Should we have a universal ID card?

[Brubulus]

I support ID cards, as part of a wider internal security architecture to bring in a low-crime society. However implementation of ID cards needs to be alongside the universal fitment of facial recognition cameras to realise it's benefits.

While there are civil liberties considerations, the government can easily take authoritarian measures now with existing powers and systems, and introducing ID does not substantially increase the risk of them taking those actions.

 

[david1212]

I'm in two minds about this. On one hand, I can appreciate that there's a need for some form of ID that isn't a passport or photo driving licence; when I applied for my last job they were presented as the only options I had. This was a company policy rather than official government policy.
...
I've never had a full passport and my driving licence is non-photographic.

Likewise I do not have official photo ID. No problem directly with my employer but getting approval for site access to their customers was.

One thing to have and only show for specific purposes linked to the state e.g. employment or more specifically the NI & tax, claiming benefits, voting but another to have to show on demand - while right now the latter is not what is proposed it becomes far easier to expand when required to be shown in the future.

Another concern is data security - think JLR, Marks & Spencer etc. Some division / department of the government already have all the details but right now if a data breach into one division how much can be obtained? If this goes through all the data will together and potentially across several divisions / systems. Of course we will be assured totally secure and impossible to misuse / clone / fake but in reality ......

 

[Gourlish]

Right to work checks were introduced in the Asylum and Immigration Act 1996.
What does being ‘obviously British’ mean? Especially since 1983 it’s not a given that being born in the UK makes you a UK citizen and thus entitled to work here.

My dad claims that the company he worked for up to the mid 2010s never asked to see any form of proof of right to work when he joined them in the UK despite it being a large American company, though he joined in about 1993.

I think right to work checks have been in force for quite a long time, but the "hostile environment" measures are newer, and introduced requirements such as requiring employers to report those who they suspected were trying to seek work illegally to the immigration authorities, whereas I don't think that was originally the case. From the sound of it there was no fixed penalty for employers who carried out right to work checks incorrectly prior to 2006.


There was a chain of electronics stores in the UK during the early 1990s called Tandy, and I recall reading that you had to sign up to their mailing list and give your details in order to buy things from them. This would almost definitely be an illegal practice today under the GDPR. About 15 years ago my mum had a minor bump with another car in a car park, and whichever garage repaired the small dent almost certainly passed her details on to data brokers, because she then started getting multiple calls every day for about two years from random call centres claiming she was entitled to compensation and if she would like to claim it. The GDPR also made this practice illegal.

 

[brad465]

I see Darren Grimes is against Id cards, despite claiming they were the only answer to the uks problems a few months ago

Wouldn't surprise me if he's only against it now because it's not his tribe implementing them. Perhaps he's also worried everyone will find out how 'crafty' he's been getting.

 

[OLJR]

I do not support ID cards.

I also note that the PM has it the wrong way round. He says that we will need an ID card to work and rent in the UK. This is not correct. It is birth as a British citizen that gives us the right to work and rent in the UK, not any state programme.

They give us NI numbers today because we have the right to work, not to grant us that right. The government has no power to take these rights away.

I signed the petition and you can do so too - here.

 

[Purple Train]

This is a good pointer as to why the UK is on a self destruct mode. Not because of ID cards per se, but because of whatever any government proposes or wants to introduce, the opposition and much of the population are against it. Much of this is not for any genuine logical reason, but because they can.

I think you have absolutely hit the nail on the head.

With regard to ID cards more specifically, I do support them, but am worried at the prospect of it being digital. I have and use a smartphone but have been known to leave it switched off for days at a time. I don't use railway e-tickets, and my railcard is plastic. Some older members of my family have digital railcards and the whims of technology have been such a nightmare that I really don't want to use it for anything more critical than my shopping list.

It would make no real difference to me, as I have a provisional driving licence which I use as ID (though have no intention to start driving for a little while yet). I'm less happy with the "illegal working" angle that is being pushed, but I think the idea has many benefits. I think it's telling that many countries in continental Europe that are seen as more libertarian have such a scheme with seemingly few effects; Big Brother does not arrive in such a manner.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Sep 2025 ==

Wouldn't surprise me if he's only against it now because it's not his tribe implementing them. Perhaps he's also worried everyone will find out how 'crafty' he's been getting.

I'm not sure how anyone affiliated to Reform can be in favour of identity cards given how politically contradictory they can be...!

(As stolen from Tony Blair, albeit talking about David Cameron.)

 

[Garmoran]

For everyone else, it gives us the assurance that scrotes involved in low level issues cannot go under the radar because of an absence of ID.

Or they will simply equip themselves with false ID or cloned ID or find alternative ways round it. As an example, for years now it has been getting more and more difficult to open a bank account due to regulations intended to prevent money laundering. This makes life more difficult for honest people but the dishonest ones just find alternative ways round.

 

[dangie]

...This makes life more difficult for honest people but the dishonest ones just find alternative ways round.

Unfortunately this is the way of the world. Those who are trying to protect the honest are often more criticised than the dishonest they are fighting against.

 

[alex397]

I have no major issue with ID cards, though it’s right to be cautious and to call out any threat to any of our freedoms.
However like anything in this country, all rational discussion of this will be drowned out by sensationalist and over-dramatic nonsense from the tabloid media, the tin foil hat brigade and ridiculous people such as anyone associated with Reform. They will all ignore the positives of this, such as how it has worked in Estonia and other countries for decades, and instead associate it with ‘big brother’ and communism.

As I say, it’s right to question this and raise any concerns, and it’s right to have a rational debate about this, such as on this forum where decent debates can be had, but in the mainstream it will just all be over-dramatic nonsense with no rational debate. So, I doubt it will happen because no doubt the hysteria will override everything.

I will say, for me it will be useful for ID checks when I’m in the continent. In Hungary while walking around Budapest late at night, I was asked by some (polite and friendly) police to show my ID, which they have every right to in Hungary. Thankfully they accepted my UK driving licence. Likewise, when crossing the Belgium/Germany border on local bus 14 (Eupen-Aachen) I had to get my passport out my bag - doing this with an ID card would be more convienient - plus I don’t really like getting my passport out on a public bus.

 

[DoubleLemon]

I do not support ID cards.

I also note that the PM has it the wrong way round. He says that we will need an ID card to work and rent in the UK. This is not correct. It is birth as a British citizen that gives us the right to work and rent in the UK, not any state programme.

They give us NI numbers today because we have the right to work, not to grant us that right. The government has no power to take these rights away.

I signed the petition and you can do so too - here.

an ni number is not a right to work document it's an Id to track payments for pension entitlement.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Sep 2025 ==

Or they will simply equip themselves with false ID or cloned ID or find alternative ways round it. As an example, for years now it has been getting more and more difficult to open a bank account due to regulations intended to prevent money laundering. This makes life more difficult for honest people but the dishonest ones just find alternative ways round.

you seem to think this will be a like for like replacement to the current systems. if it's single use token based it's incredibly hard if not impossible to forge. you can't force the apple pay/Google pay virtual card on the device as its stored locally on the device and a token is used to approve the payment.

 

[Razorblades]

Petition now over 1,994,000 signatures, was about 1,250,000 when I signed it this time yesterday.

Starmer's Poll Tax, maybe it will be the hill he dies on, flogging Tony Blair's flawed paradigm.

 

[1D54]

Petition now over 1,994,000 signatures, was about 1,250,000 when I signed it this time yesterday.

Starmer's Poll Tax, maybe it will be the hill he dies on, flogging Tony Blair's flawed paradigm.

Coupled with his watered down welfare reform Bill. Here is a man potentially in serious trouble along with his disgusting party.

 

[AM9]

I do not support ID cards.

I also note that the PM has it the wrong way round. He says that we will need an ID card to work and rent in the UK. This is not correct. It is birth as a British citizen that gives us the right to work and rent in the UK, not any state programme.I signed the petition and you can do so too - here.

I've highlighted the operative word in your post, i.e. 'will'. Whatever is the current position is not necessarily set in stone and likely will be changed.

They give us NI numbers today because we have the right to work, not to grant us that right. The government has no power to take these rights away.

@DoubleLemon has corrected you here.

I signed the petition and you can do so too - here.

That's your right to do so but it won't necessarily change anything.

 

[DoubleLemon]

an Id card (based on what I have read) is a single universal way to prove you are who you say you are. replacing the multiple, unreliable not checked ways people are currently asked to do this. this can then be cross checked.

it was soles a number of issues some of which have left people homeless and unable to get things like a bank account.

the fact there were calls by the conservatives and reform for this up to the announcement when suddenly they are against it tells you a lot

I hope people are binning thier computers or removing themselves from the Internet as there's far simpler and cheaper ways for the government to know everything about you and take action based on that where the Internet company gets the blame than an Id card.

this sticks of Russia doing socal media interference. the same outlandish and stupid "what Ifs..." that we already do or have the capability to do (but these people seem unaware of) suggests they don't live or understand the UK.

 

[sor]

Another concern is data security - think JLR, Marks & Spencer etc. Some division / department of the government already have all the details but right now if a data breach into one division how much can be obtained? If this goes through all the data will together and potentially across several divisions / systems. Of course we will be assured totally secure and impossible to misuse / clone / fake but in reality ......

Those databases are already major cybersecurity targets, and they are already used as part of existing online services. So far the government has managed to achieve a much better track record than the companies you mention. DVLA gets criticised for who they sell their data to, but of course that's not a cyberattack. The devil is in the detail, which isn't yet public (I'll change my mind on this project if I hear that certain large American IT firms are involved), but it's hard to see why this would be any more concerning than what is already possible on gov dot uk.

For example, my dad recently decided to get a power of attorney set up. If you are included on one then the government gives you a code to put into a gov.uk website to register it and make it easy to use should you need to (eg you can generate share codes to give to organisations that need it). This requires a gov.uk "onelogin" that can also be used with an expanding set of other government services. To create an account, you have to prove your identity such as through a video clip + photo of gov issued ID or through answering questions that only you should know the answer to. I would presume the digital ID would be a more secure re-spin of this concept.

I do not support ID cards.

I also note that the PM has it the wrong way round. He says that we will need an ID card to work and rent in the UK. This is not correct. It is birth as a British citizen that gives us the right to work and rent in the UK, not any state programme.

Employers and landlords are already required to check your right to work or rent and you are therefore required to show adequate proof. The ID card would not be that different to showing a passport or birth certificate as evidence of being a citizen, but it would be a document that could be much more easily verified and would apply to non-citizens as well.

They give us NI numbers today because we have the right to work, not to grant us that right. The government has no power to take these rights away.

What do you think will change with the introduction of this system? An actual tyrannical government could do plenty to stop you working or deprive you of your freedom already. Elsewhere I've seen mentioned that it would be used to stop you getting the state pension and other benefits. They could do this today with a quick change to the NI database.

I remain baffled as to how any mention of ID cards causes such overreactions.

 

[AM9]

Right to work checks were introduced in the Asylum and Immigration Act 1996.
What does being ‘obviously British’ mean? Especially since 1983 it’s not a given that being born in the UK makes you a UK citizen and thus entitled to work here.

Maybe it is 'obviously British' in a Reform party sense.

 

[Razorblades]

2,150,047 had signed the petition at 10.08.

By the time I'd had chance to type this, ready to send, the number had risen to 2,151,036.

That's a substantial number of swivel-eyed conspiracy theorists, maybe we'll have a certifiable number of the Certifiable at the end of this process, that Dear Leader will be able to demonise at every opportunity.

(2,152,344 and counting)

 

[alex397]

2,150,047 had signed the petition at 10.08.

By the time I'd had chance to type this, ready to send, the number had risen to 2,151,036.

That's a substantial number of swivel-eyed conspiracy theorists, maybe we'll have a certifiable number of the Certifiable at the end of this process, that Dear Leader will be able to demonise at every opportunity.

(2,152,344 and counting)

It looks like mass hysteria will win then.

 

[dangie]

It looks like mass hysteria will win then.

The lunatics are taking over the asylum.
I really don’t know where it is coming from, but there’s forces trying their damndest to drag this country into the abyss. I honestly think there’s outside (foreign) influences involved.

 

[Razorblades]

It looks like mass hysteria will win then.

One trusting person's mass hysteria is a swivel-eyed loon's circumspect cynicism.

 

[AM9]

One trusting person's mass hysteria is a swivel-eyed loon's circumspect cynicism.

... and circumspect cynicism is on the route to conspiracy theorism

 

[Purple Train]

It looks like mass hysteria will win then.

The lunatics are taking over the asylum.
I really don’t know where it is coming from, but there’s forces trying their damndest to drag this country into the abyss. I honestly think there’s outside (foreign) influences involved.

Agreed on both counts (and nobody can accuse me of not being a cynical person...!) - I honestly despair sometimes. I pride myself on being as rational as I can be, and it feels nigh on impossible sometimes what with the state of discourse in this country. This isn't specific to this issue, as a quick glance through General Discussion can confirm (and this isn't a go at the Forum, before anyone shouts at me, it's just the easiest illustration to use), but this is certainly the starkest, or perhaps most widespread, example I can think of recently*. Cynicism is healthy, sure, but this level of "mass hysteria" is ridiculous.

*I'm reminded of the outcry over ULEZ and Low Traffic Neighbourhoods, but that didn't seem nearly so prevalent.

 

[jfollows]

I don’t agree with or support ID cards for two reasons:

1. Firstly, because they won’t do what they’re supposed to do. Proof of identity, right to work, right to rent can all be done today. Maybe a bit clunky at times, but this is really about countering Reform rather than doing something which is of benefit.
2. Mission creep. Now that we all have one, let’s make it mandatory to show it on demand to the police. Or whoever.

Fundamentally this is about Labour versus Reform. I don’t have any intention of voting for Reform but I don’t agree with this policy from Labour. I think my vote is heading back to Liberal Democrats now.

 

[brad465]

Petition now over 1,994,000 signatures, was about 1,250,000 when I signed it this time yesterday.

Starmer's Poll Tax, maybe it will be the hill he dies on, flogging Tony Blair's flawed paradigm.

2,150,047 had signed the petition at 10.08.

By the time I'd had chance to type this, ready to send, the number had risen to 2,151,036.

That's a substantial number of swivel-eyed conspiracy theorists, maybe we'll have a certifiable number of the Certifiable at the end of this process, that Dear Leader will be able to demonise at every opportunity.

(2,152,344 and counting)

I wouldn't trust the Parliament petitions' website until there is concrete evidence that it is not subject to misuse, such as people outside the UK being allowed to sign them, and/or one person using multiple email addresses to sign several times (in theory I could sign a petition 5 times if I wanted). One of the most popular petitions ever, about having a second referendum, had a significant number of dodgy signatures removed.

I have no doubt that there's a lot of opposition of this policy, but putting faith in this approach isn't going to achieve anything, and when it's rejected (because let's face it, when has a petition ever achieved anything, regardless of purpose?), it will strengthen the feeling of victimhood that will send the country over the edge even further. Now I don't blame those aggrieved here, I blame those politicians who take advantage of human psychology for malicious purposes, and "journalists" who don't scrutinise policy, instead doing whatever generates clicks. What should be happening is a space for rational constructive debate is created, that allows specific concerns to be raised and mitigations to these to be put forward.

 

[martin butler]

I think if we are going to have digital ID, then why not phrase out old style passports, and driving licences, and replace them with a card type ID card, that will be linked to your government id, one card, that police can scan, to check driving licence, restrictions, are you wanted, immigration status, and as your id at elections, a card terminal, you put your card in, it validates , and allows you to place your vote, all in the security of the booth, it does not need to be compulsory to keep on you, but it makes it easier if you do, and get asked by officialdom to prove your identity, same as we do already,

 

[JamesT]

I think if we are going to have digital ID, then why not phrase out old style passports, and driving licences, and replace them with a card type ID card, that will be linked to your government id, one card, that police can scan, to check driving licence, restrictions, are you wanted, immigration status, and as your id at elections, a card terminal, you put your card in, it validates , and allows you to place your vote, all in the security of the booth, it does not need to be compulsory to keep on you, but it makes it easier if you do, and get asked by officialdom to prove your identity, same as we do already,

Both of those documents are used internationally, so we need to retain them in a physical form that other countries can handle. At least, until there is international agreement on a digital only version that all countries will accept.

 

[signed]

then why not phrase out old style passports, and driving licences

That will happen eventually, EU ID cards nowadays are functionally respecting the same standard as passports, some US states have digital drivers licenses. The biggest hurdle is going to be getting with every country to recognize them. Some non-EU, but close to EU, also allow EU ID cards instead of passports (Tunisia, Egypt, Turkey)

By the time that's done, passports will have been replaced by whatever digital thing exist at that time.

 

[trainmania100]

Don't really mind personally, I guess it could be helpful. I never have my driving license on me, but it would be good to have on my phone. Just sounds like more rubbish I'll be adding to my phone I'll never even use

 

[bahnause]

Switzerland, which tends to be rather critical when it comes to government digitalisation projects, has today voted in favour of introducing a state-regulated and issued e-ID.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Sep 2025 ==

Another concern is data security - think JLR, Marks & Spencer etc. Some division / department of the government already have all the details but right now if a data breach into one division how much can be obtained? If this goes through all the data will together and potentially across several divisions / systems. Of course we will be assured totally secure and impossible to misuse / clone / fake but in reality ......

What kind of data security risk are you assuming here? Or to put it another way: Why would an e-ID require a database?

 

[Flying Snail]

I wouldn't trust the Parliament petitions' website until there is concrete evidence that it is not subject to misuse, such as people outside the UK being allowed to sign them, and/or one person using multiple email addresses to sign several times (in theory I could sign a petition 5 times if I wanted). One of the most popular petitions ever, about having a second referendum, had a significant number of dodgy signatures removed.

Sounds like something a digital ID card would be perfect for...