Why don't the UK TOCs have an "audio brand"?

[Bletchleyite]

Internationally, quite a number of railways have a catchy "audio brand", used both in advertising and for things like the "bing bong" before announcements. Other businesses find this successful, such as Nestle who have a catchy little jingle at the end of all their TV advertising, and more recently the "Ring" brand of video doorbells has used the actual "ding dong" as an audio brand.

Why I wonder do UK TOCs (and indeed bus companies) not do this? I wonder if that master of branding Stenning has thought about it?

Examples from around the world:

SNCF:

SBB:

(one of the three is used depending on which bit of Switzerland you are in, and TV/radio advertising uses all 3 in a row)
DB:

(though I don't think it's been used on announcements, they tend to use the traditional "bong-bing")
BR: Well, sort of - the old 3-tone ascending jingle you got before announcements sort of said "Bri-tish Rail" but I don't know if that was intentional

 

[choochoochoo]

Probably a financial thing. It's another cost to bear when a different TOC takes over. I mean GN stations PIS screens still have 'check FCC website' displayed when they go on the blink. So imagine having to reprogramme all those PAs too.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

"See it. Say it. Sorted"

 

[Clip]

Is it needed though?

Would our population actually know any difference of a pre announcement jingle rather than just wanting to know what platform trains are going from?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Is it needed though?

Would our population actually know any difference of a pre announcement jingle rather than just wanting to know what platform trains are going from?

Clearly no branding is "needed" at all in that sense, unbranded factory white trains still get you where you are going. But branding is a key part of marketing - so why not?

 

[Bertie the bus]

There is a big difference between brand advertising and sounds you just hear when out and about. To most people station announcements are just noise. People don’t care whether there is a uniform pre announcement noise, they won’t notice it and even if they do notice they will ignore it along with the announcement.

 

[Clip]

Clearly no branding is "needed" at all in that sense, unbranded factory white trains still get you where you are going. But branding is a key part of marketing - so why not?

Surely even you must know the massive difference between countries where the major player is a state owned ( as such) entity and ours where we have multiple train operating companies - livery gets your brand noticed a little jingle on announcements doesn't.

 

[theironroad]

"See it. Say it. Sorted"

Just need to put it in a catchy little Jingle...

 

[LowLevel]

I always liked the jingle at New Street back in the 2000s as per this video

There never seemed to be a particular standard for it nationwide though, different places had different jingles and apart from in some locations where they indicate a manual announcement being made they're nearly extinct I think. Even Worksop Station used to have it's own little jingle until recently

I think the British habit of spamming you to death with announcements has rendered them unnecessary because it is more unusual for a station to be quiet.

I once sat at Derby Station at gone 10 at night waiting to work a train forward and I could see no one else on the platform. There was just a constant stream of audio bollocks playing to no one in particular. Security. Engineering work this weekend. Mind out, it's wet (it wasn't). Don't struggle on the stairs, there's lifts.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

"See it. Say it. Sorted"

Lol exactly what I was thinking too!

 

[D365]

I always liked the jingle at New Street back in the 2000s as per this video

There never seemed to be a particular standard for it nationwide though, different places had different jingles and apart from in some locations where they indicate a manual announcement being made they're nearly extinct I think. Even Worksop Station used to have it's own little jingle until recently

This jingle was probably the most common, to be fair. Aside from New Street, my personal memory is travelling to/from Kings Cross in WAGN days. Along with the "toothpaste" 365s, the Great Northern route seemed to carry the flag for Network SouthEast until well into the noughties!

 

[Spartacus]

About the only good I can see it having is if you have a short tune played before an actually train announcement to differentiate it from all the rubbish there is in between, like the old ‘Bing-bong, bing’ it’d probably be best being the same for all operators.

 

[py_megapixel]

I'm surprised nobody's pointed out the obvious example of this in the UK...

 

[BayPaul]

Clearly no branding is "needed" at all in that sense, unbranded factory white trains still get you where you are going. But branding is a key part of marketing - so why not?

I agree completely. The sncf noise sounds very stylish and French whenever it is played, and reminds you who is operating the service. Of course it doesn't need to be a noise, it can be a verbal style, such as using a distinctive accent for the announcements, or using a particular tone of voice or style of wording - virgin did this a lot and divided opinions well, but it did certainly fit their brand. But most tocs do a fairly rubbish job of branding, seeming to think that if they can choose the right compass point when naming the brand and get all the trains into their corporate colours before the end of the franchise they are ahead of the game! Why couldn't Avanti, for example, have gone down the Italian styling route, perhaps using appropriate (but clear) accents for automated announcements, a burst of opera before important announcements perhaps, to match in with Italian leather(ette) on the first class seats, a pasta themed menu, and an appropriately stylish interior decor. It would make for a consistent and memorable experience, rather than just any old train.

 

[py_megapixel]

I agree completely. The sncf noise sounds very stylish and French whenever it is played, and reminds you who is operating the service. Of course it doesn't need to be a noise, it can be a verbal style, such as using a distinctive accent for the announcements, or using a particular tone of voice or style of wording - virgin did this a lot and divided opinions well, but it did certainly fit their brand. But most tocs do a fairly rubbish job of branding, seeming to think that if they can choose the right compass point when naming the brand and get all the trains into their corporate colours before the end of the franchise they are ahead of the game! Why couldn't Avanti, for example, have gone down the Italian styling route, perhaps using appropriate (but clear) accents for automated announcements, a burst of opera before important announcements perhaps, to match in with Italian leather(ette) on the first class seats, a pasta themed menu, and an appropriately stylish interior decor. It would make for a consistent and memorable experience, rather than just any old train.

Perhaps they don't want to reinforce the fact that our supposedly privatised railways are in fact being run by the nationalised railway companies of foreign countries!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I agree completely. The sncf noise sounds very stylish and French whenever it is played, and reminds you who is operating the service. Of course it doesn't need to be a noise, it can be a verbal style, such as using a distinctive accent for the announcements, or using a particular tone of voice or style of wording - virgin did this a lot and divided opinions well, but it did certainly fit their brand.

I suppose ATOS Annie is sort of an audio brand, but almost certainly not a good one as she just sounds bored. Maybe a good commuter brand

Northern have done this quite well, using a distinctly Northern accent on the PIS on the 195s and 331s.

But most tocs do a fairly rubbish job of branding, seeming to think that if they can choose the right compass point when naming the brand and get all the trains into their corporate colours before the end of the franchise they are ahead of the game! Why couldn't Avanti, for example, have gone down the Italian styling route, perhaps using appropriate (but clear) accents for automated announcements, a burst of opera before important announcements perhaps, to match in with Italian leather(ette) on the first class seats, a pasta themed menu, and an appropriately stylish interior decor. It would make for a consistent and memorable experience, rather than just any old train.

I did offer them, free of charge, the strapline "travel with a bit of Italian flair" (well, I posted it on here) - and that could have been an overall branding package.

 

[py_megapixel]

I suppose ATOS Annie is sort of an audio brand, but almost certainly not a good one as she just sounds bored. Maybe a good commuter brand

I'm fairly sure commuters in most parts of the country now have a reflexive sigh upon hearing the phrase, "May I HAVE your ATTENTION please, on... platform <whichever>"... they know what comes next...

Northern have done this quite well, using a distinctly Northern accent on the PIS on the 195s and 331s.

Would be nice if they'd invested in decent quality speakers, and a PIS controller which isn't the cheapest of the cheap, on everything except the flagship new trains. Some grammar checking on the displays would also be good, and in all fairness that has happened gradually as the system has been rolled out, though they still have one case where a space followed by a comma is used where there should be a full stop followed by a space instead. It looks very unprofessional.

The first Northern TrainFX fitted unit I got on was so poor, I thought there was some kind of fault with it.

 

[bassmike]

Enough noise around already!

 

[KeithMcC]

The French announcement tones are very distinctive but seems to go with the trains - South Korean high speed trains are a straight copy of the TGV and to my surprise also used the SNCF tones.

 

[route101]

There was the BR Bong, don't hear that now.

Glasgow Central had its own bong and Queen St too, less distinctive but lasted later.

The announcements at Northern stations sound old school, Celia.

Anne was always in some stations but is more popular now.

 

[Fokx]

Northern have done this quite well, using a distinctly Northern accent on the PIS on the 195s and 331s.

I particularly like the geordie male voice of the announcements, particularly the “see it say it sorted” which makes the tone of a security sound much more friendlier/happier

TPE’s classic announcements the male/female also appear to do this with what I believe is a Hull(?) accent, there’s certain phrases which really stand out particularly on the lesser-used list

Merseyrail used to use a pre-recorded scouse lady (presumably a member of staff) which played on the escalators at Lime Street station but unfortunately have been switched off. “Please hold tight and stand to the right” in a strong scouse accent was always nice to hear

 

[LSWR Cavalier]

Listened to the DB sound design, awful, can not remember hearing it on trains fortunately
Having to hear such a cacophony would put many people off train travel

 

[43096]

I did offer them, free of charge, the strapline "travel with a bit of Italian flair" (well, I posted it on here) - and that could have been an overall branding package.

It would have been one way of trying to cover the reality that Avanti is run by a 5th rate Aberdeen bus company.

 

[alangla]

The sound from the traction equipment on the Montreal Metro MR-73 stock is so distinctive it’s now used as the door closing sound, even on stock that doesn’t naturally make that sound. Not sure if they use it as the sound signature but it’s definitely distinctive

 

[Bletchleyite]

Listened to the DB sound design, awful, can not remember hearing it on trains fortunately
Having to hear such a cacophony would put many people off train travel

I wouldn't call it a cacophony, though I don't think it's great. It's very 80s synth-music.

 

[Clip]

It would have been one way of trying to cover the reality that Avanti is run by a 5th rate Aberdeen bus company.

Which 4 are in front of it? Also do you forget they have some Italian involvement?

 

[geoffk]

Surely even you must know the massive difference between countries where the major player is a state owned ( as such) entity and ours where we have multiple train operating companies - livery gets your brand noticed a little jingle on announcements doesn't.

You get the train to where you want to go, regardless of what colour it is or what name is on the side.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Which 4 are in front of it?

Stagecoach, Wellglade, Go-Ahead and Transdev, certainly, in my view (no particular order).

 

[py_megapixel]

I don't really understand why everyone complains about FirstGroup so much. In my book they do an awful lot better than Arriva (who are the masters in the industries of costcutting and completely failing to innovate) and, in the case of the bus industry, many local independent operators (who in many cases are downright shoddy and unhelpful).

I should probably point out that I don't wish to tar all with the same brush here, there are some excellent independents and municipal companies out there as well.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don't really understand why everyone complains about FirstGroup so much. In my book they do an awful lot better than Arriva (who are the masters in the industries of costcutting and completely failing to innovate) and, in the case of the bus industry, many local independent operators (who in many cases are downright shoddy and unhelpful).

This is very true - but they generally aren't good enough when compared to the other 4.

I agree that very small operators seem mostly to be disreputable in some way.