Avanti West Coast timetable

[Bletchleyite]

1A32 1215 MAN-EUS CAPE today due to 2 unit failures.
That means a gap of 80 minutes southbound.
So much for Avanti saying they will have extra drivers and stock to run a more reliable service!

2 unit failures? That is pretty bad luck.

 

[Bald Rick]

1A32 1215 MAN-EUS CAPE today due to 2 unit failures.
That means a gap of 80 minutes southbound.
So much for Avanti saying they will have extra drivers and stock to run a more reliable service!

Why do people make such statements? It’s the first full cancellation by Avanti this week. That’s fantastic performance by any measure. It just looks like you have been waiting for a cancellation to make such a point.

 

[172101]

Why do people make such statements? It’s the first full cancellation by Avanti this week. That’s fantastic performance by any measure. It just looks like you have been waiting for a cancellation to make such a point.

I wasn't waiting to make such a point, but I was waiting for the 1215 departure! The set was taken to cover the 1155 departure which I missed by minutes so had to wait the full 80 minutes. The only plus is the 1315 was not as busy as you would expect it to be with such a big gap, which proves that 2 tph can cope at present.
Also I don't think making a statement like "its the first full cancellation this week" is anything to be proud off! That should be the norm.

 

[CHESHIRECAT]

hope you claimed delay repay !

 

[172101]

I did.

 

[Bald Rick]

Also I don't think making a statement like "its the first full cancellation this week" is anything to be proud off! That should be the norm.

a laudable aim, but in reality, typically around 2% of all trains are cancelled for some or part of their journey (For any reason). For Avanti that’s an average of about 6 a day in normal times.

so for the first cancellation of the week to be on Thursday lunchtime is virtually unheard of. Obviously I’m sorry your journey was delayed by an hour. But these things do happen.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Jan 2022 ==

 

[Ridercross]

So, I am booked on the 1834 from EUS to BHM next Saturday, but according to National Rail and Avanti:

We don't yet know if or how this journey will be affected by engineering work. Please check back closer to the time of travel.

Really? Are we in a position that 7 days before travel Network Rail still can't confirm how engineering work will be affecting trains on the main line to the West Midlands!

 

[The Planner]

So, I am booked on the 1834 from EUS to BHM next Saturday, but according to National Rail and Avanti:

We don't yet know if or how this journey will be affected by engineering work. Please check back closer to the time of travel.

Really? Are we in a position that 7 days before travel Network Rail still can't confirm how engineering work will be affecting trains on the main line to the West Midlands!

No.

 

[Class 170101]

It will be because (some) operators are changing timetables at the last minute.

 

[Falcon1200]

This is my experience of booking with Avanti for a family member to travel with myself:

Tuesday 25th Jan: Booked direct with Avanti, via their website, for the 1130 Euston-Glasgow C today, Tuesday 01st Feb.
Wednesday 26th Jan: Printed the ticket at Glasgow C which shows 1130 ex Euston.
Monday 31st Jan (yesterday): Received at 1325 a 'You're travelling with us tomorrow' email showing 1130 ex Euston.
Tuesday 01st Feb (today): Checked with Realtime Trains for the train formation which shows 1110 ex Euston. Double-checked with National Rail Enquiries Journey Planner which also shows 1110 ex Euston. Triple-checked with Avanti's own website which, again, also shows 1110 ex Euston.

So, what is the actual departure time of our train ? I have no idea now and it seems Avanti do not either, all we can do is be sure to be at Euston by 1110, although this leaves us 20 minutes less to cross London than planned. I will report back later.

 

[Keverton1978]

I’ve been looking to book a ticket with Avanti in March & again in April Manchester - Euston - Manchester. I am only seeing 1tph for the majority of the day. Does this mean that frequency will not be increased after February 25th?

 

[55002]

This is my experience of booking with Avanti for a family member to travel with myself:

Tuesday 25th Jan: Booked direct with Avanti, via their website, for the 1130 Euston-Glasgow C today, Tuesday 01st Feb.
Wednesday 26th Jan: Printed the ticket at Glasgow C which shows 1130 ex Euston.
Monday 31st Jan (yesterday): Received at 1325 a 'You're travelling with us tomorrow' email showing 1130 ex Euston.
Tuesday 01st Feb (today): Checked with Realtime Trains for the train formation which shows 1110 ex Euston. Double-checked with National Rail Enquiries Journey Planner which also shows 1110 ex Euston. Triple-checked with Avanti's own website which, again, also shows 1110 ex Euston.

So, what is the actual departure time of our train ? I have no idea now and it seems Avanti do not either, all we can do is be sure to be at Euston by 1110, although this leaves us 20 minutes less to cross London than planned. I will report back later.

If it says 1110 on RTT I’d go with that. Looks like it’s been 1110 for a few days at least.. no idea why all the other info you have shows 1130. That’s bad. Even says 1110 on their own timetable. It still gets to Warrington at same time as original 1130 would too, but does include a 7 min stop at Crewe. not sure where the other 13 mins get lost, timetable padding at its finest.

https://www.avantiwestcoast.co.uk/-/media/avanti-timetables/31-jan-to-4-feb-public.pdf

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

If it says 1110 on RTT I’d go with that. Looks like it’s been 1110 for a few days at least.. no idea why all the other info you have shows 1130. That’s bad. Even says 1110 on their own timetable. It still gets to Warrington at same time as original 1130 would too, but does include a 7 min stop at Crewe. not sure where the other 13 mins get lost, timetable padding at its finest.

To enable the Crewe stop (to compensate for other cancellations), the xx30 Glasgow takes the path of the xx10 Chester service.
It then picks up its normal path at Warrington, but has to fritter away the rest of the 20 minutes somewhere.
This has been a regular timetable tactic since the first lockdown.

 

[55002]

To enable the Crewe stop (to compensate for other cancellations), the xx30 Glasgow takes the path of the xx10 Chester service.
It then picks up its normal path at Warrington, but has to fritter away the rest of the 20 minutes somewhere.
This has been a regular timetable tactic since the first lockdown.

Ah, thanks

 

[Peter0124]

To enable the Crewe stop (to compensate for other cancellations), the xx30 Glasgow takes the path of the xx10 Chester service.
It then picks up its normal path at Warrington, but has to fritter away the rest of the 20 minutes somewhere.
This has been a regular timetable tactic since the first lockdown.

Its not much use to Crewe anyway cause it trails behind the xx07 Liverpool
Why cant it just leave at xx27 or something?

 

[The Planner]

Its not much use to Crewe anyway cause it trails behind the xx07 Liverpool
Why cant it just leave at xx27 or something?

Earliest it could leave is xx.28 without catching the xx.20 Manchester at Colwich. Those extra two minutes wouldn't allow a Crewe stop.

 

[Peter0124]

Earliest it could leave is xx.28 without catching the xx.20 Manchester at Colwich. Those extra two minutes wouldn't allow a Crewe stop.

It mostly seems to catch up with the xx.07 at Stafford, so why not run it behind the Manchester service? It shouldn't impact times further north too much unless I'm mistaken. Or of course just run it xx.28 and then try and fit it into the junctions further north and arrive slightly later into Glasgow though I can see how this would be difficult.

It would offer a more clockface timetable Euston-Crewe (xx07, xx28, xx35 via BHM, xx46 LM) rather than (xx07, xx10, xx35, xx46) etc. And keep the Glasgow timings similar to their usual self.

Though I know nothing at all about Timetable Planning so I am probably not understanding the full reason why it cannot run xx.28

 

[Falcon1200]

If it says 1110 on RTT I’d go with that. Looks like it’s been 1110 for a few days at least.. no idea why all the other info you have shows 1130. That’s bad. Even says 1110 on their own timetable. It still gets to Warrington at same time as original 1130 would too, but does include a 7 min stop at Crewe. not sure where the other 13 mins get lost, timetable padding at its finest.

https://www.avantiwestcoast.co.uk/-/media/avanti-timetables/31-jan-to-4-feb-public.pdf

So, we did indeed depart at 1110, fortunately we got to Euston in time ! I caught the 1110 several times in 2020 and 2021, and understand the reason for the retaining, however the 1130 shown on the ticket and yesterday's email is indeed baffling. I will be speaking to Avanti later, perhaps I could claim Delay Repay for missing the 1110 and getting to Glasgow an hour late on the 1210 ?!!

 

[The Planner]

It mostly seems to catch up with the xx.07 at Stafford, so why not run it behind the Manchester service? It shouldn't impact times further north too much unless I'm mistaken. Or of course just run it xx.28 and then try and fit it into the junctions further north and arrive slightly later into Glasgow though I can see how this would be difficult.

It would offer a more clockface timetable Euston-Crewe (xx07, xx28, xx35 via BHM, xx46 LM) rather than (xx07, xx10, xx35, xx46) etc. And keep the Glasgow timings similar to their usual self.

Though I know nothing at all about Timetable Planning so I am probably not understanding the full reason why it cannot run xx.28

Not sure why its catching the 07 up, so something must be up with that and that should be running better anyway as the 03 Brum isnt causing it problems at Rugby.

 

[jfollows]

Not sure why its catching the 07 up, so something must be up with that and that should be running better anyway as the 03 Brum isnt causing it problems at Rugby.

Because the xx.10 Chester used to call at Milton Keynes whereas the xx.10 Glasgow doesn't? It'll mean that the xx.10 Glasgow will catch up with the xx.07 at Stafford whereas the Milton Keynes call on the Chester service meant that it didn't?

1S58 11:10 Euston-Glasgow today (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C75620/2022-02-01/detailed#allox_id=0) 6 minutes early approaching Stafford (pass 12:27 2 minutes early), 2 minutes early after Stafford, arrived Crewe 2 minutes early at 12:45.
1F15 11:07 Euston-Liverpool today (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C75510/2022-02-01/detailed#allox_id=0) on time departure from Stafford 12:24, arrived Crewe 12:41 on time.

[PS The xx:10 Chester used to be a possible service for me to use to Wilmslow, but I didn't like it because it was a Voyager and because it called at Milton Keynes. When the Liverpool services had a Crewe stop added this became preferable to me - non-stop to Stafford plus a Pendolino. The xx:20 via Stockport is slower than the xx:40 to Wilmslow, so in the normal timetable I have possible departures home at xx:00 via Stockport , xx:07 & xx:10 via Crewe and xx:40 direct from Euston.]

 

[Moonshot]

I’ve been looking to book a ticket with Avanti in March & again in April Manchester - Euston - Manchester. I am only seeing 1tph for the majority of the day. Does this mean that frequency will not be increased after February 25th?

I asked that very question of the Avanti staff at Piccadilly only this morning.......that is the impression they have as well. Which is a bit disturbing.

 

[Mag_seven]

I asked that very question of the Avanti staff at Piccadilly only this morning.......that is the impression they have as well. Which is a bit disturbing.

Avanti appear to be the worst of the IC TOCs that operate out of London in getting a normal TT back. For example there is more or less a full long distance service back on LNER, GWR and EMT.

 

[Peter0124]

I asked that very question of the Avanti staff at Piccadilly only this morning.......that is the impression they have as well. Which is a bit disturbing.

What a shambles if true

 

[The Planner]

Because the xx.10 Chester used to call at Milton Keynes whereas the xx.10 Glasgow doesn't? It'll mean that the xx.10 Glasgow will catch up with the xx.07 at Stafford whereas the Milton Keynes call on the Chester service meant that it didn't?

1S58 11:10 Euston-Glasgow today (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C75620/2022-02-01/detailed#allox_id=0) 6 minutes early approaching Stafford (pass 12:27 2 minutes early), 2 minutes early after Stafford, arrived Crewe 2 minutes early at 12:45.
1F15 11:07 Euston-Crewe today (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C75510/2022-02-01/detailed#allox_id=0) on time departure from Stafford 12:24, arrived Crewe 12:41 on time.

[PS The xx:10 Chester used to be a possible service for me to use to Wilmslow, but I didn't like it because it was a Voyager and because it called at Milton Keynes. When the Liverpool services had a Crewe stop added this became preferable to me - non-stop to Stafford plus a Pendolino. The xx:20 via Stockport is slower than the xx:40 to Wilmslow, so in the normal timetable I have possible departures home at xx:00 via Stockport , xx:07 & xx:10 via Crewe and xx:40 direct from Euston.]

Usual quagmire of issues based on that, the Glasgow is pathed out for a non running Royal Mail train hence it running that early come Stafford by the looks of it.

 

[Peter0124]

I’ve been looking to book a ticket with Avanti in March & again in April Manchester - Euston - Manchester. I am only seeing 1tph for the majority of the day. Does this mean that frequency will not be increased after February 25th?

I can see that Avanti don't seem to be selling Advance tickets on the app for Euston to Manchester trains other than the xx.20s. I really hope this 1tph shambles isn't being kept after 25th Feb. Hopefully they just haven't confirmed the timetable yet and they'll be adding advances in later for the xx.40 and xx.56 services.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I can see that Avanti don't seem to be selling Advance tickets on the app for Euston to Manchester trains other than the xx.20s. I really hope this 1tph shambles isn't being kept after 25th Feb. Hopefully they just haven't confirmed the timetable yet and they'll be adding advances in later for the xx.40 and xx.56 services.

Avanti are very sensibly not selling tickets for trains they are not sure they are going to run. I don't think anyone can predict how the COVID sickness issue is going to go over the coming months.

This is much more sensible than SWR who sold tickets for late evening trains that they then removed from the timetable (there's a thread on it).

 

[Peter0124]

Avanti are very sensibly not selling tickets for trains they are not sure they are going to run. I don't think anyone can predict how the COVID sickness issue is going to go over the coming months.

This is much more sensible than SWR who sold tickets for late evening trains that they then removed from the timetable (there's a thread on it).

To be fair, that seems like a sensible solution.

Though I just can't understand why Avanti are suffering the most from staff absenses compared to other similar TOCs who are running near full timetables

 

[VicH]

I have a similar problem with my booked journey next week.

I'm booked on the 08.30 to Glasgow and just checked that it leaves at 08.10! arrives GLC same time.

I've had no communication from Avanti, so will have to make sure I'm early at Euston!

 

[dk1]

To be fair, that seems like a sensible solution.

Though I just can't understand why Avanti are suffering the most from staff absenses compared to other similar TOCs who are running near full timetables

Has their drivers rest day working agreement been sanctioned by ASLEF? If not that could be a reason for lacking confidence in the timetable.

 

[Falcon1200]

Because the xx.10 Chester used to call at Milton Keynes whereas the xx.10 Glasgow doesn't? It'll mean that the xx.10 Glasgow will catch up with the xx.07 at Stafford whereas the Milton Keynes call on the Chester service meant that it didn't?

Yes, the 1110 was a few minutes early approaching Stafford so was stopped there. We also sat at Crewe for a few minutes.