XC HST

[voyagerdude220]

They will be MTUd some time this Summer. No-one seems to know when but 'get them while you can' applies if you want Valentas!

I just want an HST powered by engines which aren't MTUs- Whether they're VP185/Valentas, i'm not 100% fussed, but would obviously prefer Valentas.

I'd be grateful just to get double-non MTUs, even if they're both VP185s.

What about EMT HSTs- They haven't got plans tp be MTUd have they?

I bet EMT will be the best for me at the moment, and I can see myself doing quite alot of HST bashing along the MML shortly 8)

 

[class 313]

I just want an HST powered by engines which aren't MTUs- Whether they're VP185/Valentas, i'm not 100% fussed, but would obviously prefer Valentas.

I'd be grateful just to get double-non MTUs, even if they're both VP185s.

What about EMT HSTs- They haven't got plans tp be MTUd have they?

I bet EMT will be the best for me at the moment, and I can see myself doing quite alot of HST bashing along the MML shortly 8)

No, EMT have no plans to MTU.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Very good!:grin:

Thanks for that, Class313

 

[class 313]

Very good!:grin:

Thanks for that, Class313

No problem.

 

[Techniquest]

43290 with a good bloke up the front, did start to challenge some SPM driven Valentas, last summer!

Oh aye, had 290 (with 113 on the back) on the 0735 from Bristol one weekend in August. Due obviously to pass Westbury, we had a signal check briefly. It soon changed to amber, double amber then green a little before we hit it. Needless to say, the driver applied full power very quickly and we got some black clag out of 290. I wish I had got it on film, as proof the MTUs can perform well, but I was very surprised.

voyagerdude220: If you want a pair of Valentas, get out there as soon as you can. Particularly if you work it to have a pair of Valentas storm up the Lickey. Nothing is quite so supreme. Did it last year with a pair of East Coast Valentas, an awesome experience!

 

[voyagerdude220]

voyagerdude220: If you want a pair of Valentas, get out there as soon as you can. Particularly if you work it to have a pair of Valentas storm up the Lickey. Nothing is quite so supreme. Did it last year with a pair of East Coast Valentas, an awesome experience!

Well I had 43108 last Saturday, more importantly, she was on the right end, i.e. First Class end, so I could utilize the door window directly behind her, and loved the whole journey from Manchester to Newquay and return.

43108 performed fantastically, and I loved it when the very friendly driver took over between Bristol Temple M & Birmingham New Street... He really did know how to get the most out of the Valenta, and also appeared to be very spotter friendly, chatting to enthusiasts at Parkway & Cheltenham, and then myself when he got off at New Street.

 

[Techniquest]

But a Valenta+MTU is nothing compared to a pair of Valentas...

 

[Jim]

Well I had 43108 last Saturday, more importantly, she was on the right end, i.e. First Class end, so I could utilize the door window directly behind her, and loved the whole journey from Manchester to Newquay and return.

43108 performed fantastically, and I loved it when the very friendly driver took over between Bristol Temple M & Birmingham New Street... He really did know how to get the most out of the Valenta, and also appeared to be very spotter friendly, chatting to enthusiasts at Parkway & Cheltenham, and then myself when he got off at New Street.

I don't know of any XC drivers that I have had as of yet who haven't had a gossip!

 

[djw1981]

Well with the slack in the timetable, and the HST performance, there should be loads of time for chat!

 

[Techniquest]

Not when I had 9S66 on Friday 23rd...10 late off Tiverton Parkway, ended up 28 minutes late from Cheltenham Spa!

I did go and thank the driver for a fantastic ride up, which I had thoroughly enjoyed. When it came to leaving, I got a thumbs-up and had my ears blasted with the scream of a pair of Valentas. Just thinking about it gives me the biggest grin on my face!

 

[devon_metro]

HSTs simply cannot keep up.

Todays 9S66 is 35 late with no obvious delays, simply poor timekeeping.

 

[Max]

HSTs simply cannot keep up.

Todays 9S66 is 35 late with no obvious delays, simply poor timekeeping.

I am very suprised at this to be honest. There's so much slack in the timetable, and, for example, it takes about the same amount of time between York and Edinburgh on a Voyager as a NXEC HST. How do we know there hasn't been a delay for another reason?

EDIT: Just had a look at the train in question on LDB and it looks like it lost 15 minutes between Birmingham and Derby. I doubt this can be put down to the change of traction. Also, it is due into Dundee only 9 late anyway!

 

[devon_metro]

Timings are tight in Cornwall, and the train is then delayed throughout meaning other trains are pathed in front and it gets progressively later and later. Thats the reason why XC has so much slack, in order to not bring chaos across the country.

 

[yorkie]

EDIT: Just had a look at the train in question on LDB and it looks like it lost 15 minutes between Birmingham and Derby. I doubt this can be put down to the change of traction. Also, it is due into Dundee only 9 late anyway!

Looks like it was behind a Nottingham and had to wait for a Sheffield service to depart before it could be platformed (there is a severe shortage of platforms at Derby currently).

The 0900 GLC-PNZ made up time after its delay at Sheffield when I did it last Thursday despite waiting ages for a platform at BRI and being behind a stopper near Weston super mare. In contrast, today's MAN-PNZ Vomit was 53 late at Ashchurch but lost a further 15 mins by Dawlish. I guess Vomits can't keep up with the timings then

Or maybe it's just that the XC route is prone to delays!

 

[1D53]

9S66 0830 PNZ to DEE

  

Penzance [PNZ] 	  	  	0830 	  	0830 	  	On time 	 
LNGROCK 	  	Pass 	0833 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
St Erth [SER] 	  	0837 	0838 	0839 	0842 	  	4 	 
Camborne [CBN] 	  	0847 	0848 	0851 	0852 	  	4 	 
Redruth [RED] 	  	0853 	0854 	No log 	No log 	  	  	 
Truro [TRU] 	  	0904 	0906 	0910 	0913 	  	7 	 
PROBUS 	  	Pass 	0911 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
BGLWJN 	  	Pass 	0918 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
St Austell [SAU] 	  	0921 	0922 	No log 	No log 	  	  	 
Par [PAR] 	  	0929 	0929 	0936 	0937 	  	8 	 
Lostwithiel [LOS] 	  	Pass 	0936 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Bodmin Parkway [BOD] 	  	0940 	0940 	0946 	0948 	  	8 	 
LRGN 	  	Pass 	0946 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
STPNCVE 	  	Pass 	0947 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Liskeard [LSK] 	  	0952 	0952 	0959 	1001 	  	9 	 
St Germans [SGM] 	  	Pass 	1003 	Pass 	1011 	  	8 	 
Saltash [STS] 	  	Pass 	1010 	Pass 	1016 	  	5 	 
St Budeaux Ferry Road [SBF] 	  	Pass 	1012 	Pass 	1019 	  	7 	 
STBDXJN 	  	Pass 	1013 	Pass 	1022 	  	9 	 
Keyham [KEY] 	  	Pass 	1013 	Pass 	1021 	  	8 	 
Dockyard [DOC] 	  	Pass 	1013 	Pass 	1021 	  	8 	 
Devonport [DPT] 	  	Pass 	1014 	Pass 	1022 	  	8 	 
Plymouth [PLY] 	  	1018 	1025 	1027 	1031 	8 	6 	 
LIPSONJ 	  	Pass 	1027 	Pass 	1034 	  	7 	 
LARAJN 	  	Pass 	1027 	Pass 	1034 	  	7 	 
TVSTCKJ 	  	Pass 	1028 	Pass 	1035 	  	6 	 
HEMERDN 	  	Pass 	1033 	Pass 	1040 	  	7 	 
Ivybridge [IVY] 	  	Pass 	1037 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Totnes [TOT] 	  	1049 	1050 	1056 	1100 	2 	10 	 
DAINTNT 	  	Pass 	1055 	Pass 	1106 	  	10 	 
Newton Abbot [NTA] 	  	1101 	1103 	1110 	1113 	3 	10 	 
Teignmouth [TGM] 	  	Pass 	1107 	Pass 	1119 	  	11 	 
Dawlish [DWL] 	  	Pass 	1110 	Pass 	1121 	  	11 	 
Dawlish Warren [DWW] 	  	Pass 	1112 	Pass 	1123 	  	11 	 
Starcross [SCS] 	  	Pass 	1114 	Pass 	1125 	  	11 	 
EXETRCB 	  	Pass 	1119 	Pass 	1130 	  	10 	 
Exeter St Thomas [EXT] 	  	Pass 	1119 	Pass 	1131 	  	11 	 
Exeter St Davids [EXD] 	  	1121 	1123 	1139 	1141 	5 	18 	 
CWLYBDG 	  	Pass 	1125 	Pass 	1142 	  	17 	 
TIVILP 	  	Pass 	1134 	Pass 	1152 	  	18 	 
Tiverton Parkway [TVP] 	  	1136 	1137 	1153 	1158 	2 	21 	 
WELISOM 	  	Pass 	1142 	Pass 	1202 	  	19 	 
NTNFTZN 	  	Pass 	1146 	Pass 	1204 	  	17 	 
SILKMLC 	  	Pass 	1147 	Pass 	1205 	  	17 	 
Taunton [TAU] 	  	1150 	1151 	1207 	1210 	5 	19 	 
COGLOAD 	  	Pass 	1155 	Pass 	1214 	  	18 	 
Bridgwater [BWT] 	  	Pass 	1159 	Pass 	1218 	  	19 	 
Highbridge & Burnham [HIG] 	  	Pass 	1203 	Pass 	1222 	  	19 	 
UPHILLJ 	  	Pass 	1207 	Pass 	1230 	  	22 	 
Weston-super-Mare [WSM] 	  	Pass 	1207 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Weston Milton [WNM] 	  	Pass 	1207 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
WORLEJ 	  	Pass 	1209 	Pass 	1232 	  	23 	 
Worle [WOR] 	  	Pass 	1210 	Pass 	1231 	  	21 	 
Yatton [YAT] 	  	Pass 	1213 	Pass 	1234 	  	21 	 
Nailsea & Backwell [NLS] 	  	Pass 	1216 	Pass 	1236 	  	20 	 
Parson Street [PSN] 	  	Pass 	1221 	Pass 	1241 	  	20 	 
Bedminster [BMT] 	  	Pass 	1222 	Pass 	1242 	  	19 	 
BRSTLWJ 	  	Pass 	1223 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Bristol Temple Meads [BRI] 	  	1225 	1230 	1245 	1248 	7 	18 	 
BRSTLEJ 	  	Pass 	1231 	Pass 	1249 	  	18 	 
DRDAYSJ 	  	Pass 	1232 	Pass 	1249 	  	17 	 
Lawrence Hill [LWH] 	  	Pass 	1232 	Pass 	1250 	  	18 	 
Stapleton Road [SRD] 	  	Pass 	1233 	Pass 	1251 	  	18 	 
Filton Abbey Wood [FIT] 	  	Pass 	1236 	Pass 	1255 	  	19 	 
Bristol Parkway [BPW] 	  	1238 	1240 	1258 	1300 	3 	20 	 
WSTLGHJ 	  	Pass 	1244 	Pass 	1304 	  	20 	 
YATES 	  	Pass 	1245 	Pass 	1307 	  	21 	 
Yate [YAE] 	  	Pass 	1247 	Pass 	1308 	  	21 	 
CHFIELD 	  	Pass 	1251 	Pass 	1313 	  	21 	 
STNDSHJ 	  	Pass 	1259 	Pass 	1320 	  	20 	 
GLOSTYJ 	  	Pass 	1304 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
BNWDJN 	  	Pass 	1305 	Pass 	1325 	  	20 	 
Cheltenham Spa [CNM] 	  	1310 	1312 	1331 	1335 	  	23 	 
Ashchurch for Tewkesbury [ASC] 	  	Pass 	1317 	Pass 	1340 	  	22 	 
ABTSWDJ 	  	Pass 	1324 	Pass 	1347 	  	23 	 
STKWKSJ 	  	Pass 	1331 	Pass 	1354 	  	23 	 
Bromsgrove [BMV] 	  	Pass 	1332 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Barnt Green [BTG] 	  	Pass 	1335 	Pass 	1400 	  	24 	 
Longbridge [LOB] 	  	Pass 	1340 	Pass 	1401 	  	21 	 
Kings Norton [KNN] 	  	Pass 	1343 	Pass 	1403 	  	19 	 
Selly Oak [SLY] 	  	Pass 	1348 	Pass 	1409 	  	21 	 
Birmingham New Street [BHM] 	  	1357 	1403 	1417 	1421 	  	18 	 
PROOFHJ 	  	Pass 	1405 	Pass 	1423 	  	18 	 
LNDRSTJ 	  	Pass 	1406 	Pass 	1425 	  	18 	 
Water Orton [WTO] 	  	Pass 	1411 	Pass 	1430 	  	19 	 
KNGSBYJ 	  	Pass 	1414 	Pass 	1432 	  	18 	 
Tamworth [TAM] 	  	Pass 	1417 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
WICHNRJ 	  	Pass 	1420 	Pass 	1447 	  	26 	 
Burton-on-Trent [BUT] 	  	Pass 	1426 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
CLMLJN 	  	Pass 	1429 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
NSJDRBY 	  	Pass 	1431 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
STSNJN 	  	Pass 	1432 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Derby [DBY] 	  	1439 	1442 	1511 	1514 	3 	32 	 
AMBERGJ 	  	Pass 	1450 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
CLAYXSJ 	  	Pass 	1456 	Pass 	1530 	  	33 	 
Chesterfield [CHD] 	  	Pass 	1459 	Pass 	1533 	  	33 	 
DORESNJ 	  	Pass 	1511 	Pass 	1539 	  	27 	 
Sheffield [SHF] 	  	1515 	1521 	1545 	1548 	2 	27 	 
NNRYMLJ 	  	Pass 	1522 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
WNCOJN 	  	Pass 	1524 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
ROTHHJN 	  	Pass 	1527 	Pass 	1553 	  	25 	 
ALDWRKJ 	  	Pass 	1530 	Pass 	1556 	  	26 	 
Swinton (South Yorkshire) [SWN] 	  	Pass 	1531 	Pass 	1557 	  	25 	 
Moorthorpe [MRP] 	  	Pass 	1537 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
SKIRBYJ 	  	Pass 	1537 	Pass 	1603 	  	25 	 
HAREPKJ 	  	Pass 	1542 	Pass 	1608 	  	26 	 
Wakefield Westgate [WKF] 	  	1546 	1547 	1613 	1615 	2 	28 	 
HOLBJCN 	  	Pass 	1559 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
WHRDJN 	  	Pass 	1600 	Pass 	1626 	  	26 	 
LEEDSWJ 	  	Pass 	1600 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Leeds [LDS] 	  	1602 	1605 	1628 	1632 	9 	27 	 
NEVLWJN 	  	Pass 	1607 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Cross Gates [CRG] 	  	Pass 	1610 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Micklefield [MIK] 	  	Pass 	1613 	Pass 	1643 	  	29 	 
Church Fenton [CHF] 	  	Pass 	1617 	Pass 	1647 	  	30 	 
COLTONJ 	  	Pass 	1622 	Pass 	1652 	  	30 	 
York [YRK] 	  	1629 	1632 	1659 	1702 	5 	30 	 
SKELTON 	  	Pass 	1634 	Pass 	1704 	  	30 	 
TOLERTN 	  	Pass 	1639 	Pass 	1710 	  	31 	 
Thirsk [THI] 	  	Pass 	1645 	Pass 	1716 	  	31 	 
Northallerton [NTR] 	  	Pass 	1649 	Pass 	1720 	  	31 	 
Darlington [DAR] 	  	1657 	1659 	1732 	1734 	4B 	35 	 
FYHLSJN 	  	Pass 	1707 	Pass 	1744 	  	36 	 
TURSDLJ 	  	Pass 	1709 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Durham [DHM] 	  	Pass 	1713 	Pass 	1750 	  	36 	 
BRTLYJN 	  	Pass 	1722 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
KEBGSJN 	  	Pass 	1724 	Pass 	No log 	  	  	 
Newcastle [NCL] 	  	1727 	1730 	1801 	1805 	2 	35 	 
HTONSJN 	  	Pass 	1733 	Pass 	1807 	  	  	 
Morpeth [MPT] 	  	Pass 	1742 	Pass 	1816 	  	  	 
Alnmouth [ALM] 	  	1754 	1755 	1828 	1829 	  	  	 
BELFORD 	  	Pass 	1806 	Pass 	1839 	  	  	 
Berwick-upon-Tweed [BWK] 	  	Pass 	1814 	Pass 	1848 	  	  	 
REST403 	  	Pass 	1817 	Pass 	1850 	  	  	 
RESTON 	  	Pass 	1821 	Pass 	1855 	  	  	 
GTHS 	  	Pass 	1826 	Pass 	1859 	  	  	 
OXWLCO 	  	Pass 	1833 	Pass 	1906 	  	  	 
Dunbar [DUN] 	  	Pass 	1835 	Pass 	1907 	  	  	 
Drem [DRM] 	  	Pass 	1841 	Pass 	1914 	  	  	 
Prestonpans [PST] 	  	Pass 	1846 	Pass 	1918 	  	  	 
MNKTNHJ 	  	Pass 	1852 	Pass 	1920 	  	  	 
PORTOBL 	  	Pass 	1853 	Pass 	1922 	  	  	 
CRGNTYJ 	  	Pass 	1854 	Pass 	1923 	  	  	 
ABHLJN 	  	Pass 	1855 	Pass 	1924 	  	  	 
Edinburgh [EDB] 	  	1857 	1901 	1925 	1926 	2 	  	 
PRNCSTG 	  	Pass 	1902 	Pass 	1927 	  	  	 
Haymarket [HYM] 	  	1904 	1906 	1929 	1930 	2 	  	 
HAYMRWJ 	  	Pass 	1907 	Pass 	1932 	  	  	 
Dalmeny [DAM] 	  	Pass 	1912 	Pass 	1937 	  	  	 
Inverkeithing [INK] 	  	1918 	1920 	1942 	1943 	  	  	 
Burntisland [BTS] 	  	Pass 	1927 	Pass 	1950 	  	  	 
Kirkcaldy [KDY] 	  	1934 	1935 	1957 	1958 	2 	  	 
THRNTSJ 	  	Pass 	1939 	Pass 	2002 	  	  	 
THRNTNJ 	  	Pass 	1940 	Pass 	2003 	  	  	 
Markinch [MNC] 	  	1943 	1944 	2005 	2006 	  	  	 
Ladybank [LDY] 	  	1950 	1951 	2012 	2013 	  	  	 
Cupar [CUP] 	  	1957 	1958 	2018 	2019 	  	  	 
Leuchars [LEU] 	  	2004 	2005 	2025 	2026 	  	  	 
TAYBDGS 	  	Pass 	2010 	Pass 	2031 	  	  	 
DUNDCJ 	  	Pass 	2018 	Pass 	2036 	  	  	 
Dundee [DEE] 	  	2025 	  	2038

 

[devon_metro]

Should you really be posting that Mr JST 8)

 

[1D53]

Yes!

Edit @ 19:32 - arrived EDB +35.

 

[yorkie]

it was only about 10 late at EXT, but then "signalling problems" occured and it was then approx 20 late and maintained that til about Tamworth - then it would have caught up with the late running Nottingham and had to wait for a platform at DBY.

HSTs can keep to the timings as XC journeys are no quicker now than they used to be 10 years ago, the only noticeable exception to that is DBY-BHM which was upgraded to up to 125.

 

[BlueGrey]

HSTs simply cannot keep up.

Todays 9S66 is 35 late with no obvious delays, simply poor timekeeping.

A 7 car hst is probally about as quick as a voyager with an engine out (which in theory should keep time) but XC can suffer at times through horrendous regulation futher compounded by some of the congested areas they have to pass through.

 

[The Planner]

HSTs can keep to the timings as XC journeys are no quicker now than they used to be 10 years ago, the only noticeable exception to that is DBY-BHM which was upgraded to up to 125.

HSTs cannot keep to the existing Voyager times. They will be timed differently in Dec 08 from Sheffield to Brum to show that.

 

[heart-of-wessex]

with trains being chucked out in front and the timetable going out the window at most times, it seems the whole point of it being a Class 9 is defeating the object too!

 

[P156KWJ]

the point of them having '9' headcodes is so that signallers know to give them priority

 

[yorkie]

It can work. Last Thursday's Glasgow to Penzance seemed to have the same problems waiting for a driver at Leeds as the last one and departed around 13 late. Yet the signallers again put it ahead of the Donny stopper, and held a Rotherham local again, and the train was on time at Plymouth and early into Penzance. Recovering 13 mins isn't bad for a train that can't keep to timings is it?

 

[Julian G]

while at Leeds, I spotted the XC HST (ex-MML) come in at 17:05
Newcastle bound?

 

[The Planner]

To be honest, Id expect it to recover at least 12 anyway, as thats how much engineering allowance is put in the schedules to cover TSRs on the route from Chesterfield to Penzance. If there arent any, then it gains, simple as that.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Especially seeing that the timetable, as previously said, has plenty of slack included, but to give some examples....

Derby to Birmingham New Street= 42 minutes + 4 in New Street- When running on time, or if able to get a straight run when running late (very unlikely) , Voyagers/Super Voyagers can do it in 30 minutes, and I doubt that an HST, especially in 2+7, will take alot longer....

Bristol Parkway to Bristol Temple Meads- 16 minutes + 3 in Temple Meads- Usual running time= 8 minutes- HSTs can probably match that ....

Totnes to Plymouth= 26 minutes + 12 in Plymouth....
Well that should be a straight 5-10 minutes knocked off any delay, with the 12 minutes allowed in Plymouth...

So really, there's at least 30 minutes slack in the timetable....

Same on Virgin West Coast 221's - One of our Super Voyagers did Preston-Birmingham New Street in 1 hour 24 minutes when running late, despite being scheduled to take 1 hour 42 minutes. It could have knocked at least another 5 off, if it wasn't for TSRs along the way.... (Started at Preston due to scheduled engineering works north of Preston).