HS2 construction updates

[Bald Rick]

There is the system for pumping out the slurry, and pumping the water back in. That will be going 24/7.

 

[najaB]

At a guess, there could be some kind of giant concrete mixer turning to keep the concrete fresh?

OT, I know, but you can't keep concrete fresh. Once the water hits the cement the reaction starts and cannot be stopped. You can slow it down by cooling the concrete, but it's irreversible. Concrete will quite happily cure underwater if there's no current to disturb it.

Concrete mixers turn to stop the aggregate from settling out of suspension.

Other aside, the curing reaction never actually finishes. While concrete reaches (for example) 90% of it's final strength in six hours, the reaction rate just gets asymptotically slower. So there is Roman concrete that's stronger today than it was when Caesar was alive.

(With apologies if I'm explaining the obvious).

 

[edwin_m]

OT, I know, but you can't keep concrete fresh. Once the water hits the cement the reaction starts and cannot be stopped. You can slow it down by cooling the concrete, but it's irreversible. Concrete will quite happily cure underwater if there's no current to disturb it.

Concrete mixers turn to stop the aggregate from settling out of suspension.

Other aside, the curing reaction never actually finishes. While concrete reaches (for example) 90% of it's final strength in six hours, the reaction rate just gets asymptotically slower. So there is Roman concrete that's stronger today than it was when Caesar was alive.

(With apologies if I'm explaining the obvious).

No apology required, I probably had an inkling it wasn't quite right but didn't set (!) it out clearly enough. I guess there could still be a "concrete mixer" running continuously, just not for quite the reason I suggested.

 

[zwk500]

OT, I know, but you can't keep concrete fresh. Once the water hits the cement the reaction starts and cannot be stopped. You can slow it down by cooling the concrete, but it's irreversible. Concrete will quite happily cure underwater if there's no current to disturb it.

Concrete mixers turn to stop the aggregate from settling out of suspension.

Other aside, the curing reaction never actually finishes. While concrete reaches (for example) 90% of it's final strength in six hours, the reaction rate just gets asymptotically slower. So there is Roman concrete that's stronger today than it was when Caesar was alive.

(With apologies if I'm explaining the obvious).

Also no apology required, it's something I'd never thought about and didn't know and is rather interesting. Thanks!

 

[city dweller]

https://twitter.com/360photosurvey

A couple of aerial views around Interchange and Curzon Street works

 

[najaB]

A couple of aerial views around Interchange and Curzon Street works

Very nice photos, can anybody help me get my bearings as to what I'm seeing please?

 

[TBY-Paul]

Very nice photos, can anybody help me get my bearings as to what I'm seeing please?

I've been struggling with the images of "Interchange", I thought it was the Interchange Station site, but as it has becomes clearer what is being constructed, the Station site it's self is out of view. The Station buildings will be around 100-120 metres south.

I think this links to the Interchange Area:-
C224-ARP-CV-DPP-040-321300-FPD-Sheet A1H (publishing.service.gov.uk)

 

[The Planner]

I've been struggling with the images of "Interchange", I thought it was the Interchange Station site, but as it has becomes clearer what is being constructed, the Station site it's self is out of view. The Station buildings will be around 100-120 metres south.

I think this links to the Interchange Area:-
C224-ARP-CV-DPP-040-321300-FPD-Sheet A1H (publishing.service.gov.uk)

The interchange ones are looking north towards the Delta Jn. They need to get the roads changed so they can demolish the roundabout over the M42 and build the HS2 bridge.

 

[city dweller]

The Image is from the top section of the site

 

[TBY-Paul]

The interchange ones are looking north towards the Delta Jn. They need to get the roads changed so they can demolish the roundabout over the M42 and build the HS2 bridge.

Thank you, I'd finally managed to work out what was being shown. Have they started to clear the site of the actual Station buildings etc? or is that work due to start later?

 

[najaB]

Thanks all.

 

[city dweller]

I've been struggling with the images of "Interchange", I thought it was the Interchange Station site

It looks like it's the highway work rather than for the station itself as you say.

 

[edwin_m]

It looks like it's the highway work rather than for the station itself as you say.

View attachment 106779

The two bridges on the new roundabout, spanning the HS2 track as shown above, are visible on the aerial photo. They need to get the roundabout finished so they can close and demolish the existing roundabout (just about visible in grey above ), which makes way for a very highly skewed crossing of HS2 over the M42. This sequence of events is probably why activity here is going ahead faster than in some other places - the new road bridge over the M42 went in as early as summer 2020.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

HS2 Ltd has updated the TBM positions today for December 15.
In the Chiltern tunnels, Florence is at 2604m, Cecilia is at 1970m.
If the data is correct, the rates of both have picked up to 15m+/day for the last 3 weeks.

No figure for new TBM Dorothy at Long Itchington, though we know it started boring on December 2.
So presumably this is the last update for 2021.
I've no idea if they continue unchecked through the Christmas/New Year period, or take a break.

Edit: Yes, they do have a break for Christmas and Easter.

 

[TheHSRailFan]

HS2 Ltd has updated the TBM positions today for December 15.
In the Chiltern tunnels, Florence is at 2604m, Cecilia is at 1970m.
If the data is correct, the rates of both have picked up to 15m+/day for the last 3 weeks.

No figure for new TBM Dorothy at Long Itchington, though we know it started boring on December 2.
So presumably this is the last update for 2021.
I've no idea if they continue unchecked through the Christmas/New Year period, or take a break

I think we can expect Florence to reach the first vent shaft(Chalfont st peter) in the next few weeks/month. I'm guessing they are waiting for the TBMs to go past before they dig into the same depth as the tunnels.

 

[hwl]

I'm guessing they are waiting for the TBMs to go past before they dig into the same depth as the tunnels.

You can do either, but that would be the sensible expectation in this case.

 

[Geogregor]

 

[DaveHarries]

I have long ago decided that I will never use this new line so this question is asked more out of curiosity than anything else. Exactly what route will the new line take into central Birmingham? Only asking as I delivered a car to a NatEx West Midlands driver recently and he said that the depot he works from (Birmingham Central garage, Liverpool Street) is to be obliterated by the HS2 route. If that is the case then there is a great deal of demolition coming up around parts of the city.

He didn't say how long the depot, which is one of the old Birmingham Corporation ones, has left but it has been suggested about 1½ years.

Cheers,
Dave

 

[najaB]

I have long ago decided that I will never use this new line so this question is asked more out of curiosity than anything else.

Interesting. Reminiscent of people who said they would never use a horseless carriage.

 

[civ-eng-jim]

I have long ago decided that I will never use this new line so this question is asked more out of curiosity than anything else. Exactly what route will the new line take into central Birmingham? Only asking as I delivered a car to a NatEx West Midlands driver recently and he said that the depot he works from (Birmingham Central garage, Liverpool Street) is to be obliterated by the HSP route. If that is the case then there is a great deal of demolition coming up around parts of the city.

He didn't say how long the depot, which is one of the old Birmingham Corporation ones, has left but it has been suggested about 1½ years.

Cheers,
Dave

Route plans for Birmingham section are here.

HS2 Phase One: updated plan and profile maps for West Midlands 2016

These are the plan and profile maps for Phase One of HS2 between London and the West Midlands updated following completion of the House of Commons Select Committee process in February 2016.

www.gov.uk

The Curzon Street terminus is north of Liverpool Street so it won't be the new line.

Quick search on Google comes up with articles on residential development. Canal side flats.

 

[The Planner]

I have long ago decided that I will never use this new line so this question is asked more out of curiosity than anything else. Exactly what route will the new line take into central Birmingham? Only asking as I delivered a car to a NatEx West Midlands driver recently and he said that the depot he works from (Birmingham Central garage, Liverpool Street) is to be obliterated by the HSP route. If that is the case then there is a great deal of demolition coming up around parts of the city.

He didn't say how long the depot, which is one of the old Birmingham Corporation ones, has left but it has been suggested about 1½ years.

Cheers,
Dave

The vast majority of any demolition has already happened. Most of it was industrial or brown field sites.

 

[snowball]

and he said that the depot he works from (Birmingham Central garage, Liverpool Street) is to be obliterated by the HSP route.

What's the P in HSP?

 

[DaveHarries]

What's the P in HSP?

Edited.

 

[tomuk]

I have long ago decided that I will never use this new line so this question is asked more out of curiosity than anything else. Exactly what route will the new line take into central Birmingham? Only asking as I delivered a car to a NatEx West Midlands driver recently and he said that the depot he works from (Birmingham Central garage, Liverpool Street) is to be obliterated by the HS2 route. If that is the case then there is a great deal of demolition coming up around parts of the city.

He didn't say how long the depot, which is one of the old Birmingham Corporation ones, has left but it has been suggested about 1½ years.

Cheers,
Dave

It's going nowhere near Liverpool Street so the bus garage isn't being demolished for HS2. As others have said most of the demolition has already been carried out.

The station will be on Moor Street between Moor Street station and the Clayton Hotel the line will run alongside the existing lines out of Moor Street and New Street on a Viaduct it will turn north across Lawley Middleway and follow the existing Birmingham Derby line towards Saltley parallel with the Heartlands Parkway. There will be a depot on the site of the former Alstom/Metro Cammell/LDV factories at Common Lane, Ward End then a tunnel under Bromford Lane and Castle Bromwich. There will then be a big junction viaducts above the existing M6/M42 motorway junction. Trains can go south via the main HS2 past the NEC to London, North towards Crewe or East to Nottingham.

 

[fishwomp]

Interesting. Reminiscent of people who said they would never use a horseless carriage.

There are many people for whom HS2 will be inconvenient, rather like using the Glasgow underground is when you are trying to cross London. It's a fair statement for the poster to have made.

There are many journey options at the moment along the southern WCML which are not central London to central Birmingham, and using HS2 would not help.

 

[greyman42]

There are many people for whom HS2 will be inconvenient, rather like using the Glasgow underground is when you are trying to cross London.

You have lost me there?

 

[najaB]

There are many people for whom HS2 will be inconvenient, rather like using the Glasgow underground is when you are trying to cross London. It's a fair statement for the poster to have made.

"This line won't be useful to me" is completely different to "I have decided I am not going to use this line".

 

[fishwomp]

"This line won't be useful to me" is completely different to "I have decided I am not going to use this line".

Many people would have decided not to use horseless carriages for the right reasons - cost, lack of roads, etc. 100 years on things looked different, but at the time it was a fair comment. Deciding not to use something can be a knee-jerk, or a perfectly rational and calculated, response.

Suppose my regular commute is Brum to Milton Keynes. I could go from Curzon to Interchange, use the shuttle to International, catch the train to Milton Keynes. It won't be an improvement on just going on what remains of the existing service. "I have decided not to use it" is a good response.

 

[najaB]

"I have decided not to use it" is a good response.

"It's not useful to me" is a good response. "I have decided that I am never going to use this line" (note the bolded words) is not.

 

[fishwomp]

"It's not useful to me" is a good response. "I have decided that I am never going to use this line" (note the bolded words) is not.

Let's agree to differ - and return to the thread "HS2 Construction Updates".