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Go Cornwall Bus

TheGrandWazoo

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It's been happening for years in Cornwall as well, but the difference has been that these school journeys have been open to the public because not to do so would create large gaps in the scheduled service.

My question still stands. What has CC done with the funding provided for school journey enhancements?

Depends whether the capability is actually there. Go Ahead don’t have sufficient drivers so that’s just not a goer.

I’m sure they could emulate FK and draft in a load of elderly deckers but what’s the point if you’ve no pilots to steer them?
 
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Goldfish62

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Depends whether the capability is actually there. Go Ahead don’t have sufficient drivers so that’s just not a goer.

I’m sure they could emulate FK and draft in a load of elderly deckers but what’s the point if you’ve no pilots to steer them?
Other operators do exist! Across the country coach operators that have had their private hire and tours programmes decimated are being drafted in. Eg, in Greater Manchester Parks of Hamilton will be providing additional closed door school coaches to relieve the burden on public bus services.
 

Ian10

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If you look all across the UK you will find similar examples of gaps in afternoon timetables, while the buses cover school journeys. It’s nothing new, and has been happening for years.
There is a difference between school buses carrying adults and service buses carrying pupils. My examples fall into the latter category. These routes have never had two hour gaps in the past.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Other operators do exist! Across the country coach operators that have had their private hire and tours programmes decimated are being drafted in. Eg, in Greater Manchester Parks of Hamilton will be providing additional closed door school coaches to relieve the burden on public bus services.
And there may be operators like Wheal Briton but in Cornwall, the options are more limited. I assume Parks are running from their Rochdale site. Sadly they don’t have a depot in Newquay.

Whatever it is, it is the Council’s decision rather than being framed in a FK = Good, GCB = Evil and uncaring, narrative.
 

Goldfish62

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And there may be operators like Wheal Briton but in Cornwall, the options are more limited. I assume Parks are running from their Rochdale site. Sadly they don’t have a depot in Newquay.

Whatever it is, it is the Council’s decision rather than being framed in a FK = Good, GCB = Evil and uncaring, narrative.
Maybe you didn't intend your post to read the way I've taken it, but I most certainly was not framing the debate in those terms. The legal duty lies with the council and no one else.

There are plenty of coach operators in Cornwall to chose from. Mount's Bay, Oates, Hopley's, Summercourt, St Buryan Garage, Truronian are just some that spring immediately to mind. Obviously what we don't know is whether they have any spare capacity and whether CC approached them.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Maybe you didn't intend your post to read the way I've taken it, but I most certainly was not framing the debate in those terms. The legal duty lies with the council and no one else.

There are plenty of coach operators in Cornwall to chose from. Mount's Bay, Oates, Hopley's, Summercourt, St Buryan Garage, Truronian are just some that spring immediately to mind. Obviously what we don't know is whether they have any spare capacity and whether CC approached them.
It was a general point on the framing of the argument on a number of posts, not directed at you specifically :)

Of the firms you mention, two are part of the TfC consortium so are doubtless helping the general cause of shorthandednessand Truronian is part of FK who are busy manning up and redeploying withdrawn fleet.
 

Stan Drews

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The council may have decided that the number of regular (non-school) users of these registered local services carrying a large number of scholars, didn’t justify the expense of providing a separate dedicated closed school contract, where social distancing wouldn’t be required. Instead, they realised that a gap in service mid afternoon made much more sense financially. The government have made some funding available, but it isn’t a bottomless pit.
 

Goldfish62

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It was a general point on the framing of the argument on a number of posts, not directed at you specifically :)

Of the firms you mention, two are part of the TfC consortium so are doubtless helping the general cause of shorthandednessand Truronian is part of FK who are busy manning up and redeploying withdrawn fleet.
Yes, valid points.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

The council may have decided that the number of regular (non-school) users of these registered local services carrying a large number of scholars, didn’t justify the expense of providing a separate dedicated closed school contract, where social distancing wouldn’t be required. Instead, they realised that a gap in service mid afternoon made much more sense financially. The government have made some funding available, but it isn’t a bottomless pit.
Yes, you may be correct. For me I just have a lack of confidence in anything the council does now given the mess they've made of TfC.
 

Geoff DC

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Not being a bus enthusiast or even close, but someone interested in all forms of transport & having worked in the industry - I look at the new Red Buses from Plymouth and see them as a fantasy.
If I need to use buses I will use First Kernow - I don't want to have to tell a driver from Yorkshire/Allshire on a red bus where (which Way) to go
 

RPI

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After only skim reading a lot of this, I noticed conversion earlier around drivers being sent from Plymouth into Cornwall to work these services, I have noticed a fair amount of TfC drivers travelling down from Plymouth in full uniform on a daily basis, mostly my observations whilst working on the gateline at Plymouth
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Not being a bus enthusiast or even close, but someone interested in all forms of transport & having worked in the industry - I look at the new Red Buses from Plymouth and see them as a fantasy.
If I need to use buses I will use First Kernow - I don't want to have to tell a driver from Yorkshire/Allshire on a red bus where (which Way) to go
To be honest, in the majority of tourist areas in the West, it’s FK anyway.

If you’re gonna avoid TfC then you’re going to discount n North Cornwall or anywhere East of Fowey.
 

Lizard1324

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Someone commented online that tfc are starting to receive the remaining 47 with 17 deckers included from monday the 31st and will receive a few each week till the end of September.
Anyone know if this is true or fake news?.
 

Goldfish62

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Someone commented online that tfc are starting to receive the remaining 47 with 17 deckers included from monday the 31st and will receive a few each week till the end of September.
Anyone know if this is true or fake news?.
I was told a couple of weeks ago by a usually reliable source that the 47 outstanding new buses were due very soon.
 

fgwrich

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If its true and delivery started yesterday I would suppose a few would be 20 plate then the rest will be 70 plates..
Possibly so, as an aside, Go North East has introduced the first 70 plate vehicle into service tonight.
Image from Martijn Gilbert’s twitter.
 

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Goldfish62

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If its true and delivery started yesterday I would suppose a few would be 20 plate then the rest will be 70 plates..
Not really. Plenty of operators take delivery of buses a few days beforehand and wait to tax them after the changeover so they can have the latest reg.
 

busdave

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Stumbled across this Freedom of information request earlier, answers many questions about the subsidy amounts:


(Sorry mods it won’t format Into a quote In the correct Layout for the forum and just muddles up, I have therefore not included the quote)
The link shows a breakdown of each route in a spreadsheet and it’s annual subsidy.
I think it's been mentioned before, but quite interesting that the A17 is subsidised on Sundays, yet is operated by FK, even in the winter if I remember rightly.
 

Goldfish62

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I think it's been mentioned before, but quite interesting that the A17 is subsidised on Sundays, yet is operated by FK, even in the winter if I remember rightly.
The list looks to be based on what was awarded rather then the adjusted services following FK commercial registrations. For example for the M6 it lists early morning, evening and Sunday journeys, but none of these operate.
 

busdave

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The list looks to be based on what was awarded rather then the adjusted services following FK commercial registrations. For example for the M6 it lists early morning, evening and Sunday journeys, but none of these operate.
But the A17 does operate on Sundays - I used it last Sunday evening.
 

Goldfish62

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But the A17 does operate on Sundays - I used it last Sunday evening.
Not by TfC it doesn't. It's operated by First Kernow. The list is for services awarded to TfC prior to FK deciding to register some of these journeys commercially.

Hence TfC only operates the A17 Pendeen leg on Mon - Sat and nothing on the M6 apart from the return school journeys.
 

MotCO

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Possibly so, as an aside, Go North East has introduced the first 70 plate vehicle into service tonight.
Image from Martijn Gilbert’s twitter.

OT, but I like the illuminated Go-North East logo.
 

fgwrich

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OT, but I like the illuminated Go-North East logo.

That seems to be a rather unique trait of Mr Gilbert, it's something he bought to Reading Buses with the same feature on both their Orange Streetdecks and Purple 17 E400 MMCs.

 

Jamesbus80

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Re: Go Ahead (TfC) operating closed school journeys with First (Kernow) operating duplicates or specific additional services - it is the same here in Hampshire with Go South Coast and First Hampshire & Dorset. I wonder if the specific duplicate (First) v close the service to the public (Go Ahead) is a wider group policy? Obviously may not be the case as I do not know for other areas but noticed the local pattern.
 

richw

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Re: Go Ahead (TfC) operating closed school journeys with First (Kernow) operating duplicates or specific additional services - it is the same here in Hampshire with Go South Coast and First Hampshire & Dorset. I wonder if the specific duplicate (First) v close the service to the public (Go Ahead) is a wider group policy? Obviously may not be the case as I do not know for other areas but noticed the local pattern.

I’ve heard from above that First are not willing to inconvenience the general public cancelling services to run closed schools.
Essex appears to have drawn in some old stuff too for closed schools dupes
 

MarkC

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I’ve heard from above that First are not willing to inconvenience the general public cancelling services to run closed schools.
Essex appears to have drawn in some old stuff too for closed schools dupes

Same here in Plymouth GA Citybus have cancellations but Stagecoach seem to have extra to cover the few closed services there are.
 

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