Failure to call, Hayes & Harlington

[matt_world2004]

A train driver angered commuters waiting at Hayes and Harlington station, when he completely FORGOT to stop.

Passengers were left baffled after the Great Western Railway train, which departed Paddington, did not call at Hayes as normal.

The train was due to call at Hayes and Harlington station at 6.14pm on Thursday (July 27) but passengers were quick to point out the error to the driver.


A passenger who needed to disembark at Hayes, told getwestlondon: "Everybody was knocking on the engine room.

"He didn't open the door because he was talking on the phone and he covered his face.

"People on the train were upset, and people were getting so angry at the station as they wanted to get on the train.

"The driver just said 'Sorry, my mistake, I forgot that stop'."


The driver forgot to stop the train at Hayes and Harlington station
A Great Western Railway spokesman said on Friday (July 28): "We are sorry for those customers inconvenienced by this incident.

"A driver error meant that we did not stop at Hayes and Harlington as scheduled yesterday afternoon."

http://www.getwestlondon.co.uk/news/west-london-news/baffled-commuters-angered-train-driver-13401327

 

[AlterEgo]

Smiling at inclusion of "engine room" in that context.

He was probably on the phone to the signaller/control.

 

[Michael.Y]

Yeah, DOO is great isn't it.

 

[bb21]

Wow, that was big news, not.

Mistakes happen sometimes. The driver probably cannot be more embarrassed himself.

 

[bb21]

Yeah, DOO is great isn't it.

Can we not turn this into a discussion on DOO please. If the driver forgets to stop, there is nothing the guard can do, so this is all a bit irrelevant.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Baffled? Angered? I doubt it. Hayes & Harlington has a frequent enough service that it'd be a minor inconvenience more than anything.

Of course the driver covered his face, because of idiots with mobile phones taking pictures like the one featured in the article. At least they had the decency to blur out his face.

 

[ComUtoR]

Can we not turn this into a discussion on DOO please. If the driver forgets to stop, there is nothing the guard can do, so this is all a bit irrelevant.

When I travel with a Guard. They tend to announce "we are shortly arriving at..." That in itself may prompt me to remember to put the brake in. I am also more conscious about stopping at certain platforms because I'm thinking about dispatch on the approach. Ergo, on a Guard dispatched platform or even a staff dispatched platform, I am much more aware on approach.

The DOO debate cannot be avoided and I really wish people will admit its failings rather than constantly dismiss it out of hand. Part of the reason why DOO doesn't have the stats or is always believed to be 'safe' and 'works perfectly' is because anything that happens is put down to something else. DOO is real and part of our every day working lives. As a DOO Driver I absolutely feel that my workload is reduced when working with a Guard and my risk for an incident is greatly reduced.

Agreed about this being a non story. Happens very very regularly.

 

[Joe Paxton]

Plenty of time at West Drayton to change platforms for the 1836 to Paddington, to arrive at H&H at 1841... not even long enough for a formal claim under GWR's delay compensation scheme!

 

[Economist]

The amount of impatience amongst too many members of the general public is staggering, they are always banging away at the door buttons whilst drivers do the required checks before releasing the doors. Same with traffic lights or any other button that involves waiting and pressing or pressing and waiting.

Then you have those who start giving the driver grief if the train is late, those types are often found in suits, often walking along looking at their phone. Used to see loads of them in my City office days, I could bet that those types were at it here.

A lot of trivial things are sensationalised in today's society, as a result a lot of genuinely sensational things are trivialised.

 

[bb21]

The DOO debate cannot be avoided

OK, let me rephrase that.

I'm sure no one really needs me to explain the problems with threads which end up with a bitchfest about DOO, so any sign of that and swift actions will be taken, as I have no desire to allow any such phenomenon to infest lots of threads on top of the ones we already have.

But well reasoned and insightful posts I have no problem with, and yes, sometimes it can be difficult to avoid DOO altogether.

 

[MrCub]

Dull story. It was an accident. It happens now and then. End of. No doubt someone will be calling for him to be SACKED in a dramatic way, for being human and forgetting something.

 

[Mag_seven]

Can we not turn this into a discussion on DOO please. If the driver forgets to stop, there is nothing the guard can do, so this is all a bit irrelevant.

Agreed - I have been on trains that have failed to stop and all had guards on board. With regards to fails to stop in general they do happen - this is just a non story in the traditional slow news summer period.

 

[PudseyBearHST]

The amount of impatience amongst too many members of the general public is staggering, they are always banging away at the door buttons whilst drivers do the required checks before releasing the doors. Same with traffic lights or any other button that involves waiting and pressing or pressing and waiting.

Then you have those who start giving the driver grief if the train is late, those types are often found in suits, often walking along looking at their phone. Used to see loads of them in my City office days, I could bet that those types were at it here.

A lot of trivial things are sensationalised in today's society, as a result a lot of genuinely sensational things are trivialised.

I travel on the Adelante (class 180) regularly and there is a 5-10 second delay between when train stops and doors are released. You can hear the 2 x 2 buzzes between the TM and Driver and what amazes me is that I'm waiting by the door (and door buttons), and someone just comes from behind and presses the door button thinking that somehow they have the magic touch and they can open it. Extremely annoying :roll:

I have seen similar on the HSTs where I am not sure its down to peoples impatience or just ignorance of realising that while they are manual doors, there is still central door locking. Normally the time between train stopping and doors being released is almost instantaneous on the HST but I remember one time this wasn't the case and there was a man who was absolutely trying to force the door open (from inside the train). When the doors were finally released, he was pulling so hard that the door swung open and he almost tripped up.

 

[Joe Paxton]

...
A lot of trivial things are sensationalised in today's society, as a result a lot of genuinely sensational things are trivialised.

Local newspapers and the local news websites they have evolved into have very scarce resources these days, and rely on the rather precarious method of finding that is web advertising.

Hence clickbait news stories such as this, which don't require reporters out and about but just someone monitoring social media on the look out for something (anything!).

A great shame as, despite their faults, back in the day local newspapers did act as a check and balance albeit on a smaller scale to their national counterparts, holding local authorities to account, campaigning for local issues and helping to create a sense of place and community amongst other things.

 

[Huntergreed]

Not related as such, but the driver on 9G02 (06:20 9 Coach Virgin Pendolino from Euston to Brum) forgot to stop at Birmingham International yesterday morning, this seems more surprising, considering that next to no services pass here (bar only one IIRC)

 

[Gemz91]

It baffles me as to why people find it necessary to stick a camera in the guys face an take a photo of him.

 

[HLE]

Not related as such, but the driver on 9G02 (06:20 9 Coach Virgin Pendolino from Euston to Brum) forgot to stop at Birmingham International yesterday morning, this seems more surprising, considering that next to no services pass here (bar only one IIRC)

Now that IS bizarre. Unless the poor sod forgot to put the brake in and thought better of trying to stop it on the nose.

 

[EM2]

It wasn't that long ago that I was told it was ridiculous to suggest that passengers would want to vent their anger at a driver in the case of an operational incident (and that's what this was).
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=2950538&postcount=372

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

IIRC the consequences for a driver are less serious if they claim 'fail to stop' rather than 'braked too late and overshot.' I wouldn't be surprised if, approaching a platform at too a high speed, some drivers will choose not to brake at all to mask their more serious error.

 

[Huntergreed]

Now that IS bizarre. Unless the poor sod forgot to put the brake in and thought better of trying to stop it on the nose.

Aren't 390's fitted with station stop reminders? If so, I am very surprised that this is even possible!!

Has the opposite ever occurred? Has a driver ever stopped and released doors when they are not booked to stop at a station (this would be truly weird!!)

 

[HLE]

Aren't 390's fitted with station stop reminders? If so, I am very surprised that this is even possible!!

Has the opposite ever occurred? Has a driver ever stopped and released doors when they are not booked to stop at a station (this would be truly weird!!)

Not reminders as such, but the PA announcements are automatic.

Second bit - yes more than you would think. Referred to as an unscheduled stop.

 

[HLE]

IIRC the consequences for a driver are less serious if they claim 'fail to stop' rather than 'braked too late and overshot.' I wouldn't be surprised if, approaching a platform at too a high speed, some drivers will choose not to brake at all to mask their more serious error.

Indeed better to keep going than chuck the brake in full to see where you end up.

 

[tsr]

Aren't 390's fitted with station stop reminders? If so, I am very surprised that this is even possible!!

Has the opposite ever occurred? Has a driver ever stopped and released doors when they are not booked to stop at a station (this would be truly weird!!)

Yep. Certainly happens, possibly more than fail-to-calls.

If the guard is responsible for door release, then usually they can act as a safety net, and can call the driver to confirm why they've stopped and if the train should continue. If the driver (or, indeed, the guard, if there is a double error) releases the doors, then the situation needs to be assessed and the train dispatched correctly per the location, if it is safe. Obviously there can be implications such as crowd control and confusion, rounding up passengers if the station is closed and locked up, etc. Sometimes it is very simple, other times not.

There have even been odd incidents, including one today (no, I won't share specifics) where doors have been released when the train has been stood at a red signal away from a platform, which is naturally a more serious matter and one which would usually have far more dangerous potential consequences. This has even been done by guards, as well as drivers, which is truly bizarre, as guards should be looking out and checking for a station and platform being aligned with the train before any release of the doors (even their own local one).

Ultimately, trains are controlled by humans, so there will always be human operating errors, some of which can be very strange indeed.

 

[Huntergreed]

Not reminders as such, but the PA announcements are automatic.

Second bit - yes more than you would think. Referred to as an unscheduled stop.

I see, I did once watch a 390 approach into Euston from the cab, and in the video the driver got a "station ahead alert", so I assumed this would trigger near all the booked stops for the particular diagram!

Ah I see, that sounds rather strange; does this happen simply because the driver is not familiar with the diagram, or because the driver simply forgets he is not scheduled to stop at a station which he is used to calling at?

 

[tsr]

I see, I did once watch a 390 approach into Euston from the cab, and in the video the driver got a "station ahead alert", so I assumed this would trigger near all the booked stops for the particular diagram!

Ah I see, that sounds rather strange; does this happen simply because the driver is not familiar with the diagram, or because the driver simply forgets he is not scheduled to stop at a station which he is used to calling at?

Distractions, fatigue, unusual calling patterns, diagram amendments, timing changes (normally calls at station X at one time, but today the stop at the same time is at station Y)...

 

[theageofthetra]

Local newspapers and the local news websites they have evolved into have very scarce resources these days, and rely on the rather precarious method of finding that is web advertising.

Hence clickbait news stories such as this, which don't require reporters out and about but just someone monitoring social media on the look out for something (anything!).

A great shame as, despite their faults, back in the day local newspapers did act as a check and balance albeit on a smaller scale to their national counterparts, holding local authorities to account, campaigning for local issues and helping to create a sense of place and community amongst other things.

Absolutely correct. A classic clickbait non story. As for the shoving a phone in the drivers face-what sort of 'person' does that?

 

[greatkingrat]

Aren't 390's fitted with station stop reminders? If so, I am very surprised that this is even possible!!

Has the opposite ever occurred? Has a driver ever stopped and released doors when they are not booked to stop at a station (this would be truly weird!!)

I was once on a train booked to run fast Finsbury Park - New Southgate that made an unscheduled stop at Harringay. Unfortunately quite a few people got on thinking we were the Hertford North stopper that was just behind who ended up making an unwanted trip to New Southgate and back.

 

[ComUtoR]

Has the opposite ever occurred? Has a driver ever stopped and released doors when they are not booked to stop at a station

Soooo many times, way more than fail to call.

(this would be truly weird!!)

Why ?

 

[Huntergreed]

Why ?

Apologies, living on the GSW line with a 1-2 hourly service, this kind of thing never happens up here! The most exciting thing we ever get is a northern 156 subbing for a Scotrail one or a 4 car turning up instead of a 2

 

[ComUtoR]

Distractions, fatigue, unusual calling patterns, diagram amendments, timing changes (normally calls at station X at one time, but today the stop at the same time is at station Y)...

My diagram the other day had 89 station stops.

Imagine a week of that, then imagine a month, then imagine how many stops you can do in a year. Miss a single stop and all hell breaks loose. 89 stops is about average. The most I've had in a day was 144 :/ Missing a single stop is a teeny tiny percentage of the number of stops we do.

Sometimes I wonder if anyone make any mistakes at work. Why ours is so public, so highly criticized, and so vilified.