Questions about driving trains.

[A-driver]

Are these extra drivers for route knowledge actually referred to as "pilot" or "pilotman"? I would have thought there was obvious scope for confusion with the person who supervises "manual" single line working - not a good mistake to make!

They are technically a conductor driver, not a pilot. It's known as route conducting.

 

[A-driver]

Let me see - correct me if I'm wrong someone. Another train driver can be conducted or piloted over a route by another driver but they are not a pilotman and a pilotman for single line working is not a driver.

The term is conductor, not pilot but people often call them pilots (at a guess from the Nauticle term pilot who does a similar job).

A pilotman for SLW etc certainly isn't a driver. They work for NR and are not trained to drive trains, only to authorise movements.

 

[notadriver]

Sometimes you can get situations where the guard signs a diversionary route but the driver does not.

 

[broadgage]

One question from me, if driving an electric train under clear signals and with no indication of any trouble ahead, what would you do if the traction current went off ?

Coast as far as possible in the hope that it comes on again or that you can coast to the next station ?

Or stop on the grounds that failure of the traction current might indicate derailment, obstruction or other mishaps ahead ?

Either spproach seems to have its merits. Is there a ruling on this or is it down to discretion ?

 

[notadriver]

I would try and get to the next station if possible.

 

[O L Leigh]

Carry on as far as your next booked stop if possible or just use you judgement about a suitable place to stop. I'd try and make a platform if I could. Often times the traction current comes back on again pretty quickly. The power going off is not an indication of impending doom around the next corner.

O L Leigh

 

[notadriver]

There might have been a nuclear blast O L Leigh

 

[A-driver]

That's an interesting one as some drivers, especially newer ones, have panicked in the past when they have lost line light and stopped. The train is then stranded until power comes back so it's better to keep going to a platform if possible and phone the signaller to report it.

Only time you need to be careful is if the ADD activates or if you suspect ohle it pan damage. Then you need to stop immediately if you suspect your train is damaging the wires or else you will bring miles and miles of cable down behind you!

 

[O L Leigh]

Most units with ADD have an alarm to alert the driver when it has operated, but yes you do need to be careful.

If you are dragging the wires down you can usually tell. You'll either hear or see it happening or see the wires ahead of you behaving strangely, or you'll have just passed beneath some obstruction or other on the wires. That's not to say that you'll always know for certain. A former colleague was dewiring with the rear unit of a double set and had no idea at all. He had a good line light because the lead pan was still working normally and the juice hadn't gone off, but the rear pan had somehow got between the contact and catenary wires and was cutting the droppers as it went along.

But if the answer is whether the juice going off indicates an accident or obstruction around the corner (nuclear detonation included) requiring the driver to stop, in my experience the answer is "no".

O L Leigh

 

[Whistler40145]

I had a situation years ago in InterCity CrossCountry period whereby a Manchester to Bristol Class 47+LCHS service I was travelling on was booked via Soho & Aston into Birmingham NS, the Driver signed the route, but the guard didn't, so we were routed direct.

 

[JoeGJ1984]

When there are lots of tracks with overhead signals (often near a terminus station), is it difficult to tell which signal applies to which track? Particularly if there is a curve nearby. Have any signals been misread in this situation?

 

[Eagle]

Usually the large signal gantries near big termini have labels next to the signals saying which line they apply to.

 

[Lockwood]

One of the SPAD risk videos on YouTube shows a scenario of Cannon Street being misread due to the gantry and curve.

 

[SkinnyDave]

Can I ask about headlights?
What happens if you are in middle of trip and you have your day lights on and then it's starts getting dark? Do you just switch them over to night setting whilst driving?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Yes. I tend to do it in the middle of nowhere with no other trains nearby so it cannot be misread as a distress signal. Drivers are also pretty aware of when it gets dark. If I was on a train today which starts its journey at 15:30 or later then I'd probably just put night lights on to begin with because I know it's going to be dark within half an hour.

 

[JB25]

Yes. I tend to do it in the middle of nowhere with no other trains nearby so it cannot be misread as a distress signal. Drivers are also pretty aware of when it gets dark. If I was on a train today which starts its journey at 15:30 or later then I'd probably just put night lights on to begin with because I know it's going to be dark within half an hour.

Exactly what I do.

 

[1e10]

Yes. I tend to do it in the middle of nowhere with no other trains nearby so it cannot be misread as a distress signal. Drivers are also pretty aware of when it gets dark. If I was on a train today which starts its journey at 15:30 or later then I'd probably just put night lights on to begin with because I know it's going to be dark within half an hour.

What kind of things would warrant a 'distress signal'?

 

[notadriver]

Obstruction on track. Person fallen on track ... fire on track ...

 

[455driver]

One question from me, if driving an electric train under clear signals and with no indication of any trouble ahead, what would you do if the traction current went off ?

I work on the superior 3rd rail network and we had a complete section approaching Worplesdon substation that had been de-energised so we lost the line light for about 40 seconds, once we went onto the next section all was well again. Its a little un-nerving rolling along and that little light goes out for quite a while but there is no harm done.

 

[PG]

When there are lots of tracks with overhead signals (often near a terminus station), is it difficult to tell which signal applies to which track? Particularly if there is a curve nearby. Have any signals been misread in this situation?

Ladbroke Grove sadly springs to mind. I believe the signal concerned was a known SPAD risk although I'm unsure if the specific circumstances you ask about caused or contributed to that particular SPAD.

 

[JB25]

The signal at Ladbroke Grove although I have never seen it apparently was a strange set up? But that was an example I was going to give. Approaching termini stations particularly at night is a mess as it is just red, yellow or green lights everywhere. God bless route knowledge!

 

[jopsuk]

when there's a speed restriction imposed, are you just told where it is and what speed, or are you given an explanation as to why it is needed as well?

 

[A-driver]

when there's a speed restriction imposed, are you just told where it is and what speed, or are you given an explanation as to why it is needed as well?

You are given an explanation aswell.

 

[JB25]

You are given an explanation aswell.

Not that most people tend to read that bit to be honest.

 

[A-driver]

Not that most people tend to read that bit to be honest.

Well the reason is of little relevance to the driver. The only useful thing to know is when it is a moving safety speed then you know to expect p-way on adjacent lines.

 

[455driver]

Well the reason is of little relevance to the driver. The only useful thing to know is when it is a moving safety speed then you know to expect p-way on adjacent lines.

Had one of these moving ones a few years ago at Weybridge (up slow was under possession) all the boards were posted for the 40 and all was well on the first trip, but on the second trip all the warning boards were still in place but they had moved the actual commencement board about 300yds nearer to the warning boards and they had lowered the actual restriction a 20 but left the warning boards at 40.

Bit of sharp braking and I was near enough to 20 at the beginning so I made a CSR call to the siggy but they were still the same 3 hours later.:roll:

 

[A-driver]

Had one of these moving ones a few years ago at Weybridge (up slow was under possession) all the boards were posted for the 40 and all was well on the first trip, but on the second trip all the warning boards were still in place but they had moved the actual commencement board about 300yds nearer to the warning boards and they had lowered the actual restriction a 20 but left the warning boards at 40.

Bit of sharp braking and I was near enough to 20 at the beginning so I made a CSR call to the siggy but they were still the same 3 hours later.:roll:

Dosnt surprise me-they don't rush to change those kind of things when reported.

Not long ago there was an 80mph through new barnet on the up fast. One morning at rush hour the warning board by Hadley South tunnel had fallen backwards so every peak hour train was stopped at a red next to it and verbally warned of the tsr. Whilst on the phone to the signaller I offered to open my cab door and jump into the 6foot to stand the sign up (it was adjacent to the cab door). I said it would take about 20secs so a block wouldn't hold up the slow line. I was told that I'm not allowed as I'm not trained in that so they spent the rest if the rush hour stopping 100mph intercity and commuter trains there to warn then of the 'failed' 80mph warning sign...

 

[455driver]

That doesnt surprise me either, we had a dog walk along the cess from Motspur Park, through Raynes Park and halfway towards Wimbledon followed by 2 NR blokes, siggy was cautioning all trains on all lines so when it was my turn I stopped the train beside him, got out of the cab and beckoned nim towards me, got hold of him and the 3 of us hauled him into the cab and I carried him and the NR blokes to Wimbledon, result was lines were cleared in minutes (it had been going on for about 45 minutes at that stage) and normal working resumed.

What happened to using your initiative?
I told the siggy what I had done after the event because there is no way he would have approved it just in case the dog went under the wheels of another train.

Thinking about it I have had quite a bit of fun on that stretch between Raynes Park and Wimbledon!
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My favourite is when they stop you at a red to warn you of low adhesion!

Who the hell thought that would be a good idea?

 

[jopsuk]

Who's to blame if you slide past a red that had been set so the signaller could warn you of low adhesion?

 

[Lockwood]

My favourite is when they stop you at a red to warn you of low adhesion!

Who the hell thought that would be a good idea?

"Driver, you are in an area of low adhesion."
"No I'm not. I managed to stop at your signal."
"Thank you driver, I shall update the system and remove the adhesion warning"


(joke)