Have any more new buses been delivered to Queens Road recently? Most if not all have gone to Stagecoach south Manchester in recent months.

Beyond the Mellor Strata’s, nope. Big vehicle shortage in South Manchester as it stands

 

[KendalKing]

I'm losing track of what is happening;

Me too

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Big vehicle shortage in South Manchester as it stands

How come there such a vehicle shortage since the start of the Bee Network.

 

[dodecahedron67]

Me too

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How come there such a vehicle shortage since the start of the Bee Network.

First & Transdev took pretty much all their vehicles with them when they lost Oldham/Rochdale respectively - unlike Diamond and GNW who at least sold some of their old buses to TfGM.

Stagecoach having to find all the allocation to run Oldham when they hadn’t ‘lost’ a depot yet means buses have to be dragged in from everywhere and anywhere. (And same for GNW running Bolton in T1, before they lost QR)

It will probably ease up with Metroline coming in for T3

 

[darylyates17]

Ah yes, 21426 is still due from Egypt!

Thought the Evoras were built at Ely. Are they all from Egypt now?

 

[jeffery9098]

Thought the Evoras were built at Ely. Are they all from Egypt now?

Yes, they don't have factories in the UK. The buses themselves get registered such as license plates by the chassis manufacturer 'head office location' e.g. Volvo. Usually, if an Evora gets ordered in England... They would carry the Birmingham license plates so BV, BJ, BD, etc... because Volvo Bus and & Coach's Sales Centre is 'not centre' but the sales centre which is in Coventry, the license plate two first letters will carry out where registered... Scotland is the same as well as their other sales centre is in Scotland which carries out SJ, etc.. and London is pretty much the same....

 

[cnjb8]

Thought the Evoras were built at Ely. Are they all from Egypt now?

All MCV products for the UK are built in Egypt, MCV have an operations base in Ely though

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Me too

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How come there such a vehicle shortage since the start of the Bee Network.

First & Transdev took pretty much all their vehicles with them when they lost Oldham/Rochdale respectively - unlike Diamond and GNW who at least sold some of their old buses to TfGM.

Stagecoach having to find all the allocation to run Oldham when they hadn’t ‘lost’ a depot yet means buses have to be dragged in from everywhere and anywhere. (And same for GNW running Bolton in T1, before they lost QR)

It will probably ease up with Metroline coming in for T3

Things in South Manchester will probably also improve when the new BZLs arrive at Stockport

 

[47550]

Things in South Manchester will probably also improve when the new BZLs arrive at Stockport

When will that be though ? As I understand it, the new depot needs to be built first and that’s a long way off ?

 

[cnjb8]

When will that be though ? As I understand it, the new depot needs to be built first and that’s a long way off ?

I'm not sure but BZL production is delayed right now which has been affecting other operators too

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Things in South Manchester will probably also improve when the new BZLs arrive at Stockport

Are there any particular South Manchester routes that are currently affected?

 

[Redmike]

Worth noting also that a few E400 MMCs have been moved to other Stagecoach subsidiaries which in turn has led to new Bee Network vehicles taking their place at depots like Stockport and Hyde Rd.

 

[jeffery9098]

Worth noting also that a few E400 MMCs have been moved to other Stagecoach subsidiaries which in turn has led to new Bee Network vehicles taking their place at depots like Stockport and Hyde Rd.

Would likely show some indications that the Volvo BZL are expected soon if they are already relocating vehicles outside of SC Manchester

 

[47550]

Would likely show some indications that the Volvo BZL are expected soon if they are already relocating vehicles outside of SC Manchester

But the new depot needs to be built before the BZL’s arrive ?

 

[mayneway]

Just as a point of clarity they’re not vehicles that were with First up until 23 March 2024 - those B9s at Oldham all left Manchester overnight pretty much. The B9s still in the city transferred to Go Ahead with the Queens Road Depot sale in June 2019 and then went on Loan to Stagecoach from 24 March 2024.

I believe the B9’s were originally on loan but given the amount of time and money stagecoach are spending on them I’m not so sure they will return to Go Ahead. They were constantly ‘patched up’ at GNW, stagecoach are actually putting them right.
I will try and ask tomorrow and find out for sure.

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Beyond the Mellor Strata’s, nope. Big vehicle shortage in South Manchester as it stands

Believe there’s one more Evora due for queens road. The last Mellor arrived yesterday.

There’s apparently several 24 plate MMC E400’s in the rear yard at Hyde road yet to enter service.

 

[jeffery9098]

But the new depot needs to be built before the BZL’s arrive ?

Why would a new depot be built when they can simply add chargers in stockport!?

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Beyond the Mellor Strata’s, nope. Big vehicle shortage in South Manchester as it stands

Could you explain thoroughly on how there is an big vehicle shortage in the south

 

[Leedsbusman]

Why would a new depot be built when they can simply add chargers in stockport!?

it’s highly unlikely to be cost effective to electrify the old depot while you wait for the new one to be built.

 

[Mollman]

it’s highly unlikely to be cost effective to electrify the old depot while you wait for the new one to be built.

I think a few of us were not aware that a new depot was being built. Do you have any more information on it?

 

[mangad]

I think a few of us were not aware that a new depot was being built. Do you have any more information on it?

Stockport ambulance station is planned to move to the site of the Hazel Grove Park and Ride (as announced last year). And this has been mentioned by some as a new location for the bus depot. Although looking at the satellite imagery of the ambulance site, and comparing it to the size of land used by the existing two depot buildings, it feels like they'd need a good chunk of the surrounding land to make it fit.

Edit: this article talks about the bus garage going to Travis Brow as part of the plan.

 

[mayneway]

I think a few of us were not aware that a new depot was being built. Do you have any more information on it?

Pretty sure Stockport council bought daw bank depot a few years ago with plans to redevelop the whole area. They acquired some of the adjacent buildings and land too.
Part of the deal was providing stagecoach with another site to build a modern depot.

 

[Mollman]

Stockport ambulance station is planned to move to the site of the Hazel Grove Park and Ride (as announced last year). And this has been mentioned by some as a new location for the bus depot. Although looking at the satellite imagery of the ambulance site, and comparing it to the size of land used by the existing two depot buildings, it feels like they'd need a good chunk of the surrounding land to make it fit.

Edit: this article talks about the bus garage going to Travis Brow as part of the plan.

Ok, thanks

 

[Class 466]

I believe the B9’s were originally on loan but given the amount of time and money stagecoach are spending on them I’m not so sure they will return to Go Ahead. They were constantly ‘patched up’ at GNW, stagecoach are actually putting them right.
I will try and ask tomorrow and find out for sure.

Did you manage to find anything out?

 

[mayneway]

Did you manage to find anything out?

All I was told was the cost of bringing them upto ‘fleet standard’ was being shared between Stagecoach and TFGM.
I will try and ask tomorrow.

 

[Man of Kent]

Part of the deal was providing stagecoach with another site to build a modern depot.

Although there is no sign of a planning applicaton for a depot on the Stockport Council website.

 

[Class 466]

All I was told was the cost of bringing them upto ‘fleet standard’ was being shared between Stagecoach and TFGM.
I will try and ask tomorrow.

That's certainly interesting - Makes you wonder if the talk of them being transferred to Hyde Road ahead of the transfer to Metroline has some truth in it.