Best and worst TOC names

[junglejames]

Richard Branson himself has said in interviews that the name originated because he was delayed on a return flight from the Virgin Islands when he came up with the idea of setting up his own airline.

Your suggestion seems to originate from an unreferenced claim on Wikipedia.
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All of Hull Trains services do go to Hull though.

It may be unreferenced on wiki (i wouldnt know because ive never looked up Virgin or RB on wiki), but it does have foundation.

Regarding the Virgin Islands. Yes, thats where he got the idea for Virgin Airways. But the company had been going for a while before this. Sounds lke you have mistaken what he said in interviews. He would only have mentioned the virgin islands as where he got the idea for Virgin Airways.
The name, and company, had been going for a while as a music business, and its just a coincidence that they had the same name as the Virgin Islands.

Anyway, if you want references to prove everything I have said, then your best bet is RBs Autobiography 'Losing My Virginity'.
Pages 70, 161, 163 and 164 will back up everything.

 

[tbtc]

I've always thought that "First Capital Connect" wasn't a great name. It doesn't really tell you where it operates, whereas most other London operators give you a clue. Besides, it sounds a bit silly

FCC serves four different corridors. To the north there's the ECML and MML. To the south there's the Brighton Main Line (can we call this "BML"?) and the Wimbledon loop.

Most TOCs serve a very specific area (ignoring the fact that Southern and South Eastern share some London termini, most termini have only one TOC and there's little overlap).

So, whilst "South Eastern" makes sense for a TOC serving South Eastern London and the Souuth Eastern corner of the United Kingdom, there's no simple geographic description for the routes that FCC serve.

Really, calling it "Capital Connect" is no better or worse than "Thameslink" (a similarly vague description). In this case I'd blame the "map" rather than blame First.

 

[northwichcat]

FCC serves four different corridors. To the north there's the ECML and MML. To the south there's the Brighton Main Line (can we call this "BML"?) and the Wimbledon loop.

Most TOCs serve a very specific area (ignoring the fact that Southern and South Eastern share some London termini, most termini have only one TOC and there's little overlap).

The name FCC is a bit like when Arriva had Merseyrail and called it Arriva Trains Merseyside instead of using the established Merseyrail name.

While most of the London termini had one operator pre-BR most now have multiple operators:

Euston: Virgin, London Midland, London Overground, First Scotrail
Kings Cross: East Coast, First Hull Trains, Grand Central, FCC
St Pancras: EMT, FCC, Southeastern
Victoria: Southeastern, Southern, Gatwick Express
Paddington: FGW, Heathrow Express, Heathrow Connect, Chiltern
Waterloo: South West Trains

 

[tbtc]

Kings Cross: Grand Central

Why has nobody criticised "Grand Central" yet for its meaningless name? At least most TOCs are fairly descriptive (even if some journeys can be done on them outside the "core" area)...

 

[Whistler40145]

I have to wonder who decided on Grand Central!

Also, c2c is a daft name, means nothing, why not LT&S Railways (London Tilbury & Southend Railways).

 

[WestCoast]

Also, c2c is a daft name, means nothing, why not LT&S Railways (London Tilbury & Southend Railways).

I think if c2c meant City2Coast it would be OK.

LT&S would have been a massive NO, due to the shoddy image and reputation of LTS rail.

 

[Ivo]

Regarding c2c/LTS, surely the best name for it - to get around both avoiding the tainted LTS name and also to provide a bit of local meaning - would be London Thameside? I for one would have gone with that name from the off. And yes, I am aware that this name is identical to the franchise name.

 

[Whistler40145]

Good name Ivo.

 

[LE Greys]

I have to wonder who decided on Grand Central!

Also, c2c is a daft name, means nothing, why not LT&S Railways (London Tilbury & Southend Railways).

Grand Central was originally supposed to be a route accross the country from Newcastle to Manchester via the Calder Valley (so pretty "central") but ended up operating it's current route, but decided to stick with the name. One train is still officially the Twenty-first Century Limited and their Dellas are officially Zephyrs.

My favourite name was always Great North Eastern Railways (GNER), because it harked back to the former names that ran the ECML, and was actually considered before the 1922 company chose London and North Eastern Railway. As for my least favourite, Northern Spirit, which sounded ridiculous. I could have said anything with "Trains" in it. Wouldn't "South Western Railways" or "East Midland Railways" sound better?

 

[OxtedL]

(can we call this "BML"?)

Controversial...
Don't let anyone with any minor sense of pedantry on this thread...

 

[northwichcat]

I could have said anything with "Trains" in it. Wouldn't "South Western Railways" or "East Midland Railways" sound better?

British Rail controlled the entire infrastructure. East Midlands Trains, for instance, are only responsible for running trains, Network Rail are responsible for the track, signals etc.

 

[185]

I think all franchises that start with 'First' should be renamed. Preferably with Abellio, DB, Arriva, NX or even UK Govt stuck infront instead

 

[northwichcat]

I think all franchises that start with 'First' should be renamed. Preferably with Abellio, DB, Arriva, NX or even UK Govt stuck infront instead

I once heard a conductor telling someone "This is standard class. 'First' is the name of the company."

I think "DB Wales & Borders" would sound much better, as well as more accurate than "Arriva Trains Wales"

 

[SouthEastern-465]

I like TOC names that get to the point of what they're selling.

London Midland (if you overlook Liverpool runs) for example is a good name as is East Midlands Trains (a clear geographical area)

I agree.

I like companys that get to the point with there TOC names, personal favorites are: South West Trains, East Midlands Trains, London Midland, Southeastern.

For some reason I don't know I like Grand Central.

 

[Whistler40145]

I see no reason for the name Grand Central, to me it's best suited to the Railway Station in New York!

 

[WestCoast]

Yes, well Grand Central are alluding to an American image. Which simply doesn't work on the class 180s as you've got First barbie with Marilyn Monroe!

We've got enough railway history of our own, but I suspect they wanted to distance themselves from GNER while remaining 'classy', hence the American theme.

 

[MCR247]

Leicester - 4tph to London, 4tph from London, 1tph to Lincoln, 1tph from Lincoln

P
Other than St Pancras are there any stations with more EMT services calling at it than Sheffield with 2 trains from London every hour, 2 trains to London every hour, one train from Liverpool to Norwich every hour and one train from Norwich to Liverpool every hour i.e. 6 per hour in total.

Ahem Nottingham
2tph London
1tph Leicester
1tph Lincoln
1tph Norwich
1tph Liverpool
1tph Skegness(?)
1tph Worksop
1tph Mansfield Woodhouse
1tph Matlock

 

[Malderon]

I like Southern, Northern etc like many (though Southern could do with taking in Southeastern and SWT, OK the franchise might be much to big but the name would fit better!)

First Capital Connect is just dreadful. FCC is the US version of Ofcom so even the abbreviation is bad! Thameslink is a good name for the services and is still the names of the lines. I know that Thameslink as a company didnt have a great reputation at franchise end so perhaps that was the reason for the distancing.

 

[junglejames]

I like Southern, Northern etc like many (though Southern could do with taking in Southeastern and SWT, OK the franchise might be much to big but the name would fit better!)

First Capital Connect is just dreadful. FCC is the US version of Ofcom so even the abbreviation is bad! Thameslink is a good name for the services and is still the names of the lines. I know that Thameslink as a company didnt have a great reputation at franchise end so perhaps that was the reason for the distancing.

Southern and South Eastern are straight to the point. Good names. Im still waiting for them to rename South Eastern as Network South East though!!! Best name going, brilliant livery!

 

[bladesman123]

I like the name Grand Central.

 

[HST Power]

I like the name Grand Central.

Same, and the HST's look really good as well. The black and orange livery always gets my attention!

 

[Whistler40145]

Presume Grand Central got it's name because GNER already existed, so they couldn't call it Great Northern?

 

[northwichcat]

Presume Grand Central got it's name because GNER already existed, so they couldn't call it Great Northern?

Didn't they try and register that name but found it was registered to First Group as the name is connected to Thameslink?

They also used the name 'Grand Union' in bidding for Yorkshire-Kings X services but then used the name 'Grand Central'

 

[SouthEastern-465]

Same, and the HST's look really good as well. The black and orange livery always gets my attention!

I think the GC livery on the Class 180s looks brilliant, smart and suits the class although I don't think everyone will agree. Although funny enough I'm not to keen on the new livery applied to the HSTs looks rather ghastly.

 

[HST Power]

I think the GC livery on the Class 180s looks brilliant, smart and suits the class although I don't think everyone will agree. Although funny enough I'm not to keen on the new livery applied to the HSTs looks rather ghastly.

It does look good on the 180. But surely it can't be that bad on the HST? It really caught my eye in Peterborough the other day!

 

[SouthEastern-465]

It does look good on the 180. But surely it can't be that bad on the HST? It really caught my eye in Peterborough the other day!

Looks awful on a HST, and eye catching! I think its down to personal taste.

 

[deltabravo]

I agree with others that Arriva should never of ditched the 'Merseyrail' name.

 

[BOSCH]

Yes, well Grand Central are alluding to an American image. Which simply doesn't work on the class 180s as you've got First barbie with Marilyn Monroe!

No you dont,our 180's are black with an orange stripe !
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I like the name Grand Central.

Thank you
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Presume Grand Central got it's name because GNER already existed, so they couldn't call it Great Northern?

The former MD of GC Ian Yeowart actually created the name GNER and this was the name that was to be used if he had been successful with his Ncle-Lpool link,he sold it to Sea Containers who then launched GNER on the ECML(I have seen the document proving this )He has now bought the rights to the name back hence the open access applications for GNER/GNWR recently !!!

 

[scotsman]

ScotRail is one of the better ones, Great Western and GNER are probably my all-time favourites

 

[BOSCH]

Didn't they try and register that name but found it was registered to First Group as the name is connected to Thameslink?

They also used the name 'Grand Union' in bidding for Yorkshire-Kings X services but then used the name 'Grand Central'

Grand Northern was the bidding name initially which then became Grand Union.