I should have been clearer, appreciate for some cars it needs 3/4 people for emissions to be close or match but depends on car. Mine is quoted at 109g/km and is close to manufacturer claimed economy so the two easily achieves better than a Voyager.
I've found the refurb pendolino seats to be slightly less comfortable as they have less padding, but for me it's worth it as they feel so much more spacious and less cramped.
A fully staffed XC voyager will have 2 TMs booked on it, but often there's shortages, hence my post.
I see, well that's me told then.
Fares get dropped to fill empty seats, that happens all over (or at least it did before the pandemic). That's why you could find some ridiculously cheap XC Advances (including 1st) at certain times of night.
The TOCs are allowed to do it if they can convince the Treasury that it will bring in more money. That's an important distinction. No more cutting fares on hunches or taking a calculated risk.
In contrast fares on LNER and GWR have increased, through reductions in advance quotas, despite the additional capacity the 80x have brought to those routes. It is now quite rare to find advance fares at rates much below the walk up fares, most times of the day.
As many 80x are leaving Paddington full & standing, it would appear that there isn't much excess capacity available. Where the 80x have brought additional capacity to the network it has been filled - faster journeys and less crowding will both encourage people to travel which then leads to more crowding. It's a bit like adding extra lanes to the M25, they just fill up. I wonder how busy the 09:04 is, and how many on that train bought an SOR.
Anytime fares have increased steeply to price off demand that couldn't easily (i.e. cheaply) be accommodated. That's entirely my point. Since the pandemic, we're told that peak travel demand is not what it once was, therefore there is no need to price off demand so much and it may prove profitable to either reduce Anytime fares, or ease restrictions. That's exactly what Virgin did on Fridays - they realised that it would be profitable to cut fares to reflect changing customer demand.
That's not the "whole premise" at all. It's a significant factor, but it's well known that the government has told the railway (on various occasions dating back to BR) "there is no money for more rolling stock, put fares up to solve overcrowding". Hiking up fares therefore has been the only way to avoid leaving passengers behind.
I agree. I used them regularly during lockdown (Cross Country) when they were lightly loaded. You nearly always got a table to yourself, nice big windows and reasonably comfy seats. They were also nice and warm in the colder months.
That's because demand has risen faster than supply (if supply has indeed risen at all!). Most of these trains are really busy, which is why the advance quotas have been reduced – there's no need to sell tickets cheaply if you can sell them at full price. But add enough extra capacity and you won't be able to fill it at full price, so that's when they offer cheap advance tickets, because it's better to get some money for a seat than none.
If they have two, who is ‘top dog’ as it were? I know on the planes if we have two captains flying together, one is always designated as commander as per the rostering software. How does it work with two TMs?
3 + 2 ? Surely not, may as well have run the service with a 4 car 150!
Could just couple a couple 150 to the back of a short form Voyager and hope it doesn't fall apart.150s on long distance trains... Sounds like exactly the way forward. Maybe when they are displaced from Northern and TfW they can go to XC
At least the ex TfW (as they then will be) have 2+2.
Then see how many of those who say they dislike Voyagers actually choose to board the 150...Could just couple a couple 150 to the back of a short form Voyager and hope it doesn't fall apart.
XC amalgamate Voyagers, throwing whatever carriages they can find that fit to extend them.
Not quite a noisy 150 but I did have the misfortune of travelling on a WY Metro class 321 (I think) with 3+2 seating all the way from Kings Cross to Leeds. Wouldn’t want to do that on a 150150s on long distance trains... Sounds like exactly the way forward. Maybe when they are displaced from Northern and TfW they can go to XC
At least the ex TfW (as they then will be) have 2+2.
It's hardly exploitation, it's a budget fare for people who want it. Standard class passengers would still get to go in standard class, it's just an option for someone who wanted very cheap fares. Izy and other low-cost operators offer(ed) far less luxurious seating (including the flip-down seats in vestibules and possibly standing tickets but I'm not sure about the latter) and nobody blamed them for exploiting people.
Yeah sorry I didn’t mean this situation was necessarily exploiting people, just trying to fully exploit the options available to him. I meant that generally people in his position don’t get there without stamping on a few people on the way.
If there's 2 TMs, the one is classed as 'working' the train and the other one is the 'assist'.If they have two, who is ‘top dog’ as it were? I know on the planes if we have two captains flying together, one is always designated as commander as per the rostering software. How does it work with two TMs?
Sorry for all the questions guys!
Laura
