Is the RMT out of control?

[plastictaffy]

One of the offenders is also an RMT rep, perhaps that's why. PLus of the others, a couple of them were taken on as Guards, not Conductors. Checking tickets is beneath them as that's what conductors are for. At least one used to be a driver and couldn't do that job so they busted him down to Conductor, and he's crap at that job, too, never wears the uniform, rarely signs for an Avantix, rarely turns on his BlackBerry, the list goes on. Yet still, nothing is done. I could go to any manager and mention at least half a dozen that simply will not do the job correctly. The problem will be that when (not if, but when) the TOC's decide to do away with us, the very same guys that haven't been bothered about doing it properly for the last few years will be the first ones complaining about our 'disgustingly unfair treatment' by the company.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I do wonder why there is always an assumption that the lack of visibility of a member of staff automatically means they are lazy and in the back cab somewhere.

Just maybe, they are busy doing something else.

True story. I had a twelve car the other morning for my first four trains. I would usually go through the middle four. On the one train, I got caught helping a passenger, then involved in a quite in depth conversation about the role of the Guard with him - lovely old fella, he was. So those in front of those carriages wouldn't have seen me. However, isn't it important to tell people who we are and what we do?? Or would you rather I come through the train??

 

[FordFocus]

Is the RMT out of control? No I don't believe so. They are higher up in the news in the past couple of weeks because of the timings of various disputes with different companies but I understand the principle behind this topic.

A trade union is there to look after it's members, protect jobs and conditions. Striking is the last resort, the members lose pay, the cooperation between workforce and management is damaged and the company takes a hit. It's not in anyone's interest but needs must when your back is against the wall when your job security or conditions are on the line in the name of profit. RMT isn't perfect but it is democratically bound by the trade union laws and by it's own rule book. Mick Cash cannot just simply go and pick a fight with random companies week by week for his own political agenda. It takes months possibly over a year from the initial dispute avoidance meeting to strike action been taken. Members have a massive say just like the Brexit voters did with the power of a secure ballot paper. They can either tick yes to take industrial action or tick no. There needs to be a mandate for action.

The RMT represents a lot of workers for the transport sector, that's why they are in the headlines so much compared to TSSA or ASLEF. RMT represent a good proportion of agency workers and have been very successful in the past to stop exploitation of staff and increasing pay from off the floor. This has been mainly through strike action, some of which gets mentioned in the media. The disputes between Eurostar, VTEC and GTR aren't linked.

As for the suggestion of "socialist utopia", I politely suggest people have a little think outside of the bubble of right wing papers. There are members in trade unions who vote Tory and UKIP with manifestos that goes against union values, it's their democratic choice to vote. RMT and the vast majority of trade unions are of course associated or have been in the past with socialist movements like the current Labour party. Having union leaders stood shoulder to shoulder with Corbyn should not come as a shock to people. They're sharing the same platform for workers rights. When you look at the right wing associations like Cameron and other Tory members stood shoulder to shoulder with the likes of Murdoch and the capitalist Howard Shore who is a big Tory donor and paid for a £3m ball for fundraising from tax dodgers, then that should put things into perspective a little more..

 

[highdyke]

But why are the staff so disengaged? I am sure the unions are to blame but perhaps you can suggest some other reasons.

Normally a few people will have a quiet word and say, don't rock the boat old chap, job for life here. They've got a lot of people that never even travel by train, let alone have any interest in railways. Some very poor recruits from the 70s and 80s, no qualifications to their name and could never get a job elsewhere if they tried. A management culture that resists change and punishes people for the slightest error, everyone is spied on, via recording or other staff. Some people enjoy it because they were that grade once, a few like to get promotion by dropping others in it. A few leaders, but frankly most wouldn't last in a commercial environment if their life dependent on it have no formal training. Lot of deadwood generally. Very little loyalty to the company more people's union and mates. There some brilliant managers and very dedicated staff, but they are let down by others. Some people that understand policy rather than customer service. You would never see the insults to members of the public from any company as you do here from rail staff. Most actively take the **** out of enthusiasts.

 

[CC 72100]

Unfortunately it's difficult for them as well, mind you, due to the fact that revenue is a secondary part of my JD. The main part of my job is to ensure the train is despatched correctly, open and close the doors at stations and generally ensure the service is run in a safe and timely manner. If a manager questions why a Guard hasn't sold a ticket for x amount of time, he's just going to say it hasn't been safe in his opinion to walk trains.

One of the offenders is also an RMT rep, perhaps that's why. PLus of the others, a couple of them were taken on as Guards, not Conductors. Checking tickets is beneath them as that's what conductors are for. At least one used to be a driver and couldn't do that job so they busted him down to Conductor, and he's crap at that job, too, never wears the uniform, rarely signs for an Avantix, rarely turns on his BlackBerry, the list goes on. Yet still, nothing is done. I could go to any manager and mention at least half a dozen that simply will not do the job correctly. The problem will be that when (not if, but when) the TOC's decide to do away with us, the very same guys that haven't been bothered about doing it properly for the last few years will be the first ones complaining about our 'disgustingly unfair treatment' by the company.

Again all good points. Of course safety & punctuality comes first, but I would guess that after a certain amount of time and with enough evidence (ie. Avantix reports from people who have done the same turn) then your mickeytakers - who annoy the rest of the grade - would become apparent. "Well, you say that it's impossible to do tickets on that turn, but here's 8 out of your 10 colleagues (anonymously) who managed it".

Any manager who doesn't want to get involved in that sort of thing due to laziness isn't really doing their job any justice. There could however be many other reasons, probably only known between that manager and their superior managers....

 

[FordFocus]

Some guards were very good at working a SPORTIS machine and could sell a good number of tickets an hour but rubbish at the Avantix. Some know the Avantix like they wrote every line of code for it so sell more. Some turned the brightness down to the bare minimum to get every last ticket out of it, some turned it up to 100% because of their eyesight but the battery would run out mid shift so less tickets sold.

Every guard is different. The ones who sit in the back cab consonantly are found out sooner or later.

 

[Tetchytyke]

You would never see the insults to members of the public from any company as you do here from rail staff.

I gently point you in the direction of http://www.pprune.org/

 

[highdyke]

I gently point you in the direction of http://www.pprune.org/

I will look, I know some airlines staff it will be an education.

 

[Tetchytyke]

As for guards/conductors, one of my greatest bugbears was always standing next to a locked up late evening London Midland train, 5-10 minutes after the published departure time, only to watch the guard saunter down the platform with his Burger King. I understand why- London Midland's diagrams are so tight that any delay just knocks on, and guards are not minded to lose some of their PNB to catch up, nor are they minded to run- but it's the sort of thing that doesn't do guards much help.

When the time comes for GoVia to get rid of guards on London Midland- and it will come, some of the stations still have DOO monitors from the aborted attempt in the mid-90s- there isn't going to be much support to keep them. All people remember is standing in a scrum in the freezing cold waiting for the guard to turn up with his burger.

You'd never see the guard either, but then on a 12-car full of drunks one wouldn't expect to see them, even if they did come out of the cab.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but it does make it a lot harder to get public support.

 

[AndyW33]

I do wonder why there is always an assumption that the lack of visibility of a member of staff automatically means they are lazy and in the back cab somewhere.

Just maybe, they are busy doing something else.

And in the EMT example given, there are 2+5 car Meridian workings where the guard can only possibly be in one half of the train as there are no gangways between units. Platform lengths may require them to be in one unit or the other. There are lots of TOCs with at least some stock that doesn't allow guards to move between units.
STP-NOT does seem to be extreme, but after all in EMT First on weekdays there are Customer Hosts who do check that passengers have First tickets (because of the freebies) and can always get in touch with the guard should a passenger require his/her assistance. I wouldn't blame a guard for concentrating on the passengers in Standard under these circumstances if the train is busy.

Now there's always the odd one who never gets further down a single 153 than the rear door controls...

 

[tsr]

As for guards/conductors, one of my greatest bugbears was always standing next to a locked up late evening London Midland train, 5-10 minutes after the published departure time, only to watch the guard saunter down the platform with his Burger King. I understand why- London Midland's diagrams are so tight that any delay just knocks on, and guards are not minded to lose some of their PNB to catch up, nor are they minded to run- but it's the sort of thing that doesn't do guards much help.

When the time comes for GoVia to get rid of guards on London Midland- and it will come, some of the stations still have DOO monitors from the aborted attempt in the mid-90s- there isn't going to be much support to keep them. All people remember is standing in a scrum in the freezing cold waiting for the guard to turn up with his burger.

You'd never see the guard either, but then on a 12-car full of drunks one wouldn't expect to see them, even if they did come out of the cab.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but it does make it a lot harder to get public support.

Conductors don't exactly hide on late-night Southern services (more often than not, they'll be in the saloon, if not actually walking through; anyway, from an ergonomic point of view, it is more hassle than it's worth to work a train from the cab of a 377 unless totally necessary). Yet guaranteeing this presence on late-night trains has - somewhat bizarrely, actually - not been as much of a major point of debate in publicity between Southern and the RMT as I would expect. This is despite the fact that local agreements maintain a conductor on the "overnights", including stopping services falling outside the remit of normal conductor operation. On the other hand, passengers are well aware of this; indeed, I would say it is amongst the most positive aspects of conductor-worked trains which are mentioned to me by passengers. And I speak to, um, quite a lot of GTR passengers.

 

[Bromley boy]

As for guards/conductors, one of my greatest bugbears was always standing next to a locked up late evening London Midland train, 5-10 minutes after the published departure time, only to watch the guard saunter down the platform with his Burger King. I understand why- London Midland's diagrams are so tight that any delay just knocks on, and guards are not minded to lose some of their PNB to catch up, nor are they minded to run- but it's the sort of thing that doesn't do guards much help.

When the time comes for GoVia to get rid of guards on London Midland- and it will come, some of the stations still have DOO monitors from the aborted attempt in the mid-90s- there isn't going to be much support to keep them. All people remember is standing in a scrum in the freezing cold waiting for the guard to turn up with his burger.

You'd never see the guard either, but then on a 12-car full of drunks one wouldn't expect to see them, even if they did come out of the cab.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but it does make it a lot harder to get public support.

I can see exactly how that kind of thing looks bad to passengers, but then again there is quite a bit of ignorance from the public on the importance of PNBs, which are required to be taken.

Certainly my TOC have been at pains to point out that if you take less than the minimum required PNB and then have an incident, you will be likely be blamed for being fatigued. Unfortunately this can lead to the scenario you describe where the public see what appears to them to be a lazy guard/driver ambling towards a delayed train. Most people in office jobs will be unfamiliar with this concept, and accustomed to simply working through lunch if they are busy or behind. This is not an option for rail staff.

Similarly, we are encouraged not to rush when changing ends if we are running late as arriving at the other end hot, sweaty and stressed is likely to lead to an incident. Again this has the unfortunate effect of making drivers look lazy/surly to the watching passengers.

 

[Llanigraham]

Almost anyone can be a guard,which is why they are vastly overpaid. They should be on the average wage but guards' pay has been driven up by BR & TOC fear of industrial action. So the employers,until Charles Horton, have given in year after year & paid guards more,& asked them to do less. He is a hero.
Not everyone can be a driver,the assessment tests are tough & the job requires good sense & a cool head. So they deserve much more than a guard. Capable guards can & do become drivers. Less capable redundant guards become cleaners.
Hardly anybody wants to be a CEO because of the insults they get from forum members here & basketcase Union officials. Would anyone reading this want to take the relentless cruel abuse that a few posters pile on Charles day in & day out.

That suggests that you know nothing about the job Guards do!!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Is the RMT out of control? No I don't believe so. They are higher up in the news in the past couple of weeks because of the timings of various disputes with different companies but I understand the principle behind this topic.

A trade union is there to look after it's members, protect jobs and conditions. Striking is the last resort, the members lose pay, the cooperation between workforce and management is damaged and the company takes a hit. It's not in anyone's interest but needs must when your back is against the wall when your job security or conditions are on the line in the name of profit. RMT isn't perfect but it is democratically bound by the trade union laws and by it's own rule book. Mick Cash cannot just simply go and pick a fight with random companies week by week for his own political agenda. It takes months possibly over a year from the initial dispute avoidance meeting to strike action been taken. Members have a massive say just like the Brexit voters did with the power of a secure ballot paper. They can either tick yes to take industrial action or tick no. There needs to be a mandate for action.

The RMT represents a lot of workers for the transport sector, that's why they are in the headlines so much compared to TSSA or ASLEF. RMT represent a good proportion of agency workers and have been very successful in the past to stop exploitation of staff and increasing pay from off the floor. This has been mainly through strike action, some of which gets mentioned in the media. The disputes between Eurostar, VTEC and GTR aren't linked.

As for the suggestion of "socialist utopia", I politely suggest people have a little think outside of the bubble of right wing papers. There are members in trade unions who vote Tory and UKIP with manifestos that goes against union values, it's their democratic choice to vote. RMT and the vast majority of trade unions are of course associated or have been in the past with socialist movements like the current Labour party. Having union leaders stood shoulder to shoulder with Corbyn should not come as a shock to people. They're sharing the same platform for workers rights. When you look at the right wing associations like Cameron and other Tory members stood shoulder to shoulder with the likes of Murdoch and the capitalist Howard Shore who is a big Tory donor and paid for a £3m ball for fundraising from tax dodgers, then that should put things into perspective a little more..

Well said, but the usual anti-Union suspects on here will never agree with you.

 

[6Gman]

Seriously DarloRich. Every time someone questions union actions on here pro-unionists spout the "there are strict laws" rubbish. Union laws may be stricter than they were but they are still full of holes as we are seeing now. Sympathy strikes may be outlawed but there are ways around that and the unions know it. Just look at Southern and the tactics being employed there by the RMT. They know right now their very existence is at stake after GTR stood up to them and so they have to fight back and they figure with all the support Corbyn has that the public is ready for national strikes again. Not only is this a snapshot of how life would be under Corbyn but also right now the RMT are looking for any reason possible to strike on all TOC's. Where are the stats to show driver only is more dangerous?...Oh wait there aren't any. One of the reasons rail workers are paid so well because the work life balance isn't great but to the RMT it's a perfect cause to strike nationwide if all else fails. This is beyond a joke and the sooner strikes are banned and unions outlawed the better. I realise posting anti-union comment on here is frowned upon but yet it is totally fine for unionists to post their side. This is Railforums not RMTForums.

Employers and employees have (currently) a contractual relationship. When you've finished abolishing unions who will protect the workforce? Or are you suggesting no contracts for employees?

 

[highdyke]

Employers and employees have (currently) a contractual relationship. When you've finished abolishing unions who will protect the workforce? Or are you suggesting no contracts for employees?

Glad you mentioned contracts, please read this and post your opinions.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/jun/15/trade-union-strike-immunity

 

[AlterEgo]

But why are the staff so disengaged? I am sure the unions are to blame but perhaps you can suggest some other reasons.

A lot of it is down to what I call mess room rot. In other businesses, the bad apples who bring morale down with consistent bitching and sniping would get "managed out". Not on the railway. This is in part due to unions and in part due to management having no cojones in some places. Other reasons:

- Boredom
- Poor treatment by the company
- Creeping sense of self-entitlement
- Loss of big picture vision (look how many staffers here slag off passengers!)
- Narrowing prospects going forward
- Edit: recruiting the wrong people in the first place, HR's fault

Those are all present in all industries but the difference with the railway is the sway the unions can sometimes hold.

Again, I'm pro-union, I'm a member of one and yes I've take industrial action myself before, which I voted for.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I do wonder why there is always an assumption that the lack of visibility of a member of staff automatically means they are lazy and in the back cab somewhere.

Just maybe, they are busy doing something else.

Sometimes they are, indeed!

But quite often, they're doing sweet FA. I've travelled on thousands of trains. Today, my ticket was checked - by a forum member! (Who did not recognise me)

This was on a commuter route into London on a TOC which has no DOO trains.

How often do you think my ticket gets checked on my weekly commute? Have a guess.* No, the train is never so full you can't move down it, and yes, there is a full 20 minutes between stops for the guard to do a revenue check. I travel from an unbarriered station where short faring opportunities would be rife.

*Answer - less than once a week, on average; that's less than one check every ten trains (one out one return)

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

As for the suggestion of "socialist utopia", I politely suggest people have a little think outside of the bubble of right wing papers.

Yet another of the herd who blithely brings the old chestnut of "right-wing papers" into play without even considering that there are people who have an excellent thought process and a good brain who can actually have the ability to develop a logical train of thought without recourse of the aid of any newspaper.

 

[Bertie the bus]

I don’t think the RMT has changed. It is always posturing, bleating and threatening industrial action and always has. I think what has changed is that TOC management are now not so inclined to give in, possibly with the encouragement of the government either directly or indirectly through demands for a more efficient railway.

 

[highdyke]

As for the suggestion of "socialist utopia", I politely suggest people have a little think outside of the bubble of right wing papers. .

We don't all get our opinions from right wing papers, how about life experience, education, thinking about things from different angles? I read ALL the papers.

Moreover we're not so black and white. We're all, to a certain extent concerned about everything across society and want a nice, decent, fair society, it's how that is achieved people may differ.

I'm not anti-union, certainly not a socialist, but strikes rights are a privilege. All to often customers are the biggest losers, especially where there is a monopoly. For me this is not just about fairness to the company wishing to makes changes, or fairness to the workers. It's fairness to everyone.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

People wonder why there are some who think that the RMT are not seen as a modern trades union that have their finger on the pulse of the 21st century....then read the way that many of the press releases of that same union are couched in the strange language of a time period of an age long gone.

 

[PR1Berske]

I have to agree with some of the recent posts. Fighting for the rights of workers is commendable, of course, only the RMT does tend to speak the language of "beer and sandwiches" in an age of "latté and panini"

 

[Monty]

Yet another of the herd who blithely brings the old chestnut of "right-wing papers" into play without even considering that there are people who have an excellent thought process and a good brain who can actually have the ability to develop a logical train of thought without recourse to the aid of any newspaper.

Just nobody who posts on this forum.

I have to say I'm absolutely astonished and aghast to read some of the things posted on this forum. Never in my life have I been ever been made to feel so degraded and worthless because of the job I do and what people here may think of it. To say 'anyone can be a guard' (a complete falsehood by the way) and that I should be earning the average wage because of it is outrageous, while I have no desire to go into the sordid details of my financial affairs but despite my 'inflated wages' it is often difficult to make ends meet. And when when you hear the likes of that utter pillock Wilkinson going on about staff not being able to afford to go on strike because we have flash cars and our maxed out credit cards it makes my blood boil. We should come down from his ivory tower and see how I live, in a age of playstations and artisan coffee a single kinder surprise egg is considered to be a big treat for my daughter!

I'm done caring what people may think of my job and the implementation of DOO now, all I know is I work long and unsociable hours to provide for my family while at the same time trying to enjoy a job I once loved doing, now when I walk through a train smiling, trying to do my best for my passengers I can't help but ask myself how many of them feel the same way you do? How many of them wish to cast me aside as a worthless uneducated person who earns more than of someone of his station should.

I'm honestly ashamed to be a member this forum at times.

 

[Bromley boy]

Just nobody who posts on this forum.

I have to say I'm absolutely astonished and aghast to read some of the things posted on this forum. Never in my life have I been ever been made to feel so degraded and worthless because of the job I do and what people here may think of it. To say 'anyone can be a guard' (a complete falsehood by the way) and that I should be earning the average wage because of it is outrageous, while I have no desire to go into the sordid details of my financial affairs but despite my 'inflated wages' it is often difficult to make ends meet. And when when you hear the likes of that utter pillock Wilkinson going on about staff not being able to afford to go on strike because we have flash cars and our maxed out credit cards it makes my blood boil. We should come down from his ivory tower and see how I live, in a age of playstations and artisan coffee a single kinder surprise egg is considered to be a big treat for my daughter!

I'm done caring what people may think of my job and the implementation of DOO now, all I know is I work long and unsociable hours to provide for my family while at the same time trying to enjoy a job I once loved doing, now when I walk through a train smiling, trying to do my best for my passengers I can't help but ask myself how many of them feel the same way you do? How many of them wish to cast me aside as a worthless uneducated person who earns more than of someone of his station should.

I'm honestly ashamed to be a member this forum at times.

I would like to think most passengers have a more balanced, nuanced view than the minority of posters on here who appear to despise the railway and its workforce, yet apparently have nothing better to do than while away their time posting on a railway forum.

 

[313103]

Just nobody who posts on this forum.

I have to say I'm absolutely astonished and aghast to read some of the things posted on this forum. Never in my life have I been ever been made to feel so degraded and worthless because of the job I do and what people here may think of it. To say 'anyone can be a guard' (a complete falsehood by the way) and that I should be earning the average wage because of it is outrageous, while I have no desire to go into the sordid details of my financial affairs but despite my 'inflated wages' it is often difficult to make ends meet. And when when you hear the likes of that utter pillock Wilkinson going on about staff not being able to afford to go on strike because we have flash cars and our maxed out credit cards it makes my blood boil. We should come down from his ivory tower and see how I live, in a age of playstations and artisan coffee a single kinder surprise egg is considered to be a big treat for my daughter!

I'm done caring what people may think of my job and the implementation of DOO now, all I know is I work long and unsociable hours to provide for my family while at the same time trying to enjoy a job I once loved doing, now when I walk through a train smiling, trying to do my best for my passengers I can't help but ask myself how many of them feel the same way you do? How many of them wish to cast me aside as a worthless uneducated person who earns more than of someone of his station should.

I'm honestly ashamed to be a member this forum at times.

I echo your comments i have been biting my lips over this issue, some of the comments have been down right insulting and the lack of support you get especially when one like myself have been through a DOO scheme and it aint very nice.

Like you even up to my last day as a Guard, i did my job exactly as the company wanted and engaged with the passengers, some were astounded that we were being dumped.

Amazingly those who are saying its easy to be Guard are most certainly NOT ones themselves, and i would edge a bet that some of them failed the assessments to be one so therefore are bitter and twisted about it.

Best of luck to you Monty.

 

[cjmillsnun]

Like your good self, many of the commuters who Southern transport to and from their places of work do like the jobs that they do ("loving" is a tad strong) and suddenly find that the companies who employ them are not very happy with a situation where staff are not there in time to perform their daily tasks, as this will reflect badly upon the efficiency of the company.

Welcome to your new role of "collateral damage".

I need not remind you that the person who said it is not in the rail industry and not a member of the RMT. Nor are they a Labour voter let alone a member. It was me.

I was making the point that the target was not deliberately the public, who many staff will have some sympathy with. GTR having treated them with as much contempt as they treat their staff. Sadly the only way that they can make their point to management is by withdrawing their labour. A consequence of this is that the public are affected.

So don't go targeting railwaymen on a remark of someone who is not in the industry.

 

[6Gman]

Glad you mentioned contracts, please read this and post your opinions.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/jun/15/trade-union-strike-immunity

I disagree with the proposition. Given the controls over industrial action created by other legislation I do not think individual civil action against unions would be appropriate.

 

[Tetchytyke]

the RMT does tend to speak the language of "beer and sandwiches" in an age of "latté and panini"

I think that's a very fair point, and it doesn't help them articulate their arguments very well. The problem is they always default to the same press release and they don't address the individual points in any dispute.

There's always loads of hyperbole. That's fine when you're whiling away a slow afternoon on a message board, but doesn't help convince people of the merits of your argument.

It's a shame as, with the GTR dispute, it would have been relatively easy to get the public on side. But defaulting to the standard press release just makes everyone assume it's yet another argument about nothing.

The BMA have shown how to be sensible in a dispute.

 

[a_c_skinner]

Speaking as a doctor (not a junior though) I think the BMA has made rather a hash of it and a lot of doctors want an RMT style trades union.

Speaking as a rail user I'd strongly like a second, safety trained staff member on board but strongly suspect who opens the doors and perhaps who closes them isn't that crucial.

Speaking as an onlooker both sides in all the disputes seem to be talking the sort of stuff that in the 1970s would have seemed very familiar.

I'd also observe that strikes cost everyone money and show both sides have failed.

Andrew

 

[FordFocus]

Yet another of the herd who blithely brings the old chestnut of "right-wing papers" into play [...]

I point out the "socialist utopia" as a comment because you seemed to associate this with any form of industrial action combined with Corbyn now he has appeared in the dispatch box. The DOO thread has been littered with comments about yourself trying to link industrial action on Southern or elsewhere as some kind of uprising from a socialist left and making a political point. The union membership don't strike for political points, not when people are losing an entire weeks pay. It's about protecting their role and futures.

[...] without even considering that there are people who have an excellent thought process and a good brain who can actually have the ability to develop a logical train of thought without recourse of the aid of any newspaper.

You seem to me to be a man who thinks he's a bit above the rest of the forum membership. Mentions of your well previously paid Canadian senior management role, the university first in mathematics, your house in Cheshire (the posh part as you once put in your forum location) which knowing the house prices around there isn't cheap. Constant dislike to anyone with a socialist opinion, borderline insulting people when they don't get your pretentious waffling. You do post some good stuff on here but it's a shame that you put the blinkers on and climb upon your high horse on matters like these.

 

[HH]

While I think that the proposition is not correct, the fact that RMT have launched so many strikes at once, many of them which probably seem vindictive to passengers, is probably not doing them, or unfortunately in the long run their members, a lot of favours.

Get public opinion onside and there will be pressure on the government. Keep wittering on about the same old, same old, and sympathy is lost faster than Wilkinson disappears abroad every Thursday evening.

 

[highdyke]

I think just generally people read FAR too much into things and need to remember this is a public forum with a range of views with people from lots of different backgrounds. The whole point about this forum is it's not a place to rally the troops, rather one to exchange ideas and actually...controversially...disagree.

There's plenty of crap being dished out all sides, no wonder.