Ghost Trains or Parliamentary

[johnnyp_360]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet. An interesting clip about 1 train a week services or 'ghost trains' as they seem to be called.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18644343

Are there any near you? I can't think of any round here in East Anglia.

 

[tsr]

As you see from the date below the video, it was posted at the beginning of July, and I believe it was discussed around that particular time on this forum.

A number of my friends and family who are not generally interested in the railways were quite fascinated, which may reflect the attitude of the general public, but they have been a bit put off by some of the inconvenient departure times, so they haven't joined me on any! I have covered a few, as have a couple of my enthusiast friends. Indeed, many of these workings will be known to carry enthusiasts on a regular basis. On-train staff are generally perfectly happy with this arrangement (perhaps because it can provide company and an amusing chat about obscure NR lines!).

Such trains are run either to keep a line open for route knowledge (e.g. to ensure an alternative route for engineering/emergency diversion purposes), or to prevent formal closure procedures, as you have doubtless gathered.

I use the excellent PSUL website to keep an eye on services over unusual lines and/or with unusual frequencies. You can find this here: http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/intro.htm

 

[SprinterMan]

Are there any near you? I can't think of any round here in East Anglia.

You have that train that does they Ely west curve:
http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/P44869/2012/12/16

And you have Manea, Shippea Hill, Lakenheath, Eccles Road, Harling Road, Spooner Row and Buckenham as near by ghost stations.

Adam

 

[Trainfan344]

You have that train that does they Ely west curve:
http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/P44869/2012/12/16

And you have Manea, Shippea Hill, Lakenheath, Eccles Road, Harling Road, Spooner Row and Buckenham as near by ghost stations.

Adam

Never knew about this one, shall have to do it.

 

[Ivo]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet. An interesting clip about 1 train a week services or 'ghost trains' as they seem to be called.

The closest we have to a ghost train around here is Chippenham to Trowbridge, which runs four times a day (two each way). More obvious however is the station at Pilning, which sees one train each way on Saturdays only.

My father drove the infamous Kensington (Olympia) ghost bus several years ago, on numerous occasions. He has numerous stories to tell about it, including among others getting a parking ticket for using the bus bays outside Ealing Broadway station at the start of the journey! hock:

 

[tsr]

Never knew about this one, shall have to do it.

Now, that's what I call the right attitude

 

[Buttsy]

The producer of the video is a mate of mine and was asking me how he gets to do the lines and what ticket would be best. He adamantly denied he was a line basher, which I do not believe in the slightest!

 

[tsr]

My father drove the infamous Kensington (Olympia) ghost bus several years ago, on numerous occasions. He has numerous stories to tell about it, including among others getting a parking ticket for using the bus bays outside Ealing Broadway station at the start of the journey! hock:

The nearly-Parliamentary trains to/from Kenny O via the Latchmere Junctions are well worth the ride, as the staff seem to be rather friendly, and the whole thing feels suitably bonkers. Additionally, a 45x to yourself isn't too bad. Although it will surely be withdrawn soon, it is still shown in the timetable, and certainly was well-used by enthusiasts up to Friday.

 

[Ivo]

The nearly-Parliamentary trains to/from Kenny O via the Latchmere Junctions are well worth the ride, as the staff seem to be rather friendly, and the whole thing feels suitably bonkers. Additionally, a 45x to yourself isn't too bad. Although it will surely be withdrawn soon, it is still shown in the timetable, and certainly was well-used by enthusiasts up to Friday.

I went on it in April with a few others from this forum. Our group excepted, there were a couple of "normal" passengers, a couple of passengers who got on the wrong train (:roll - and the rest were enthusiasts

 

[ATW Alex 101]

Not entirely 1 train per week but certainly a limited service, I have the Ellesmere Port-Helsby line which is local to me

 

[David Goddard]

Are there any near you? I can't think of any round here in East Anglia.

Apart from the Ghost stations and once per week working over the Ely West Curve listed by SprinterMan, I don't think there are any more in East Anglia at present.
The last one I can remember in the Anglia area was when when the Birmingham to Stansted trains were cut back to Cambridge for a number of years, and a once daily shuttle from Cambridge to Stansted ran to avoid the closure of the North Curve at Stansted junction.

 

[TEW]

The nearly-Parliamentary trains to/from Kenny O via the Latchmere Junctions are well worth the ride, as the staff seem to be rather friendly, and the whole thing feels suitably bonkers. Additionally, a 45x to yourself isn't too bad. Although it will surely be withdrawn soon, it is still shown in the timetable, and certainly was well-used by enthusiasts up to Friday.

That service of course has some new friends in the new timetable, the services to Battersea Park and London Victoria, both 1 train per day in each direction. Part of the route of the parliamentary to/from Kensington Olympia has also gained regular services with the LO train to Clapham Junction.

 

[90019]

I was wondering why that video reappeared in the most popular videos bit on the BBC News site.

 

[SprinterMan]

That service of course has some new friends in the new timetable, the services to Battersea Park and London Victoria, both 1 train per day in each direction. Part of the route of the parliamentary to/from Kensington Olympia has also gained regular services with the LO train to Clapham Junction.

Ooh, didn't know about these, what diagrams do they run?

Adam

 

[neilmc]

I personally think that the TOCs are mocking their local communities by refusing to provide a meaningful service at a station where they supposedly operate. For example, Denton is not an isolated village but a well-populated suburb in Greater Manchester. In this case, the GMPTE should be given powers to dictate the level of service provided on this and any other line, with the power to veto the entire Northern Rail franchise in their area when it comes up for renewal - not being allowed to operate any trains within Greater Manchester might clip their wings a bit. Ah well, more flying pigs, and I don't mean Ivatt 2-6-0s but the chance of having a properly funded, staffed and accountable railway network.

 

[tsr]

I personally think that the TOCs are mocking their local communities by refusing to provide a meaningful service at a station where they supposedly operate. For example, Denton is not an isolated village but a well-populated suburb in Greater Manchester. In this case, the GMPTE should be given powers to dictate the level of service provided on this and any other line, with the power to veto the entire Northern Rail franchise in their area when it comes up for renewal - not being allowed to operate any trains within Greater Manchester might clip their wings a bit. Ah well, more flying pigs, and I don't mean Ivatt 2-6-0s but the chance of having a properly funded, staffed and accountable railway network.

I agree with you in the case you describe. However, in the case of stations such as Shippea Hill or Golf Street (to name but two examples), there is perhaps no reasonable justification for more than a few stops to serve the few potential commuters in the peaks, plus maybe a couple of stops at other times in the day.

Stations such as Sudbury & Harrow Road and Longcross seem to exist on this principle, and generally do a bit better with a limited but somewhat-better-thought-out service.

 

[Mojo]

I caught the Olympia to Wandsworth Rd train on Friday and it was a 4-car 377 and had a few people on board who all seemed to be enthusiasts. I notice from the online journey planners that this service is set to continue from the new timetable and the last day was not on Friday, as many had suspected.

 

[455driver]

In this case, the GMPTE should be given powers to dictate the level of service provided on this and any other line,

They can, all they have to do is pay Northern Rail to provide the service and Northern will run it.

The underlined bit is the problem!

 

[df9901]

I looked here after seeing the exact same thing. As tsr pointed out, it's actually an old article, but it's floating back around for some reason. I saw it in the most watched in the sidebar of the BBC website.

Anyway, that's the first I've heard of these, certainly a hidden gem. Also an East Anglian here, but it looks like there aren't many in these parts. Shall have to scoot around and travel on some!

 

[OxtedL]

I caught the Olympia to Wandsworth Rd train on Friday and it was a 4-car 377 and had a few people on board who all seemed to be enthusiasts. I notice from the online journey planners that this service is set to continue from the new timetable and the last day was not on Friday, as many had suspected.

Wherever did we get to on the consultation for this?

 

[TEW]

Ooh, didn't know about these, what diagrams do they run?

Adam

2B96 0530 London Victoria-Bromley South 3-375
9O05 0619 Battersea Park-Highbury & Islington 4-378
2B90 1818 Sevenoaks-London Victoria 4-465
9P70 2217 Highbury & Islington-Battersea Park 4-378

 

[tsr]

I caught the Olympia to Wandsworth Rd train on Friday and it was a 4-car 377 and had a few people on board who all seemed to be enthusiasts. I notice from the online journey planners that this service is set to continue from the new timetable and the last day was not on Friday, as many had suspected.

I was going to be onboard, but there was a track circuit failure at Purley, meaning I was delayed and couldn't fit it into my day. Bother. Well, sometime soon, I hope!

 

[wintonian]

I use the excellent PSUL website to keep an eye on services over unusual lines and/or with unusual frequencies. You can find this here: http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/intro.htm

Newhaven Harbour Junction - Newhaven Harbour [platform 3 = Marine platform] WE03
The unadvertised 2F30 2015 SSuX Newhaven Marine - Lewes has been "temporarily" barred for passenger use since Thursday 17 August 2006 because of the alleged condition of the Marine platform roof. Nevertheless, it continues to run and to be shown as a passenger train in the working timetable, even though passengers are still unable actually to join it.

I see this charade carries on for yet another year - when was it that they pulled the canopy down, I forget? :roll:

 

[IanXC]

Wherever did we get to on the consultation for this?

The DfT have published the outcome of the consultation:

Following consideration of the replies, Ministers have agreed to allow the proposed closure to proceed. The closure is now subject to ratification by the Office for Rail Regulation, which is not automatic.

https://www.gov.uk/government/consu...h-road-kensington-olympia-and-ealing-broadway

 

[northwichcat]

They can, all they have to do is pay Northern Rail to provide the service and Northern will run it.

The underlined bit is the problem!

Not just a money issue but a rolling stock issue. The Denton line is proposed to get an hourly service as a result of the DMUs released from electrification work.

At the moment there are a limited number of ECS workings via Denton but the main reason for those is a lack of paths between Stockport and Piccadilly. Northern made it quite clear that they weren't happy with Virgin taking their paths and extracting Stockport-Piccadilly revenue in the process when they responded to the ORR in response to the Virgin VHF timetable. If a peak time Virgin service was removed Northern would want to snap up that path and increase their share of Stockport-Piccadilly revenue. If they run a daily limited Denton service the stock to snap up that path wouldn't be available, should a path become available again, without cancelling the Denton service which could put Northern in a catch 22 situation.

 

[455driver]

So you agree (in a roundabout way) that it is all to do with money, whether paying out for the (extra) stock needed or money in through ORCATS.

 

[northwichcat]

So you agree (in a roundabout way) that it is all to do with money, whether paying out for the (extra) stock needed or money in through ORCATS.

And a time issue as well. You can't start running a new service next week even if you have the money to buy additional stock as it won't be ready in time.

 

[30907]

(Referring to Denton)

Stations such as Sudbury & Harrow Road and Longcross seem to exist on this principle, and generally do a bit better with a limited but somewhat-better-thought-out service.

The difference being that both are on lines with frequent train services anyway - whereas a (Staylybridge-)Guide Bridge-Stockport train has to generate enough traffic to justify a class 153; the only comparable (ie non-radial) route in the North I can think of is Wakefield-Huddersfield, and that's not exactly busy.

OT: my 1995 WTT for the line shows a service of Staff trains running Piccadilly-Stockport-Reddish S-Guide Bridge during the night hours, I presume these have disappeared?

 

[Eagle]

I use the excellent PSUL website to keep an eye on services over unusual lines and/or with unusual frequencies. You can find this here: http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/intro.htm

The December 2012 version of which has just gone online. (Interesting to see the new parliamentary services from Wandsworth Road to Victoria and Battersea Park operated by SE and LO respectively.)

 

[tsr]

The December 2012 version of which has just gone online. (Interesting to see the new parliamentary services from Wandsworth Road to Victoria and Battersea Park operated by SE and LO respectively.)

Yes - that SET one is most interesting and will hopefully be one I can do soon (maybe even this week, but I doubt it!).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

(Referring to Denton)


The difference being that both are on lines with frequent train services anyway - whereas a (Staylybridge-)Guide Bridge-Stockport train has to generate enough traffic to justify a class 153; the only comparable (ie non-radial) route in the North I can think of is Wakefield-Huddersfield, and that's not exactly busy.

That is, of course, a very good point. If the service frequency was half-hourly, I think a significant pax traffic increase may be in order, but perhaps with insufficient average loadings. The trouble is that such a frequency is incredibly unlikely to be suggested...