Class 172 Production Progress

[oversteer]

Can't we hear more about the lovely new 172s please?

 

[Rhydgaled]

Can't we hear more about the lovely new 172s please?

Some more photographs of the London Midland examples would be nice, preferably creative commons so we can see what they'd look like in other liveries.

Can we have an update on how many 172s of each type have been completed so far, and how many of those have seats?

 

[Class172]

Well my picture is just a 172 off the internet (172331)

 

[WillPS]

Spending what money now on re-nationalisation? as I see it all that would be needed is to remain leasing any stock the ROSCOs haven't yet made a return on until they do, then take charge of that stock too. My post was over-simplification, yes, but privatisation has failed. We would be obliged to allow open access, but it wouldn't make much difference, look how many applications for open access services get turned down. Since the ROSCOs would be forced to hand all their stock over, open access operators would have to own their own stock or lease from the nationalised operator.

This would be how it's done. It would also have the side effect of incentivising the purchase of new trains so as to remove the ROSCOs from the equation.

Open access is great, smashing idea - and as far privatisation should be allowed to go.

 

[Rhydgaled]

This would be how it's done. It would also have the side effect of incentivising the purchase of new trains so as to remove the ROSCOs from the equation.

No, I don't think it would encourage the purchasing of new trains. The old stock would have already made the ROSCOs their profit so would just be taken back, no continued leases (beyond the end of the contract period, which probablly co-incides with when the franchise lapses (and BR takes over) anyway) or compensation necessary.

I've heard it suggested that the railways act prevents the government keeping a nationalised service on a long-term basis so you would need to update leglislation anyway, so you might as well make the ROSCOs hand over all stock once they have made a return on it. That leaves Network Rail, which seems to be covertly nationalised anyway.

Basiclly, there are no additional costs (unless you count MPs wages while they are writing the leglislation) but you don't gain the full savings immediately (you do start making some savings as soon as the first TOC's franchise expires though).

Open access is, as you say, as far as privatisation should be allowed to go.

 

[TomJ93]

Are these louder than 170s? Was struggling to hear Phil Sayer at BHM!

Speaking of them, they're proof that the old way with ROSOCOs worked. The porterbrook units for example we would be in a Mess without. Either the GovT has full control or they control very little. They can't hold the railways hand like they are now. The TOCs with old/not enough trains would want them, the ROSOCOS would get money from the TOCs to pay off the purchase and make money- isn't that the idea? Well I think it's the GovT who are preventing it.

 

[trains2064]

Just heard on the graph vine that next week the should be a 6 car 172 running around. Also the arrival of 172333 is imminent.

 

[Class172]

Just heard on the graph vine that next week the should be a 6 car 172 running around. Also the arrival of 172333 is imminent.

Have any reached Droitwich Spa or Worcester yet??

 

[trains2064]

Have any reached Droitwich Spa or Worcester yet??

Don't think so. Not sure weather the clearance test have been completed other than Tyseley to Stratford and Tyseley to Leamington.
Someone said the might be an issue at Small Heath with this on the line into Snow Hill.

 

[Class172]

Not surprised, considering they are right at the end of the Snow Hill lines

 

[Boothby97]

All the Class 172/3s have been built and I think that all the Class 172/1s have been built. I know 172101/102 are out and about.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

All the Class 172/3s have been built and I think that all the Class 172/1s have been built. I know 172101/102 are out and about.

As for "Built" does that mean with seats and ready for service?

103 has been out and about.

 

[Boothby97]

As for "Built" does that mean with seats and ready for service?

103 has been out and about.

No I don't think they have been fitted with seats because of a problem with the suppliers, at least one 172/3 was sat in the open at Derby Works on Tuesday, don't know which one. I thought the 172/1s and /3s were due to be starting work in May.

 

[Class172]

I saw a chiltern turbostar at sileby in Leicestershire earlier. It was approaching the station at 12:04. Any help as to identify this train. I never saw the running number as I was on the road 30m away. I presume it was a 172/1. Why was it so far north on the MML, stock movement??

Thanks,
Dan

 

[Boothby97]

I saw a chiltern turbostar at sileby in Leicestershire earlier. It was approaching the station at 12:04. Any help as to identify this train. I never saw the running number as I was on the road 30m away. I presume it was a 172/1. Why was it so far north on the MML, stock movement??

Thanks,
Dan

Probably heading back to Derby or Alysebury or Wembley. If so it would have been diverted due to engineering works in the Tamworth Area. and it would have been a Class 172 if it was Blue and White (Chiltern Livery)

 

[Class172]

When are the LM 172s actually entering service?

 

[Boothby97]

When are the LM 172s actually entering service?

Maybe May Timetable Change (not saying this year)
If not definitely by December 2011.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

Maybe May Timetable Change (not saying this year)
If not definitely by December 2011.

I think you are expressing a personal opinion with your posts, not stating verifiable facts.
If you wish to have your posts taken seriously please make it clear which of the above it is.

Speculation is fine as we all enjoy a bit of that as long as we know that is what it is!!!!!

Sorry rant over.:wink

 

[trains2064]

I think you are expressing a personal opinion with your posts, not stating verifiable facts.
If you wish to have your posts taken seriously please make it clear which of the above it is.

Speculation is fine as we all enjoy a bit of that as long as we know that is what it is!!!!!

Sorry rant over.:wink

I was lucky enough to visit with work the production line of 172's in derby about 12 weeks ago. At that time I managed to veiw all chiltern 172's in an almost complete state as well as 172333 and 172334 in an early stage of construction. I am sure after being told that it takes about 7 days to build a 3car set that LM's 3 car sets must be about 338 or 339 at the moment.

Hopefully by the end of the yat all 172's will be in service on the Snow Hill lines and the 26 other coaches will be there or there abouts in service. The snow hill lines is crying out for extra coaches (as is most of the country). I think a great sign of this is the looking inyo extending all the platforms to 6 coaches.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I was lucky enough to visit with work the production line of 172's in derby about 12 weeks ago. At that time I managed to veiw all chiltern 172's in an almost complete state as well as 172333 and 172334 in an early stage of construction. I am sure after being told that it takes about 7 days to build a 3car set that LM's 3 car sets must be about 338 or 339 at the moment.

Hopefully by the end of the year all 172's will be in service on the Snow Hill lines and the 26 other coaches will be there or there abouts

and is it really as dissorgonised and chaotic as some anti Bombardier groups make it out to be?

Personally I think they've had a rough time with supply probs etc and think the chritics should maybe bare in mind that, to all intents and purposes we stil have a major economic chrisis which no matter what the pen pushers say is taking time to sort. I dont see why they shouldnt get more orders and am sure that reliabilitty can and wil improve once there supply chaine issues are delt with.

Its often been said that whats needed are new trains that work streight out of the box and ok, in that sense, they have not always delivered but they have worked hard to sort problems out as best they could. Now, if crossrail and or thameslink order with them, i for one wil be glad as Britain need this kind of industry and if they can get it rite, then it puts them in front for Pacer and later sprinter replacement.

To the chritics again I would say that for proof that even a manufacturer who til lately has had a good 'work as soon as it comes out of the box' product is not always purfect you should look at Glasgows 380s which when fully functional wil be as good as any other diziro class but have had many teething issues.

Yess we've had a lot of turbo/electrostar delays lately but by and large post introduction they are reliable.

Rant over, sorry, but am just a bit bord hearing the same old moans. If they wernt up to the job then they would never have been offered the work.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

I was lucky enough to visit with work the production line of 172's in derby about 12 weeks ago. At that time I managed to veiw all chiltern 172's in an almost complete state as well as 172333 and 172334 in an early stage of construction. I am sure after being told that it takes about 7 days to build a 3car set that LM's 3 car sets must be about 338 or 339 at the moment.

Hopefully by the end of the yat all 172's will be in service on the Snow Hill lines and the 26 other coaches will be there or there abouts in service. The snow hill lines is crying out for extra coaches (as is most of the country). I think a great sign of this is the looking inyo extending all the platforms to 6 coaches.

The other 26 coaches? Has the add on order been placed then?

 

[MCR247]

and is it really as dissorgonised and chaotic as some anti Bombardier groups make it out to be?

Personally I think they've had a rough time with supply probs etc and think the chritics should maybe bare in mind that, to all intents and purposes we stil have a major economic chrisis which no matter what the pen pushers say is taking time to sort. I dont see why they shouldnt get more orders and am sure that reliabilitty can and wil improve once there supply chaine issues are delt with.

Its often been said that whats needed are new trains that work streight out of the box and ok, in that sense, they have not always delivered but they have worked hard to sort problems out as best they could. Now, if crossrail and or thameslink order with them, i for one wil be glad as Britain need this kind of industry and if they can get it rite, then it puts them in front for Pacer and later sprinter replacement.

To the chritics again I would say that for proof that even a manufacturer who til lately has had a good 'work as soon as it comes out of the box' product is not always purfect you should look at Glasgows 380s which when fully functional wil be as good as any other diziro class but have had many teething issues.

Yess we've had a lot of turbo/electrostar delays lately but by and large post introduction they are reliable.

Rant over, sorry, but am just a bit bord hearing the same old moans. If they wernt up to the job then they would never have been offered the work.

380s are a new product. Were 377/5s? No.

 

[Blindtraveler]

fare enough

 

[Class172]

Hopefully by the end of the yat all 172's will be in service on the Snow Hill lines and the 26 other coaches will be there or there abouts in service. The snow hill lines is crying out for extra coaches (as is most of the country). I think a great sign of this is the looking inyo extending all the platforms to 6 coaches.

My station is already 6 cars long

 

[jon0844]

380s are a new product. Were 377/5s? No.

Should a number of internal information screens not work on a 379 that has been running for a matter of weeks?

There may be many genuine reasons for why Bombardier are late in releasing trains (due to supply problems) but the main complaint is about poor quality control and testing.

Certain problems should be picked up before the train is released, but given the state of new build housing in this country (even show homes), we do seem to think that you can just patch things up later.

 

[swt_passenger]

The other 26 coaches? Has the add on order been placed then?

I think he means the 26 remaining 'unallocated' 150 vehicles, which are apparently all going to leave LM, according to a post a few days ago.

If they do all leave, there'll be no train lengthening, because the 172s are about the same number of vehicles as the 150s that are going.

 

[Class172]

I think he means the 26 remaining 'unallocated' 150 vehicles, which are apparently all going to leave LM, according to a post a few days ago.

If they do all leave, there'll be no train lengthening, because the 172s are about the same number of vehicles as the 150s that are going.

As was mentioned earlier in this thread, LM may be ordering another batch of 172s

I noticed today that at Worcester Fgt St & Droitwich Spa, new 4 and 5 car stop signs had been put up, I presume for the new 172s. However, this makes me wonder: are the going to be more multiple workings or is it a hint that LM are ordering more 172s so they can do what I just mentioned?

 

[Rhydgaled]

As was mentioned earlier in this thread, LM may be ordering another batch of 172s

I noticed today that at Worcester Fgt St & Droitwich Spa, new 4 and 5 car stop signs had been put up, I presume for the new 172s. However, this makes me wonder: are the going to be more multiple workings or is it a hint that LM are ordering more 172s so they can do what I just mentioned?

Wiki says there will be some LM 2-car sets (172/2), are these the optional second batch or are they included in the numbers of sets currently under disscussion?

 

[Wyvern]

380s are a new product. Were 377/5s? No.

Dont they have a different drive mechanism from earlier designs? They've certainly got different bogies. No doubt the electronics is different as well.

 

[Boothby97]

I think he means the 26 remaining 'unallocated' 150 vehicles, which are apparently all going to leave LM, according to a post a few days ago.

If they do all leave, there'll be no train lengthening, because the 172s are about the same number of vehicles as the 150s that are going.

I believe they may gradually enter the 172/3s into service on the Snow Hill lines from May. I know that 24 coaches are to come from 172/2s so does he mean that. (Maybe got number confused). If not I'm sorry.
And another thing, sorry about the post above. I do not have any guaranteed information about when sub-classes /1, /2 and /3 will enter service.