SWT 158 & 159 Refurbishments

[Helvellyn]

159108 has just come back from C6 with 105 to go next

Is 105 the last 159/1 to get done? If so I guess it will be the 158s next.

I also notice that the recent returns have has the ex Anglia First Class seating replaced with the same type as used on the 158s and 159/0s. I assume Porterbrook have supplied these seats from ex GWR TFs that were converted to TSs.

As an aside, as much as I like the IC70 seating it's a shame EMT couldn't get their hands on those surplus Gammer seats to use in their HST TFs and TRFBs. More than enough vehicles were converted by GWR that EMT should be able to do that.

 

[159depotdriver]

Hi yes she is the last of the 159/1 and then apparently yes the 158s are next

 

[M7R]

Good job the 158s are up next, I was on the lymington shuttle twice over the last week and the 158 that was on (the same one both times) was looking very tatty inside, seat cushions with the covers hanging off, and generally a bit thread bare in places. (The 444s we were on was looking very thread bare as well on the seat cushions).

And I know this won't please many on here but I prefer the seats in the EMT 158s back home, more support, slightly higher seat height and didn't make you slouch in the seat, but I will leave that there so as to not drag the topic off track.

 

[159depotdriver]

159105 the last 159/1 left for c6 this morning

 

[387star]

Have the 159/0 been done?

What is the final livery being settled on?

Has the manual door to first class been removed?

 

[Kite159]

Have the 159/0 been done?

What is the final livery being settled on?

Has the manual door to first class been removed?

159/1s are the only ones so far to have visited Loughborough, and as 159depotdriver mentioned earlier it appears the 158s are next, then I assume the 159/0s will be last

From what I've noticed, it was only the first two units coming back which had the "teeth", all the others have been in the other new livery

Yep, the door between standard & first has been removed, probably to the delight of the catering trolley staff

 

[159depotdriver]

Hi yes it's only 102 and 103 with the teeth (the twins) as we call them and yes door removed. I took 105 off depot myself and yes definitely 158s next

 

[Harbornite]

Hi yes it's only 102 and 103 with the teeth (the twins) as we call them and yes door removed. I took 105 off depot myself and yes definitely 158s next

I got a pic of 159105 at Barnt Green near Birmingham, I'll share it on here later.

 

[159depotdriver]

That would be great

 

[Kite159]

Sorry to bump an oldish thread, but is there any news how far the 158s are coming along getting the "post 2020" treatment?

I've seen a few of the 158s running around in the new style livery.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Mention on Facebook earlier in the week thet 884 was back from its holidays.

It amazes me that these are not coming back with USB sockets throughout. Quite surprising really.

 

[Suraggu]

Mention on Facebook earlier in the week thet 884 was back from its holidays.

It amazes me that these are not coming back with USB sockets throughout. Quite surprising really.

That does not start until First/MTR takeover in August (Even that date may change). SWT have no franchise agreement about fitting USB charging ports.

 

[MatthewRead]

That does not start until First/MTR takeover in August (Even that date may change). SWT have no franchise agreement about fitting USB charging ports.

I've heard the new franchise will refurbish them again

 

[Blindtraveler]

Not that much will need doing after the current works. Most likely they'll get the USB's in them during downtime on depot and do the seat covers and stuff a few years down the line.

 

[BestWestern]

Mention on Facebook earlier in the week thet 884 was back from its holidays.

It amazes me that these are not coming back with USB sockets throughout. Quite surprising really.

GWR's haven't got them either.

 

[Parallel]

GWR's haven't got them either.

It would have been nice for them to do at least an ATW and have them fitted at the tables!

 

[fgwrich]

Not that much will need doing after the current works. Most likely they'll get the USB's in them during downtime on depot and do the seat covers and stuff a few years down the line.

GWR's haven't got them either.

To be frank, The SWT 159s really do need a thorough refurbishment. The current SWT one is very half hearted, and consisted soley of toilet modifications, new carpet, new seat cushions and DDA modifications - None of the interior paneling has been touched, nor the lighting and some of the vestibules have come back untouched as well. Some may argue that this is Stagecoach cutting back due to the loss of the franchise, however most of them came back like this before the franchise announcement was made - It's all been treated with a 'That'll do' attitude - Similar treatment for the Desiro's with just new seat coverings and carpet (not that they require much as they're still looking good inside!), and frankly it's no wonder why they've not been lucky to retain the franchise.

In fact, coming back from Devon last Monday - the unit I was on still had a wall of masking tape left surrounding the edges of it and the toilet door!

The GWR ones will have no doubt had their spec cut back too, if it was a new Franchise for example then I'm sure we would have seen a far more thorough refurbishment with new seats, plug sockets etc. As it's just a franchise extension, then it's all come back down to new carpet / seat covers + internal and (required) external repainting.

 

[159depotdriver]

Hi indeed 158884 is back she arrived on Friday with 158885 due to go Tuesday. She has come back in the revised livery same as the others, first MTR will not change anything till august but have heard in the grapevine it could involve just wrapping them for now also starting this month our 159s are heading down to Bournemouth one by one for delap where they are preparing them for the hand franchise change i.e. Touching up paint, dents etc. We have also been told that starting this month they are going to start getting debranded and the stagecoach swoosh will be coming off. The USB mod will be done after the 444, 450s have had there's and are looking to be done by 2020 so no real hurry.

 

[BestWestern]

To be frank, The SWT 159s really do need a thorough refurbishment. The current SWT one is very half hearted, and consisted soley of toilet modifications, new carpet, new seat cushions and DDA modifications - None of the interior paneling has been touched, nor the lighting and some of the vestibules have come back untouched as well. Some may argue that this is Stagecoach cutting back due to the loss of the franchise, however most of them came back like this before the franchise announcement was made - It's all been treated with a 'That'll do' attitude - Similar treatment for the Desiro's with just new seat coverings and carpet (not that they require much as they're still looking good inside!), and frankly it's no wonder why they've not been lucky to retain the franchise.

In fact, coming back from Devon last Monday - the unit I was on still had a wall of masking tape left surrounding the edges of it and the toilet door!

The GWR ones will have no doubt had their spec cut back too, if it was a new Franchise for example then I'm sure we would have seen a far more thorough refurbishment with new seats, plug sockets etc. As it's just a franchise extension, then it's all come back down to new carpet / seat covers + internal and (required) external repainting.

I can't honestly imagine that Stagecoach failed to retain the franchise because of the quality of rolling stock refurbs! Are you suggesting that the man from the DfT looked at the standard of maintenance and fleet presentation within Stagecoach and within First, and somehow reached the conclusion that First were doing the better job? I presume GWR and the former FCC operations were missed off the tour then!

 

[fgwrich]

I'm not suggesting that is the reason, but perhaps it could have been one of the reasons. If the DfT is now assessing the franchise bids with a bigger emphasis on quality, continuing the 'do the minimal' work required may not have cut it if First had said "We want to refurbish the fleet with new seats and plug sockets". It seems to be rather known in SWT that Stagecoach has effectively done the minimal work required for a while now, effectively just having the franchise running on tick over. FCC did at least refurbish its fleets, and so did FGW. TSGN was clearly let on the basis of cost over quality, and we very much know that.

 

[BestWestern]

I'm not suggesting that is the reason, but perhaps it could have been one of the reasons. If the DfT is now assessing the franchise bids with a bigger emphasis on quality, continuing the 'do the minimal' work required may not have cut it if First had said "We want to refurbish the fleet with new seats and plug sockets". It seems to be rather known in SWT that Stagecoach has effectively done the minimal work required for a while now, effectively just having the franchise running on tick over. FCC did at least refurbish its fleets, and so did FGW. TSGN was clearly let on the basis of cost over quality, and we very much know that.

I think the point is though that SWT's fleet weren't in dire need of a refurb, because unlike others they aren't run into the ground and are kept in good condition all the time. I agree plugs would have been nice, but I would take your plugs and raise you 'working aircon' any day! SWT appear to be the only TOC who have ever bothered to get the A/C working properly in their 158/159s. Most others are shameful, year after year. As for 'new seats', for the love of god please no!

 

[MatthewRead]

I think the point is though that SWT's fleet weren't in dire need of a refurb, because unlike others they aren't run into the ground and are kept in good condition all the time. I agree plugs would have been nice, but I would take your plugs and raise you 'working aircon' any day! SWT appear to be the only TOC who have ever bothered to get the A/C working properly in their 158/159s. Most others are shameful, year after year. As for 'new seats', for the love of god please no!

Southern's trains need new seats.

 

[vikingdriver]

My theory is that the 159 refurb was minimal because they knew they either would not retain the franchise or the bid included the replacement of the fleet

 

[BestWestern]

My theory is that the 159 refurb was minimal because they knew they either would not retain the franchise or the bid included the replacement of the fleet

The point though is surely that they remain a thoroughly pleasant way to travel. They've hardly been allowed to get 'grotty', unless I've just been lucky and keep getting good ones!

 

[vikingdriver]

The point though is surely that they remain a thoroughly pleasant way to travel. They've hardly been allowed to get 'grotty', unless I've just been lucky and keep getting good ones!

Hopefully First will make it a thoroughly pleasant way for us to travel in the cab too!

 

[3141]

The point though is surely that they remain a thoroughly pleasant way to travel. They've hardly been allowed to get 'grotty', unless I've just been lucky and keep getting good ones!

No, you haven't been lucky, they are all in pretty good condition and as you say remain a thoroughly pleasant way to travel.

 

[dctraindriver]

Hopefully First will make it a thoroughly pleasant way for us to travel in the cab too!

I doubt it.....

 

[Suraggu]

My theory is that the 159 refurb was minimal because they knew they either would not retain the franchise or the bid included the replacement of the fleet

In Stagecoach's bid for SWR it did have a complete replacement of the 158/159 fleet with bi mode units.

 

[Parallel]

No, you haven't been lucky, they are all in pretty good condition and as you say remain a thoroughly pleasant way to travel.

Indeed, I was on an un-refreshed 159 earlier, and it was spotless!

 

[159depotdriver]

I just want to say all the fitters at Salisbury work bloody hard to keep the trains looking good and working properly for there customers, I know because I was one of them before I became a depot driver. If an aircon unit isn't working it is fixed, I had a 5 car ready to take off depot last week and when I walked through it the little 2 car was not cold enough, I had to uncouple it and put another on to the 159. On the franchise its all about how much money you wave in front of them and remember that MTR have had dealings with TFL before. The 158/9swere looking to be replaced by bio units if SWT had retained the franchise, but we have heard that we now have them for at least the 7 year term of the new franchise and yes they will get the USB charging points by 2020 but the desiro 444/450s are getting them first.