Ex LNER (and Grand Central) Mark 4 sets for TfW

[markymark2000]

Cardiff drivers don't sign Crewe - Chester. So unless there happens to be a spare Crewe or Holyhead driver handy, if it's got a Cardiff driver on it can't go via Crewe.

In that case, the staff onboard my service said that it was only because of the train type that they couldn't go that way so I must have had a Crewe or Holyhead crew. Depending on the disruption and availability of other staff, is it still acceptable for 1 driver who knows the train and 1 driver who knows the route to work together? Same for guards?

I suppose staffing is probably the easier one to overcome still with staff of course being flexible. If a train doesn't fit, it won't fit irrespective of what staff are onboard.

 

[craigybagel]

In that case, the staff onboard my service said that it was only because of the train type that they couldn't go that way so I must have had a Crewe or Holyhead crew. Depending on the disruption and availability of other staff, is it still acceptable for 1 driver who knows the train and 1 driver who knows the route to work together? Same for guards?

In theory yes but in this particular example probably not. TfW policy is that where a 67 driver needs piloting by another driver over a route they do not sign, that driver must also be qualified to drive locomotives.

I suppose staffing is probably the easier one to overcome still with staff of course being flexible. If a train doesn't fit, it won't fit irrespective of what staff are onboard.

True, but it's one reason why it presumably wasn't deemed worthwhile to clear the route earlier.

 

[ABB125]

In theory yes but in this particular example probably not. TfW policy is that where a 67 driver needs piloting by another driver over a route they do not sign, that driver must also be qualified to drive locomotives.

Do they have to be specifically qualified on class 67s, or will any locomotive suffice?

And surely this policy is a bit wasteful - my understanding is that the whole point of a route conductor is that the original driver can continue over unsigned track?

 

[craigybagel]

Do they have to be specifically qualified on class 67s, or will any locomotive suffice?

My understanding is it's any type of loco. That said, it's an extremely rare scenario anyway

And surely this policy is a bit wasteful - my understanding is that the whole point of a route conductor is that the original driver can continue over unsigned track?

As someone who is qualified to drive both I can see the sense in it. When I learnt 67s it felt like having to relearn my routes again at the same time as it's a very different style of driving. If you try and drive them the same way you'd drive a DMU it's not going to end well.

 

[sd0733]

Another attempt to get HD05 off Crewe is planned to be made on Friday.
If it all works it will run as 5T96 to Chester Friday evening which then forms 20:02 Chester to Holyhead to stable there until Tuesday.

That would leave HD02 and HD03 at Crewe with one of those due to head for SDO fitting and emergency window removal next week.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

Another attempt to get HD05 off Crewe is planned to be made on Friday.
If it all works it will run as 5T96 to Chester Friday evening which then forms 20:02 Chester to Holyhead to stable there until Tuesday.

That would leave HD02 and HD03 at Crewe with one of those due to head for SDO fitting and emergency window removal next week.

Which windows are they removing, and why? Will it be 67020 on with HD05 and which service will it run on Tuesday due to late starting with strikes?

 

[sd0733]

Which windows are they removing, and why? Will it be 67020 on with HD05 and which service will it run on Tuesday due to late starting with strikes?

All the emergency window system (the big green boxes above the middle windows) is removed and replaced by standard glass, Its all gone on the ex GC sets and its got to be gone by Dec 31st I believe on the others.

They will normally cut out the first train each direction so would likely be doing 11:33 Holyhead-Cardiff-Holyhead on Tues and Thursday then the full diagram on the Friday finishing at Canton for the weekend.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

All the emergency window system (the big green boxes above the middle windows) is removed and replaced by standard glass, Its all gone on the ex GC sets and its got to be gone by Dec 31st I believe on the others.

They will normally cut out the first train each direction so would likely be doing 11:33 Holyhead-Cardiff-Holyhead on Tues and Thursday then the full diagram on the Friday finishing at Canton for the weekend.

That's great info thanks.

 

[jfollows]

Stop boards for the Mark 4 sets have been installed at Wilmslow station; I was waiting on the platform today and someone came along and removed the black plastic covering, then went back along the platform and took a picture of the new sign with his iPad, then went back and replaced the black plastic covering! So they're there but remain covered up for now.

 

[GWVillager]

Stop boards for the Mark 4 sets have been installed at Wilmslow station; I was waiting on the platform today and someone came along and removed the black plastic covering, then went back along the platform and took a picture of the new sign with his iPad, then went back and replaced the black plastic covering! So they're there but remain covered up for now.

Is there any actual reason that they're still covered?

 

[jfollows]

Is there any actual reason that they're still covered?

I was a bit surprised when he covered them up again, to be honest. I'd been thinking of taking a picture of the sign, so that put paid to that. And then my train came in.

 

[anamyd]

All the emergency window system (the big green boxes above the middle windows) is removed and replaced by standard glass

Why?

 

[sd0733]

No longer

Why?

Believe they're no longer compliant as signed emergency exits as they can't be tested without smashing the window so impossible to know if it actually works. That's what I was told anyway!


Due to faults on 67020 it's currently touch and go if HD05 makes it off Crewe now. Depends when it can be fixed or loco changed in time

 

[SuperLuke2334]

No longer
Believe they're no longer compliant as signed emergency exits as they can't be tested without smashing the window so impossible to know if it actually works. That's what I was told anyway!


Due to faults on 67020 it's currently touch and go if HD05 makes it off Crewe now. Depends when it can be fixed or loco changed in time

Oh golly that's not good news! Really hope they can get 020 going again quickly as it would be amazing to see that loco out on its inaugural run with the black set.
Please do keep us informed.

 

[sd0733]

Oh golly that's not good news! Really hope they can get 020 going again quickly as it would be amazing to see that loco out on its inaugural run with the black set.
Please do keep us informed.

There's a backup plan now to send HD02 back out until Tuesday where it could be swapped onto the diagram on Tuesday evening at Chester instead.

HD02 is the set now planned to go for SDO which is required to go ASAP to get it back for December and really HD05 is wanted in service by Friday or its rememberance day wrap was a bit pointless

 

[SuperLuke2334]

There's a backup plan now to send HD02 back out until Tuesday where it could be swapped onto the diagram on Tuesday evening at Chester instead.

HD02 is the set now planned to go for SDO which is required to go ASAP to get it back for December and really HD05 is wanted in service by Friday or its rememberance day wrap was a bit pointless

Indeed it would be. Sounds like a good plan for now and we'll see how it pans out.

 

[victormildrew]

Reading the comments about the mk4s starting service in December, have i missed anyone saying what is the actual start date for the Cardiff/Manchester services?.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Nov 2022 ==

Reading the comments about the mk4s starting service in December, have i missed anyone saying what is the actual start date for the Cardiff/Manchester services?.

 

[Watershed]

Reading the comments about the mk4s starting service in December, have i missed anyone saying what is the actual start date for the Cardiff/Manchester services?.

The services themselves will continue to run (albeit to slightly different timings, and with rubbish connections to/from West Wales in most hours).

In theory these will, in part, run using 3 Mk4s diagrams from December - but I won't be holding my breath!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

The services themselves will continue to run (albeit to slightly different timings, and with rubbish connections to/from West Wales in most hours).

In theory these will, in part, run using 3 Mk4s diagrams from December - but I won't be holding my breath!

I think he means the specific date for the MK4 introduction on this route, which should be the Timetable Change

 

[SuperLuke2334]

Reading the comments about the mk4s starting service in December, have i missed anyone saying what is the actual start date for the Cardiff/Manchester services?.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Nov 2022 ==

Reading the comments about the mk4s starting service in December, have i missed anyone saying what is the actual start date for the Cardiff/Manchester services?.

Should be starting on the 12th December, the date of the timetable change.

The services themselves will continue to run (albeit to slightly different timings, and with rubbish connections to/from West Wales in most hours).

In theory these will, in part, run using 3 Mk4s diagrams from December - but I won't be holding my breath!

I understand from a few senior staff I've spoken to on the recent training runs that it will be 2 Manchester diagrams to begin with, moving up to 3 very quickly and then 4 when all sets are back from SDO fitment.

 

[sd0733]

Indeed it would be. Sounds like a good plan for now and we'll see how it pans out.

HD02 now going out this evening so the faults on 05 obviously not fixed.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

HD02 now going out this evening so the faults on 05 obviously not fixed.

Got you, hope they can fix the faults over the weekend ready to potentially be swapped on Monday (if timetable reinstated) or Tuesday.

 

[sd0733]

Got you, hope they can fix the faults over the weekend ready to potentially be swapped on Monday (if timetable reinstated) or Tuesday.

Very unlikely to be Monday. The paths are already in for a set swap at Chester on 1W96/1T96 on Tuesday.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

Very unlikely to be Monday. The paths are already in for a set swap at Chester on 1W96/1T96 on Tuesday.

Great thanks for the update. I should see it out on Friday. Assuming 67020 is the loco with the set still or has that gone out with HD02? No allocation showing on RTT.

 

[sd0733]

Great thanks for the update. I should see it out on Friday. Assuming 67020 is the loco with the set still or has that gone out with HD02? No allocation showing on RTT.

The faults were mostly with the 67 so unlikely that's been put on another set.
HD02 had an original TFW loco on it but couldn't tell you which I'm afraid. Looks as if it's cancelled now due to a fault so presume issues with both sets.

 

[victormildrew]

Should be starting on the 12th December, the date of the timetable change.

I understand from a few senior staff I've spoken to on the recent training runs that it will be 2 Manchester diagrams to begin with, moving up to 3 very quickly and then 4 when all sets are back from SDO fitment.

Thank you for that info.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

The faults were mostly with the 67 so unlikely that's been put on another set.
HD02 had an original TFW loco on it but couldn't tell you which I'm afraid. Looks as if it's cancelled now due to a fault so presume issues with both sets.

Ah thats not good. Hopefully things will be sorted soon enough.

 

[sd0733]

67020 and HD05 are finally heading into service this week. On it's way to Canton now as https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:99448/2022-11-08/detailed.
Should then enter service on 06:45 Cardiff to Holyhead on Thursday with HD02 coming out of service on Wednesday night after arrival at Cardiff. This will then head off for SDO fitting.

 

[warwickshire]

67020 and HD05 are finally heading into service this week. On it's way to Canton now as https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:99448/2022-11-08/detailed.
Should then enter service on 06:45 Cardiff to Holyhead on Thursday with HD02 coming out of service on Wednesday night after arrival at Cardiff. This will then head off for SDO fitting.

Has HD01 been fitted with SDO and hopefully be back into service soon presumably?? If anyone kindly knows.
Thank you.

 

[Jacob Porrett]

67020 and HD05 are finally heading into service this week. On it's way to Canton now as https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:99448/2022-11-08/detailed.
Should then enter service on 06:45 Cardiff to Holyhead on Thursday with HD02 coming out of service on Wednesday night after arrival at Cardiff. This will then head off for SDO fitting.

How many more 67s will be painted in the black/red livery for the Manchester mk4s?