Wrexham & Shropshire

[Max]

I can't see the service lasting....its to slow to be a viable option to London, even more so when Virgin starts from Wrexham. Enjoy it while you can.

I don't know about that. When Hull Trains started, it took a while but loads gradually improved over time, up to the point where many services were very busy - and that was using 170s with only a max. speed of 100mph. This mean journey times were longer than ATN+GNER beyond Doncaster, or in fact using the direct GNER service. People liked it because it was direct, and the customer service was excellent. I believe that at the end of the day, the average passenger prefers not to change when making a long journey, even if it does mean a slightly longer journey time.

 

[yorkie]

I travelled on the W&S on Monday 12th May using the 1610 Marylebone - Wrexham throughout. Only 9 passengers in std class leaving London and those loadings didn't improve throughout the journey. Only two on at Banbury, despite calling at Wovles its not shown in the timetable as such. Only about 5 passengers off the train at Wrexham.

A mate of mine got a service from Tame Bridge Parkway back to London later that evening, loadings quite low on that service as well (arrived in London at 2215).


I can't see the service lasting....its to slow to be a viable option to London, even more so when Virgin starts from Wrexham. Enjoy it while you can.

Sounds like GC in the early days, but the (relatively ) reliable services (0646 from SUN and 1650 from KGX) soon picked up and are now very busy indeed! The quieter services would have picked up, I think, if cheap tickets had been made available (actually it's probably a good thing they weren't....) and they had been more reliable. The 1730 off SUN is dead, but it is often cancelled so people don't trust it.

I think WSMR will pick up soon, but their AP fares really should be cheaper in order to attract more new customers.

 

[Jord]

I heard that there are only 3 trains a day in each direction?

Does anybody know when the full timetable will be in operation?

 

[djw1981]

AIUI full timetable is in place - 5 services weekdays, 3 on sunday but using only 3 trains.

 

[The Planner]

Full service is in operation already. Its been devised and set up by the Hull Trains people anyway so it's got a good chance of staying the course. There is a significant amount of LSI we are looking at on the Chilterns so the journey time will decrease (Chiltern want a 100 minute Marylebone - Brum time, and down to 90 eventually.)

 

[Thewanderer]

I travelled with Hull Trains twice last January (both on the 86). On my 2nd trip passengers we got talking to were actually complaining about the MK3's, but the service was well loaded. They preferred the Pioneers.

On my W&S trip on arrival at Telford, one of the few ex London passengers who disembarked was met on the platform by friends. I overheard her saying "what a long trip" or something to that effect. Don't get me wrong, the onboard service is excellent and the staff make frequent trips up and down the train but I think the service is to slow to make a big impact. You stroll up from London, usually stuck behind a Snow Hill bound Chiltern service, then take a nice ramble around and through the centre of Birmingham. I only felt we were making decent progress after Wolves, some 2 hours and 30 mins after London.

I do hope the service is a sucess but they need to entice more passengers!

 

[Max]

I think the problem is that the Chiltern route is still not the big intercity route that it once was. Linespeeds are painfully slow in places. I particularly remember it being very slow getting out of London when I travelled to High Wycombe - takes an eternity to get to the Wembley area!

 

[Metroland]

It's quite quick in places but could do with speeding up and stopping services get in the way: It's 40/50 coming out of London, and 75mph to Princes Risborough. 100mph to Aynho, the junction is about 40, then the ruling linespeed on the Leamington line is 90mph. Around the West Midlands it's mostly around 75mph, although there are busts of speed that are higher.

I have to agree, Wrexham is a long way, I'm surprised they went any further than Shrewsbury.

 

[The Planner]

100mph to Aynho

Nope, its sprinter differential up to Aynho. Nothing above a 168 can go higher than 60mph to Bicester. After that I think its 80 or 90 up to Aynho.

We are currently having a right game as the track engineers place 30mph TSRs between Princes Risbrough and Bicester for freight when Rugby is blocked.

 

[Metroland]

I did wonder if disc braked stock might get away with it? That said, No wonder it takes such a long time to get to Banbury. Should have gone for multiple units with that length train.

 

[The Planner]

Its a weight issue, the embankments between Princes Risbrough and Bicester arent in the best of nick to be honest (thery were made from ash alledgedly) so anything thats heavier than a unit gets restricted. It doesnt help that 67s are RA8 and proper heavy things, they are restricted to 100mph on the ECML. Its only the Great Western where they can actuallly get to top speed.

 

[class 313]

Its a weight issue, the embankments between Princes Risbrough and Bicester arent in the best of nick to be honest (thery were made from ash alledgedly) so anything thats heavier than a unit gets restricted. It doesnt help that 67s are RA8 and proper heavy things, they are restricted to 100mph on the ECML. Its only the Great Western where they can actuallly get to top speed.

67s can't even run on a full fuel tank because they are that heavy.

 

[nath9425]

If it was 90 mph all the way along the line (Apart from the 40 at Ayhno) I reckon you could slash journey times by at least 20 minutes.

Just taking a look at the timetable of 1K53 (18:00 London To Kidderminster) and it arrives - Longs it had a good run - 63 minutes after leaving London into Banbury (19:03).

Now comparing WSMR it takes a good 81 minutes to clear the line to Banbury showing that an extra 18 minutes has been added just by the PSR's for the locos on the line.

If they had different stock maybe a 170 or something then I could see some times being broken. Then again the 10mph PSR Throughout BNS if passing through there isn't exactly ideal is it.

 

[Nym]

67s sound like they could have done with being CO-CO instead of BO-BO, would have taken half again off the axle load and greatly increased route availability..!

Although I don't think any modern MUs are up to the job of what the Mk3s can do, The only ones that come even close are the vomiters and breakers (180s), the desiros aren't fast enough, the turbostars have the same problem. Although Some Desiros or Turbostars, with doors at the end and a very nice caterage onboard could work, or maybe the new valeros off siemenrs

 

[djw1981]

On the interurban routes in Scotland - Edin/Gla to Prth/Inverness/Aberdeen, I think that the on-board ambience is as good as a Mk3, an the acceleration is not bad either. On the Ex Hull Trains sets, with Buffet and declassified FC which has doors between the entrance vestibules and the seating, the noise and draughts are much reduced. Thus for shorter routes (ie 2-3hrs) with lower loadings they are ideal IMO.

 

[paul1609]

I prefer the Chilterns 168s to Pendolinos for the London to Birmingham trip.
I'm willing to put up with the longer journey times for the greater reliability.
The WCML seems chronically unreliable to me.
I'll certainly be travelling WSMR to Shrewsbury shortly after I return to the UK.

 

[TDK]

Nope, its sprinter differential up to Aynho. Nothing above a 168 can go higher than 60mph to Bicester. After that I think its 80 or 90 up to Aynho.

We are currently having a right game as the track engineers place 30mph TSRs between Princes Risbrough and Bicester for freight when Rugby is blocked.

The speeds for Loco & Stock from ME to BAN are:

25 out of Marylebone
50 up to about 1000m from Neasden Jct
60 up to Neasden Jct
40 Across Neaden Jct
60 then 50 to Northolt Jct
70 to High Wycombe
50 through High Wycome
70 to Princes risborough
30 through Princes Risborough
40 then 60 to Bicester North
45 through Bicester North
85 to Aynho Jct
25 then 40 through Aynho Jct
90/85 then 75 to Banbury

The sprinter speeds are a lot higher in most places.

The only other parts of the route that has restrictions that affect the timings are 60 vice 80 on the Kennilworth lines or 70/75/70 between Leamington and Small Heath & 60 vice 70 from Salop to Wrexham.

Hope this clears up the line speeds for the loco & stock

 

[Jord]

Excuse my ignorance, but:

What's the route for these trains between Tame Bridge and Banbury?

Tame Bridge - Stechford - Birmingham International - Coventry - Leamington Spa - Banbury & VV

If so, does every train use this route or are some different?

Cheers, Jord

 

[TDK]

Excuse my ignorance, but:

What's the route for these trains between Tame Bridge and Banbury?

Tame Bridge - Stechford - Birmingham International - Coventry - Leamington Spa - Banbury & VV

If so, does every train use this route or are some different?

Cheers, Jord

The up services to London most go Wrexham, Salop, Wolves, Tame Bridge via bescot, Aston, Stechford, Birmingham Int, Coventry, Leamington, Banbury, London.

On the down most go Marylebone, Banbury, Leamington, New Street via Tyseley, Soho South, Perry Bar North, Tame Bridge, Wolves, Salop Wrexham. There are one or 2 that go via coventry on the down, I know the 13.XX off of Marylebone goes via Coventry, then again they could be routed any way as long as the drivers sign the routes.

 

[mossend]

Anybody know which 67's have been out on the Wrexham-Marylebone's this week?

 

[87015]

Anybody know which 67's have been out on the Wrexham-Marylebone's this week?

Never after any red pen ones are you

 

[Proud Salopian]

Anybody know which 67's have been out on the Wrexham-Marylebone's this week?

The 15:53 departure from Shrewsbury, yesterday, which I just managed to catch before getting on the Manchester train:

http://david100.fotopic.net/c1513906.html

67028 (EWS)
67015 (WSMR)

 

[TDK]

Anybody know which 67's have been out on the Wrexham-Marylebone's this week?

The latest one is 67020 that replaced 028 I belive.

 

[class 313]

The latest one is 67020 that replaced 028 I belive.

028 was on today.

 

[33056]

When I checked yesterday evening, the pairs were;
67012 + 67020
67014 + 67025
67015 + 67028

 

[Julian G]

I went on the Wrexham service from Tame Bridge Parkway-London Marlyebone on Wednesday (1645 ex), the coaches seemed to have many spare table seats available, it was held at Birmingham Intl from 1702-1725 in order for a Soton bound Freightliner to pass it :roll: which we have overtaken at Banbury
I couldn't stop laughing at the people at Banbury with the smug look at the sight of a Quality half-empty Intercity train, and I secured my first 67....... 015

 

[TDK]

When I checked yesterday evening, the pairs were;
67012 + 67020
67014 + 67025
67015 + 67028

020 has been replaced with 003 and 013 is back on the scene

 

[voyagerdude220]

Please could someone kindly tell me the mileage of the 07:25 Wrexham to Marylebone, from Shrewsbury, as I'm not sure which route it's booked to take, and so can't currently calculate the mileage.

I'd greatly appreciate any help.

Thanks!

 

[The Planner]

Dont know the mileage, but its booked Shrewsbury, Wolves, Tame Bridge, Aston, Stechford, International, Cov, Leamington.

 

[Proud Salopian]

I've just noticed that in the timetable the last train back from Marylebone on Sundays from 17 May - 19 July ends at Shrewsbury. What happens there then? Is it stabled overnight in Shrewsbury?