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Scotrail Class 385 Discussion

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Altnabreac

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In fairness the Class 385 is designed for suburban services serving Glasgow and Edinburgh with journey times of about 45 mins currently on the main line. We are Getting Refurbished HSTs for the long distance services which should be furnished accordingly.

And i didn't see the 380 mock up when i was at the riverside transport museum a few weeks ago so either they have moved it and i didn't notice or its no longer on display.

It isn't on display currently. Think it was probably removed in last 2 years or so. Fairly sure it was still there in 2013 but not seen it for a wee while.

Most likely it is up at the Glasgow Museum Resource Centre in Nitshill:
http://www.glasgowlife.org.uk/museu.../online-collections-navigator/Pages/home.aspx

If you ping them an email navigator@glasgowlife.org.uk they can arrange a viewing for you should anyone really want to see it right now :)

If not it will likely be back at the Riverside Museum in future.
 
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chris89

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It isn't on display currently. Think it was probably removed in last 2 years or so. Fairly sure it was still there in 2013 but not seen it for a wee while.

Most likely it is up at the Glasgow Museum Resource Centre in Nitshill:
http://www.glasgowlife.org.uk/museu.../online-collections-navigator/Pages/home.aspx

If you ping them an email navigator@glasgowlife.org.uk they can arrange a viewing for you should anyone really want to see it right now :)

If not it will likely be back at the Riverside Museum in future.

Would explain that, i must have gone to it 2012/2013 i can't actually remember now haha. But was on display when i went.

Chris
 

me123

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Interesting, I'll have to pop along and a have a nosy.

I'd agree with some of the comments - the seats look very "suburban", and perhaps like a step back compared to the quite comfortable 170 seating. The First Class seating looks particularly disappointing in comparison (although I'd never travel FC on this route, so it's not an issue for me). I also note in the last picture that those seats in the foreground have no table, which is again a step backwards for travellers (although of course I can see that there are tables).

I'll reserve my judgement until I see the mock up for myself.
 

61653 HTAFC

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Interesting, I'll have to pop along and a have a nosy.

I'd agree with some of the comments - the seats look very "suburban", and perhaps like a step back compared to the quite comfortable 170 seating. The First Class seating looks particularly disappointing in comparison (although I'd never travel FC on this route, so it's not an issue for me). I also note in the last picture that those seats in the foreground have no table, which is again a step backwards for travellers (although of course I can see that there are tables).

I'll reserve my judgement until I see the mock up for myself.

I'd argue that a few bays without tables is a good thing, something that of current stock only the 175s have designed in. No tables at all would be no good either but it's good to have the choice (loadings notwithstanding!).
 

greaterwest

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pic2-p30-p31-class-385-scotrail_w650_zpsglxahtya.jpg

Oh look! Looks like Hitachi managed to acquire a blue variant of the Ironing Boards from Bombardier.
 

380101

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It's at the Transport Museum in Glasgow near to Partick station.

It hasn't been on display there for around 2 years, if not longer. Most likely in storage at their warehouses near to Nitshill station on the Barrhead line.
 

Clansman

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Oh look! Looks like Hitachi managed to acquire a blue variant of the Ironing Boards from Bombardier.

You just summed the train interior up in a nutshell. I wish Scotrail would've gone for an Electrostar though. The Class 379 would've been a perfect alternative to the Class 385 as it is more express like and in my opinion, a proper EMU with a proper interior, not them Ironing boards like you said.
 

Blindtraveler

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I guess it depends on how much padding there is? As the only route these will work to carry FC and be a more IC Style express is the E and G and laterally the ECML Stoppers to BWK???MAYBE WE'LL HAVE A SMALL SELF CONTAINED pool WITH BETTER SEATING, fC and such?
 

Philip Phlopp

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You just summed the train interior up in a nutshell. I wish Scotrail would've gone for an Electrostar though. The Class 379 would've been a perfect alternative to the Class 385 as it is more express like and in my opinion, a proper EMU with a proper interior, not them Ironing boards like you said.

The Hitachi product makes sense given the maintenance arrangements that will be in place around Edinburgh for the IEP deployment, with Craigentinny passing to Agility Trains East and ultimately coming under Hitachi control (in addition to Millerhill going to Hitachi for at least 10 years as part of the Class 385 supply deal).
 

ScotTrains

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Can't say I'm impressed by the look of the interior. First class looks very boring with horrible thin seats. Comparing to the turbostar there is no table light, no curtains, no antimacassars, no soft carpeted wall, no soft armrest, no coat hangers, etc. There's probably more things I've missed. I know some people think some of these items are pointless but it all adds to the first class ambiance, giving a feeling of quality. At least first class doesn't have ironing boards as seats. Just hope they make a better job with the mk3's.
 

me123

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I'd argue that a few bays without tables is a good thing, something that of current stock only the 175s have designed in. No tables at all would be no good either but it's good to have the choice (loadings notwithstanding!).

Yeah, I think I need to see the actual mock up and see just how it looks in real life. Obviously, those seats at the front there also have tip-down seats on the side, so it's also accommodating standing/wheelchair space as well which is obviously important too.
 

Bletchleyite

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Interesting that the passcom has a green sticker and SOS marking rather than the more threatening red sticker more usually used.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
The First Class seats look rather like the Standard ones in the Class 800 - are they?
 

Clansman

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The First Class seats look rather like the Standard ones in the Class 800 - are they?

Yes indeed they are. Only difference is that's leather. Not to mention a poor trick from Scotrail to try make them look wider by given each seat a hand rest in the middle rather than sharing. Poor tactics, they should've been used in the standard interior and gotten proper first class seats. Abellio must have an obsession with crap first class seats because they are replacing the old NX Class 170 ones with seats which are smaller, and the exact same ones that are used in standard class. God help the HSTs... :-x
 
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jopsuk

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The three car units won't have first class, yes? As they're exclusively for no-1st routes- with the 4-car exclusively for the E-G shuttle?
 

Goldfish62

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Those seats are manufactured by FAINSA.

Yes, specifically for the UK market and they are also the cheapest available. Apparently the seats being used in the 321 Renatus build are more comfortable and British (no xenophobic connection intended), but alas are not as cheap.
 

sprinterguy

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Indeed but I have not seen them on any other train except the Electrostars and the class 700.
They are also fitted to the Porterbrook e-Pacer demonstrator and, as has been mentioned above, the first class seats (also Fainsa) on the 385s are the same design as the standard class ones in the Hitachi 800 series units. The CGI mock-ups for the 385s produced last year showed the Fainsa ironing board type seats being used so this comes as little surprise.

Fainsa are doing very well out of UK rolling stock orders at the moment, especially when you consider the large size of the class 700 and 800 series orders, in much the same way that Chapman manufactured seats seemed to be in vogue around the turn of the millennium.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
OT, but I thought Craigentinny was going to Scotrail for their HST fleet? Where are they going to be maintained?
According to the Scotrail franchise agreement, the HSTs are set to be maintained at Craigentinny.

The stakeholder consultation presentation for the 385s produced last year makes brief mention of a new depot being built at Millerhill to maintain the new trains, but other contemporary documents mention that Craigentinny was being considered as an alternative, so I'm unsure what the outcome has been. That the usually excellently informed Philip Phlopp makes mention of Millerhill suggests to me that it's still on the cards. Certainly, stepping up from an allocation of 42 HST power cars, 170 mark 3 carriages and overnight servicing of Crosscountry Voyagers (although stabling takes place at Arriva managed sidings just down the line) to (at least) 54 HST power cars, 121 mark 3 carriages, up to 234 class 385 vehicles (although presumably a number will be serviced overnight in the Glasgow area, based on the routes they will be working) and servicing of East Coast IEP sets would seem to me to be quite a large increase.
 
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sprinterguy

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MAYBE WE'LL HAVE A SMALL SELF CONTAINED pool WITH BETTER SEATING, fC and such?
I wouldn't count on it: I would think that the only real differentiation will be between the first class fitted 4-car sets for E&G services and the 3-car sets for other suburban services, which won't have first class.

The 380s currently used on North Berwick services are fairly spartan internally (but good quality), and it's this sort of style that looks to have been perpetuated in the 385s.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I wish Scotrail would've gone for an Electrostar though.
Note that recent Electrostar builds, as mentioned by greaterwest, in the form of the 377/6s and 387s, have also used the Fainsa "ironing board" seats, so utilising Electrostars probably wouldn't have made much difference and Bombardier probably would have specified Aventras for this build anyway.

Plus, all Electrostars utilise 20 metre carriages while the 385s are 23 metre, so you would lose a significant length of train over an eight carriage formation (24 metres, or slightly more than a whole carriage).
 
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47271

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I can't say that I'm too excited by what it looks like for the 'flagship route' as they like to call it, but to be fair find the Standard seats perfectly comfortable on a 387. If the trains are quiet, smooth and fast then we won't worry too much about what the headrests look like.

Still little incentive to waste money on First Class travel on Scotrail, at least between Edinburgh and Glasgow, into the future then. Doubly so since presumbly the First compartments will still bounce around over the wheels as they do on the 170s?!
 

sprinterguy

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Doubly so since presumbly the First compartments will still bounce around over the wheels as they do on the 170s?!
I'm not sure: The 4-car units will have 20 first class seats, which suggests to me that a mid-carriage position like that found on units such as the 350s might be more likely. Certainly it's too many seats to fit in the equivalent of the first class "cupboard" found behind the drivers' cab on 170s.
 

Observer

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Has it been said where the First Class compartments will be? Remaining at the ends like the 170 or relocated somewhere else where there's more space?

The First Class seats on the 170s are quite good. Maybe you won't want to spend extra on that ticket, but when they're on declassified lines it's an added comfort, especially when you're used to getting a Haymarket 158 with the worn out uncomfortable seats instead.
 
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