Cross-City Electrification from Barnt Green to Bromsgrove

[Techniquest]

The Fast Lines Kings Norton-Longbridge would also need wiring, plus (probably) the Camp Hill route.

So, yes, it would be Birmingham to Bristol (or, strictly, Grand Jn to Westerleigh Jn, with a couple of gaps)

Fair point, I'd forgotten about the fast lines not being electrified

I do wonder if Gloucester would also see some wires go up to it, whilst in the area and all that, but seriously doubt that.

 

[deltic08]

Why, when nothing is going to use them that needs juice? You can do 1 and 4 when Brum Bristol gets wired.

No prospect of electric banking then.

 

[The Planner]

Freight operators werent interested as the banker currently interworks with Bescot shunting.

 

[Philip Phlopp]

Fair point, I'd forgotten about the fast lines not being electrified

It's a blessing and a curse. They're not wired and can't easily be wired - being headspans, it'll need a lot of work to modify or replace the existing headspans to wire the fast lines, but as a result, it makes the conversion of the headspans to portals much less difficult.

 

[Class172]

Some of the line doesn't even use headspans, which if I recall are only used between Longbridge to the point where it drops down to two tracks near Barnt Green, and also some near Kings Norton; the rest is single masts on each side.

 

[Techniquest]

It's a blessing and a curse. They're not wired and can't easily be wired - being headspans, it'll need a lot of work to modify or replace the existing headspans to wire the fast lines, but as a result, it makes the conversion of the headspans to portals much less difficult.

Interesting to know that, sounds like I should be expecting months of weekend closures while it gets done. When it actually starts of course. I'm also hoping to be well away from the area before then!

Starships up the Lickey promises to be an interesting ride, I just hope LM get them fixed up nicely so we have less instances of them running on just one motor coach. If Northern can manage to keep their Starships in top condition, surely so can LM...

 

[Bald Rick]

Is this a change of policy? Covered walkway and stairway. This must be the first in a long time?

Standard design. The new bridge at West Hampstead is almost exactly the same. Various others also.

 

[moggie]

Right, dug the plans out to stop the general confusion (including mine) that is going on.

1 to 4 from left to right as said. 1 is the Up Bromsgrove Loop where freight will sit which is 30mph and 40mph on the exit. 2 is the Up Gloucester main line at 90mph. 3 is the Down Bromsgrove Station Loop at 40mph and where Cross City trains will turn back, they get back to the Up line via a crossover at the north end of the platform, also 40mph, which does not conflict with the Down line. 4 is the Down Gloucester at 90mph. Only 2 and 3 are wired. The old station has to close before the lines through 1 and 4 can be completed as they go through the ends of the platforms.

Interesting. How is it proposed to regain the Down Gloucester line towards Stoke Works Jcn from P4 as that line proceeds to form the Down Goods line south of the new station? Do the current Goods and Gloucester (main) line swap or is there a higher speed arrangement similar to that at Longbridge station (Halesowen Jcn)?

 

[swt_passenger]

Standard design. The new bridge at West Hampstead is almost exactly the same. Various others also.

The basic design appears common to most "access for all" new footbridges.

NR must have a term contractor for the steelwork aspects, I expect the lift shafts are more tailored to the local site conditions and architecture if necessary. Fareham, Fratton, Brockenhurst, Southampton Parkway, Winchester are my local examples.

 

[Harbornite]

There's been quite a serious decline in freight using the Lickey so I'm not sure which workings are banked. IIRC, the class 66 bankers would usually be detached before Kings Norton?

If the FOCs wanted to use electric bankers, then my idea would be to stop using Saltley LIP and use Kings Norton yard instead. It would have to be wired in places, but the banker could then use the slow lines as far as Longbridge.

 

[Philip Phlopp]

Some of the line doesn't even use headspans, which if I recall are only used between Longbridge to the point where it drops down to two tracks near Barnt Green, and also some near Kings Norton; the rest is single masts on each side.

Single track cantilevers are generally fine but tensioning will be changed to spring loaded Tensorex units (to happen at some point anyway), the only issue would be if there's to be replacement of all the existing STCs to provide a single design of catenary all the way from Bristol to Birmingham for maintenance purposes, which is an outside possibility given the fast lines aren't wired, but unlikely.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Standard design. The new bridge at West Hampstead is almost exactly the same. Various others also.

Not the new one at Leyland, just opened.
No sign of covered stairs or bridge there.

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/resources/images/4121474.jpg?display=1&htype=0&type=mc3
http://www.leylandguardian.co.uk/we...gen/derivatives/articleMaxWidth_620/image.jpg

 

[Andyjs247]

There's been quite a serious decline in freight using the Lickey so I'm not sure which workings are banked. IIRC, the class 66 bankers would usually be detached before Kings Norton?

If the FOCs wanted to use electric bankers, then my idea would be to stop using Saltley LIP and use Kings Norton yard instead. It would have to be wired in places, but the banker could then use the slow lines as far as Longbridge.

The bankers - typically 2x Class 37 in days gone by or nowadays a single class 66 - would only work as far as the top of the bank at Blackwell. They would simply push from the rear up the bank then drop off at the top. There is a turnback facility at Blackwell. The 37s were out based at Bromsgrove from Gloucester IIRC. But currently I think a 66 is provided just on an as required basis and may well come from Saltley and return there shortly afterwards.

As to an electric banker, one of the new 88s would be interesting...

 

[Harbornite]

The bankers - typically 2x Class 37 in days gone by or nowadays a single class 66 - would only work as far as the top of the bank at Blackwell. They would simply push from the rear up the bank then drop off at the top. There is a turnback facility at Blackwell. The 37s were out based at Bromsgrove from Gloucester IIRC. But currently I think a 66 is provided just on an as required basis and may well come from Saltley and return there shortly afterwards.

As to an electric banker, one of the new 88s would be interesting...

Yes that's right, before the 37s they used Hymeks and pannier tanks before them. The 37s were based at Bromsgrove until 1986 when the depot closed and they moved to Gloucester, since then the bankers have been allocated to Saltley LIP. On Sundays, you occasionally get the banker working from Bescot to Bromsgrove and they run via Birmingham New Street.

 

[The Planner]

Interesting. How is it proposed to regain the Down Gloucester line towards Stoke Works Jcn from P4 as that line proceeds to form the Down Goods line south of the new station? Do the current Goods and Gloucester (main) line swap or is there a higher speed arrangement similar to that at Longbridge station (Halesowen Jcn)?

Down Gloucester swings back in, the goods loop is slightly curtailed and starts at a new 50mph junction.

 

[Class172]

This map appears to show the future layout of the station - http://raildar.co.uk/map/BMV - I assume it's fairly accurate?

 

[The Planner]

That is the infrastructure model taken from the train planning system (TPS), it doesn't help that it is in black and white as the model is colour. Needless to say, there are errors on it.

 

[Harbornite]

This map appears to show the future layout of the station - http://raildar.co.uk/map/BMV - I assume it's fairly accurate?

Those maps sre good, Ive used raildar before but I don't recall seeing that particular map!

 

[mikestone1952]

The bankers - typically 2x Class 37 in days gone by or nowadays a single class 66 - would only work as far as the top of the bank at Blackwell. They would simply push from the rear up the bank then drop off at the top. There is a turnback facility at Blackwell. The 37s were out based at Bromsgrove from Gloucester IIRC. But currently I think a 66 is provided just on an as required basis and may well come from Saltley and return there shortly afterwards.


As to an electric banker, one of the new 88s would be interesting...

;
interstingly perusal of RTT suggest the early morning arrival at Wolverhampton Steel Terminal gets an assisting loco - would be interested to know if it is the banker or random provision.

 

[Harbornite]

;
interstingly perusal of RTT suggest the early morning arrival at Wolverhampton Steel Terminal gets an assisting loco - would be interested to know if it is the banker or random provision.

That's unusual, the steel workings from there aren't usually banked.

 

[D1009]

Down Gloucester swings back in, the goods loop is slightly curtailed and starts at a new 50mph junction.

Assuming you're referring to the down, doesn't that become a relief line (i.e. signalled for passenger) under this scheme?

 

[mikestone1952]

That's unusual, the steel workings from there aren't usually banked.

;
I didn't say from, I said to.
;
Usually a light engine is shown returning to Bescot, although there were schedules last week they don't seem to have run. My theory was that it is overload for a 66.

 

[Harbornite]

;
I didn't say from, I said to.
;
Usually a light engine is shown returning to Bescot, although there were schedules last week they don't seem to have run. My theory was that it is overload for a 66.

Maybe DB were trialling 66's on the empty workings, the workings to and from Wolves are usually handled by tugs.

 

[deltic08]

As to an electric banker, one of the new 88s would be interesting...

Would only four axles be sufficient for adhesion?

 

[mikestone1952]

Maybe DB were trialling 66's on the empty workings, the workings to and from Wolves are usually handled by tugs.

;
It does seem to have reverted to 60s in the last couple of weeks but had been largely 66s for the previous three months.
'
(Subsequently)In fact this mornings lists do show it with two 66s, one attached at Bescot, not a banker.

 

[59CosG95]

;
It does seem to have reverted to 60s in the last couple of weeks but had been largely 66s for the previous three months.

Definitely had a shed on it yesterday. 66119 working the Wolverhampton-Immingham steel.

 

[LDECRexile]

I visited friends in Bromsgrove this week and took the shots here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157668460941000

I didn't have a window seat southbound, but on our way back northbound I was pleased to see lots of cylindrical mast base piles either driven home or partly installed. there were also a decent number of marker pegs where masts will go.

 

[mikestone1952]

Bromsgrove new station to open on 12th July.
;
http://www.londonmidland.com/about-...ation-to-open-on-tuesday-12-july-2016-1456354

 

[Harbornite]

Bromsgrove new station to open on 12th July.
;
http://www.londonmidland.com/about-...ation-to-open-on-tuesday-12-july-2016-1456354

Good to know.

 

[Hophead]

What impact will the opening of a fancy new station have on loadings? Is there a danger that services will become oversubscribed (if they are not already)?