Virgin Trains to Shrewsbury

[Zoidberg]

The Shropshire Star has expanded its story at http://www.shropshirestar.com/news/2013/11/14/shropshire-star-wins-direct-rail-link-to-london/ but still light on detail:

...

The ORR said train operator Virgin had worked with Network Rail to find an off-peak direct route to and from Shrewsbury on Monday to Friday, with another on Sundays. It will be incorporated into the draft May 2014 timetable.

...

A spokeswoman for Virgin Trains said the company had yet to receive any formal notification from Network Rail or Department for Transport.

She said: “Virgin Trains is still in discussions with Network Rail and the Department for Transport about running services to Shrewsbury and no formal timetable offer has yet been made.

“We have made clear our intentions to run direct services to Shrewsbury and look forward to a positive outcome soon."

...

 

[merlodlliw]

The Shropshire Star has expanded its story at http://www.shropshirestar.com/news/2013/11/14/shropshire-star-wins-direct-rail-link-to-london/ but still light on detail:

.

I have confirmation the info was originally leaked by MPs,the Shropshire Star doing its job chased up the story with ORR,who had to make a statement, its a dogs dinner now,I understand ORR are furious about the leak while discussions are on going with NR & VT plus Politicians,if VT dont like whats on offer,they can say no.
Its all speculation, no route,services have been agreed yet to be inserted into the May 2014 proposed timetables..

 

[Zoidberg]

I would like to see the original announcement from ORR,was it just sent to the Shropshire Star,I am aware it was sent with an embargo,which appears to have been leaked.

I seems to me that the Shropshire Star has gone off half cocked - from what it has published it seems not to have much in the way of solid information, not that it has information but is not revealing it.

 

[WatcherZero]

BBC has picked up the story now and spoken to ORR, they said timetables with times will be published Friday (off peak Mon-Fri and a single Sunday service) but that the impact of the service on performance has not been assessed yet.

 

[Zoidberg]

BBC has picked up the story now ...

I see that there is now an article on the BBC website at http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-24937075 confirming what you reported.

Direct rail services between Shropshire and London are to be restarted from May, the rail regulator has said.
...
The Office of Rail Regulation (ORR) said the two sides had agreed to run an off-peak service Monday to Friday, with one direct train timetabled for Sunday.

It said exact times would be revealed on new timetables issued on Friday.
...

 

[Proud Salopian]

So no train on Saturdays... a bit odd, considering that's actually the day when I would have expected the most Shrewsbury-London (or vice versa) traffic! (Business traffic being peak time and not met by these proposals at all, leaving the direct service a largely 'leisure' only service.)

 

[NickJ]

if it turns out to be one off peak Mon-Fri and one Sun return service it will be of no use at all in terms of business use or travellers from Shropshire wanting a day trip to London (which for most working people would be on a Saturday!). If that is the case the whole campaign has almost been a waste of time

 

[Proud Salopian]

Yeah it does sound like a "token" service.

The only hope for Shrewsbury is to get Shrewsbury-Wolverhampton electrified.

I give it 30 years... heck, probably they won't even bother then, replacing DMUs (in Shropshire/mid-Wales) with HMUs.

You'd think Network Rail and the other powers that be would realise that joining Shrewsbury and Telford (combined population of over 200,000) with the electrified network of the West Midlands (thus providing "metro" EMU services as well as extending the London services to Shrewsbury) would be a fairly obvious infrastructure investment to make - the costs surely wouldn't be that much: there's not that many miles to electrify (and Oakengates Tunnel is hardly the engineering challenge of the millennium).

What is the mileage between Oxley and Shrewsbury station?

 

[SprinterMan]

I would wager quite heavily that it is just poor journalism and that the "Monday to Friday" should be "Monday to Saturday" and that it has been lost in translation somewhere.

Adam

 

[WatcherZero]

I dont know, the Saturday pathing was more problematic. I think it would be one Sunday service and two possibly three per day during the week.

 

[thenorthern]

Just a thought if Telford wasn't a New Town would it have better rail services.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

if it turns out to be one off peak Mon-Fri and one Sun return service it will be of no use at all in terms of business use or travellers from Shropshire wanting a day trip to London (which for most working people would be on a Saturday!). If that is the case the whole campaign has almost been a waste of time

The application was for 2 return services a day (one on Sunday) from both Shrewsbury and Blackpool.
There are just 2 Voyager units available, so it was never going to be more than that (until Virgin gets more trains).

 

[Eagle]

And those two Voyagers were only freed up because in the new timetable Birmingham to Scotland services are combined with London to Birmingham services, resulting in a slightly more efficient use of the fleet.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Yeah it does sound like a "token" service.

The only hope for Shrewsbury is to get Shrewsbury-Wolverhampton electrified.

I give it 30 years... heck, probably they won't even bother then, replacing DMUs (in Shropshire/mid-Wales) with HMUs.

You'd think Network Rail and the other powers that be would realise that joining Shrewsbury and Telford (combined population of over 200,000) with the electrified network of the West Midlands (thus providing "metro" EMU services as well as extending the London services to Shrewsbury) would be a fairly obvious infrastructure investment to make - the costs surely wouldn't be that much: there's not that many miles to electrify (and Oakengates Tunnel is hardly the engineering challenge of the millennium).

What is the mileage between Oxley and Shrewsbury station?

All of 28 miles

 

[Proud Salopian]

All of 28 miles

Quite. Surely the economics work for it to now be electrified?

28 miles electrification, to add two towns with a combined population of over 200,000 to the West Midlands and WCML electrified parts of the national network.

To me it's all too obvious.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Quite. Surely the economics work for it to now be electrified?
28 miles electrification, to add two towns with a combined population of over 200,000 to the West Midlands and WCML electrified parts of the national network.
To me it's all too obvious.

Except there are about 20 similar places with at least an equal claim (Lincoln, Middlesbrough, Harrogate, Worcester, Gloucester, Blackburn, Halifax, Chester...).
And at Shrewsbury it would require at least some resignalling, which is another kettle of fish entirely.
It would also mean wholesale changes to the Arriva services through Shrewsbury, not all of which would be welcome.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Except there are about 20 similar places with at least an equal claim (Lincoln, Middlesbrough, Harrogate, Worcester, Gloucester, Blackburn, Halifax, Chester...).
And at Shrewsbury it would require at least some resignalling, which is another kettle of fish entirely.
It would also mean wholesale changes to the Arriva services through Shrewsbury, not all of which would be welcome.

The point is you get two large towns on 28 miles of wire whereas with some of the other options you outline it's one town for a lot more spend. Ie Worcester, Gloucester are only going to work if you do the whole Bristol to Birmingham mainline plus the ex GWR commuters lines into Snow Hill.

Shrewsbury is due to migrate to remote control from Cardiff signalling centre in CP6 anyway.

 

[The Planner]

Which means it is more likely in CP6 or 7, unless someone dramatically brings forward Shrewsbury resignalling no one is going to consider it due to the abortive interim costs.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

There's a deafening media silence on the new services which supposedly should have been revealed by now.
The Shopshire Star exclusive today is about wheelie bins.

 

[WatcherZero]

The 'D26 New Working Timetable' was supposed to be published by NR today (15/11/13), as far as I can see that hasnt happened.

 

[rm88]

What a waste of money I think, this is because they will run a diesel train under the wires apart from 28 miles of its journey. Virgin Trains has not thought it through.
London Midland could use 350s and give a direct hourly train to Euston, extended from the current New Street services.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Which means it is more likely in CP6 or 7, unless someone dramatically brings forward Shrewsbury resignalling no one is going to consider it due to the abortive interim costs.

CP6 would be sensible to coincide with planned transfer of Salop to Cardiff ROC and coincide with HS2 phase one. An hourly pendolino to Euston via New St would be the sensible option as it would allow extra capacity from New St to Salop especially in peak.

If we wire another 900 miles like planned for CP5 its 3% of that.

 

[Zoidberg]

...
London Midland could use 350s and give a direct hourly train to Euston, extended from the current New Street services.

In what way is that relevant to a London/Shropshire service?

 

[rm88]

Because 350s are used between london and new street, i was suggesting they be extended to shrewsbury if the line was electrified, which it probably wont.

 

[Zoidberg]

Because 350s are used between london and new street, i was suggesting they be extended to shrewsbury if the line was electrified, which it probably wont.

Thanks, I see. And I agree about the (lack of) likelihood of electrifying Wolves towards Shrewsbury.

 

[rm88]

Don't get me started on Electrification, how Chester keeps missing out of any plans, I will not know.

 

[The Planner]

The 'D26 New Working Timetable' was supposed to be published by NR today (15/11/13), as far as I can see that hasnt happened.

Give us a chance, we were still working on it this afternoon!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

There's a deafening media silence on the new services which supposedly should have been revealed by now.
The Shopshire Star exclusive today is about wheelie bins.

What class of loco are they?

 

[PHILIPE]

What class of loco are they?

221 Voyagers.

 

[Polarbear]

Don't get me started on Electrification, how Chester keeps missing out of any plans, I will not know.

Probably because;

• Wiring the tunnels under the canal at Chester will be difficult
• Unless other lines are wired, it benefits relatively few trains
• There's little to be gained by just wiring to Chester in isolation