Which TOC has best and worst first class

[furryfeet]

An honourable mention goes to CrossCountry, on which the step up to First on Voyagers is massive and even now the pricing on the Central Belt is unusually cheap

Can you give any examples of these cheap 1st class fares on the Central Belt,
whether walk-on or Apex ?
The only example I can think of is the 1st off-peak day return from Derby to Sheffield at 16.20 ( 2nd is 10.80 ) available after 0900.

For what it is worth, having done the above journey recently, 1st class on the EMT voyager was more comfortable than the Arriva voyager and the service on EMT was better too, being a full trolley service rather than a single cup of tea.
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Southern's First Class on 377s is barely better than Southeastern's.

You get worse armrests and an antimacassar which may or may not be dirty - and on a seat which may in fact be sideways. The sideways seats don't have tables, as such. Some First Class areas have a door. Indeed, some of the table seats even have plug sockets.

So if was travelling from London Victoria to East Grinstead at the weekend, for the Bluebell railway, the opinion is "the extra 7.00 for 1st class is not worth it"
( 1st is 21.10, 2nd is 14.10 rtn)
Or is there some form of "combined through ticket" which would make it better value overall ?

 

[ainsworth74]

Can you give any examples of these cheap 1st class fares on the Central Belt,
whether walk-on or Apex ?
The only example I can think of is the 1st off-peak day return from Derby to Sheffield at 16.20 ( 2nd is 10.80 ) available after 0900.

Central Belt here refers to the area between Edinburgh and Glasgow, not XC's core around Birmingham. In this case a First Anytime Day Return from Edniburgh to Glasgow on XC Only is £16.00 compared with ScotRail's Any Permitted of £37.70. Those prices are actually higher than they were two years ago (£7.50 for the same ticket) or even a year ago (£14.60 for the same ticket).

 

[GodAtum]

As someone who travels on Southern's first class I can say that it is rubbish compared to FGW HSTs. I have a 1st ticket to get a betetr chance of a seat, unfortunately everyone ignores its 1st class, too many people sitting there without a 1st class ticket

I do love FGW HST leather seats and food.

 

[OxtedL]

So if was travelling from London Victoria to East Grinstead at the weekend, for the Bluebell railway, the opinion is "the extra 7.00 for 1st class is not worth it"
( 1st is 21.10, 2nd is 14.10 rtn)

First class wouldn't be worth it, unless you really don't like sitting near People.

Southern 1st class is very much aimed at giving people a better shot at getting seats and not much else. At weekends it never gets anything like crowded enough for getting a seat to be an issue.

Southern guards are noticeably checking 1st class areas much more often in recent times, I think, so issues about non-1st ticket holders sitting where they shouldn't might be going away. (I don't know the scale of the problem, having never used 1st class.)

 

[Ivo]

Central Belt here refers to the area between Edinburgh and Glasgow, not XC's core around Birmingham. In this case a First Anytime Day Return from Edniburgh to Glasgow on XC Only is £16.00 compared with ScotRail's Any Permitted of £37.70. Those prices are actually higher than they were two years ago (£7.50 for the same ticket) or even a year ago (£14.60 for the same ticket).

First time I did it was February 2010. For an Anytime First Class single on an HST from Edinburgh to Glasgow Central, I paid all of...

...One pound and seventy pence.

 

[Goatboy]

Those prices are actually higher than they were two years ago (£7.50 for the same ticket) or even a year ago (£14.60 for the same ticket).

Wow, it was £7.50 for a First Anytime Return XC only?! Why was it so cheap?

 

[ainsworth74]

Wow, it was £7.50 for a First Anytime Return XC only?! Why was it so cheap?

Well at that point there were only a couple of services per day so it was very restrictive. Since May 2011 there have been more services so the price has gone up, but it's still very reasonable to my mind. As is the standard class equivalent at £10.30. These fares used to be available on the ECML as well and very useful they were

 

[westv]

Am surprised no one has mentioned Hull Trains - I can't believe they are operated by First as their 1st class offering has been the best of any of them - even at weekends. Cutlery and crockery and hot food and very friendly and amenable staff.

I've used HT 1st class several times out of London on a Friday and I'd agree their staff are very friendly.
Just a pity that it's been slightly spoilt by a lack of printed menus so you can see what's available without having to ask (yes, I know there's a menu on the website but that's not the point) and no dessert being offered even though "luxury cakes" is shown on the website menu.
East Coast also offers free wine/beer and biscuits/snacks but their tickets are more expensive.

 

[aylesbury]

Virgin is excellent with good service, reasonable food, and very attentive staff.

FGW offer a reasonable service and coupled with the travelling chef, it's good value for money. With the offers on tickets, first class is a great way to travel.

 

[merlodlliw]

ATW run an open access once a day service on behalf of Welsh Govt, this must be one of the best First Class carriages in the UK.
Has its the only one, its hardly the worst.

Runs Mon to Friday Holyhead/Cardiff/Holyhead. However the timings are of little use to most business people.

Bob

 

[westv]

I've used HT 1st class several times out of London on a Friday and I'd agree their staff are very friendly.
Just a pity that it's been slightly spoilt by a lack of printed menus so you can see what's available without having to ask (yes, I know there's a menu on the website but that's not the point) and no dessert being offered even though "luxury cakes" is shown on the website menu.
East Coast also offers free wine/beer and biscuits/snacks but their tickets are more expensive.

Oh just to add that HT must have a shortage of cutlery as all their hot food in the evening comes with only a spoon.

 

[Qwerty133]

Oh just to add that HT must have a shortage of cutlery as all their hot food in the evening comes with only a spoon.

Seriously if this is true I suggest they visit tesco to buy more before tomorrow!

 

[plastictaffy]

In my (admittedly short) career as a railwayman so far, I think that the worst first class must be Southern's services to Milton Keynes - I can see absolutely no difference between it and standard class at all, apart from the headrest covers.

The best must surely be Virgin. Tea and coffee, cold drinks and snacks offered at seat, (even if you're a railway worker - however I wouldn't take advantage of such a service, dear me, no) free Wi-Fi which is idiot-proof to connect to, power sockets at all seats, and really rather comfortable seats.

However I notice that the trains smell a bit funny - doesn't matter where you sit, or whether it's a Pendolino or Voyager, they smell a bit odd, but the smell seems to be worse the nearer to the vestibules you are. Any idea what this odd odour is?? Seeing as how it's the same smell on the Voyagers as well, I wonder if it's some of the materials used at manufacture........

 

[Eagle]

In my (admittedly short) career as a railwayman so far, I think that the worst first class must be Southern's services to Milton Keynes - I can see absolutely no difference between it and standard class at all, apart from the headrest covers.

The difference is it isn't wedged full of passengers in the morning peak. That's pretty much the only advantage to first class on suburban services around London.

 

[plastictaffy]

Does that make it worth paying the god-knows-how-much-extra that it must be from Standard to First?? But then, I guess it does depend very much on how far you're travelling.

 

[Tibbs]

In my (admittedly short) career as a railwayman so far, I think that the worst first class must be Southern's services to Milton Keynes - I can see absolutely no difference between it and standard class at all, apart from the headrest covers.

That train is part of Southern's 'Metro' Service, and there is no First class on their Metro services. The scrolling signs confirm this.

Having said that, I'd hate to use a 377 with an actual 1st class ticket - there is no difference in seating between 1st and Std 2+2 seating as far as I can see.

 

[tsr]

That train is part of Southern's 'Metro' Service, and there is no First class on their Metro services. The scrolling signs confirm this.

Having said that, I'd hate to use a 377 with an actual 1st class ticket - there is no difference in seating between 1st and Std 2+2 seating as far as I can see.

It depends which exact 377 you're on.

Some of the First Class seats are considerably worse - sideways, for example.

 

[tractakid]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=vsITJx-amZA#t=148s

Filmed at MKC on Saturday, if anyone's wondering what the fuss is about...

 

[mirodo]

That train is part of Southern's 'Metro' Service, and there is no First class on their Metro services. The scrolling signs confirm this.

Having said that, I'd hate to use a 377 with an actual 1st class ticket - there is no difference in seating between 1st and Std 2+2 seating as far as I can see.

So one can sit/stand in the first class section with fear of reprisal?

I was on a Balham - East Croydon service yesterday which was rather crowded - less so in the first class section which I was stood adjacent to.

Searching for fares on the eastcoast website only shows standard class fares available - could I have sat/stood in first class?

 

[Tibbs]

So one can sit/stand in the first class section with fear of reprisal?

I was on a Balham - East Croydon service yesterday which was rather crowded - less so in the first class section which I was stood adjacent to.

Searching for fares on the eastcoast website only shows standard class fares available - could I have sat/stood in first class?

As far as I know, yes. I've certainly sat many times in first class between Watford and Shepherds Bush on that service and had a ticket check with no issues at all.

 

[dstrat]

East Coast best, Southeastern worst.

But I guess as said, East Coast's stock has been designed to provide the first class 'experience' whereas Southeastern merely gives you a seat - one which is exactly the same as standard!

I've often sat in 'first' with passengers on Southeastern in quiet periods....never been told 'oi this is first' by the guard. Says it all really.

 

[Eeveevolve]

The worst would be Northern.

If you want first class travel, find another way.

 

[ScottMathew]

Agree with the consensus here, if First Class means just sitting in a different part of the train with seats hardly any different to Standard (except maybe in colour) and no service different than Standard, then what's the point? You've paid the extra on your fare for nothing.

Have only travelled in FC once, when Midland Mainline operated the Midland Main Line (my local line). EMT trains on the Midland Main Line have a very goof FC service, serving complimentary coffee, tea, fruit juices and the breakfasts I think look very good (I haven't had one).

 

[maniacmartin]

Agree with the consensus here, if First Class means just sitting in a different part of the train with seats hardly any different to Standard (except maybe in colour) and no service different than Standard, then what's the point? You've paid the extra on your fare for nothing.

I disagree. On a busy commuter line into London at peak time, it greatly increases getting a seat. The comparison is actually, "a decent chance of a seat" vs "probably having to stand".

 

[yorksrob]

I disagree. On a busy commuter line into London at peak time, it greatly increases getting a seat. The comparison is actually, "a decent chance of a seat" vs "probably having to stand".

Not much of a sell for any time other than the high peak though. A better, more distinctive design of first class could bring in premium fares at other times as well.

 

[Matt Taylor]

For difference within the same TOC how about 450 vs 159 on SWT (450 has Electrostar seats in 1st, 159 has the same as First on EC or FGW HSTs)

The SWT 158s also have the same seats in standard and first as the 159s, the first class seats are very nice-probably the best on SWT.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/40172673@N03/8680283815/in/photostream


Not many TOCs have first class on 158s but I don't know of any better than SWT, although the old Northern Spirit first class was pretty good.

 

[plastictaffy]

I've noticed that no-one seemed to be able to answer my question about the rather odd smell on-board the Pendolino's and Voyagers........
I know it didn't relate to the thread, but, well, still, anyone know??

 

[DarloRich]

Well, I've never travelled first class and haven't been on many TOC's, but from what I have seem online, London Midland must be a contender for the worst first class.

It consists of a few seats in the middle of the train separated by a door. The seats aren't much better than standard and there isn't even a trolley service or WiFi access!

so you are in a great position to join in a debate about first class travel then :roll:

What is the obsession with first class on this site? Cant we have a thread about who has the best second class travel?

For my money the best first class is East Coast. Proper trains, comfortable seats, windows you can see out of, decent free food, free wifi, light, airy spacious, quiet carriages and decent on board service.

As a complete package i think it is hard to beat.

 

[ainsworth74]

What is the obsession with first class on this site? Cant we have a thread about who has the best second class travel?

You're welcome to start one

 

[Aldaniti]

so you are in a great position to join in a debate about first class travel then :roll:

What is the obsession with first class on this site? Cant we have a thread about who has the best second class travel?
.

Second class has to be either Grand Central or SWT 159's for me. I was surprised how comfy the latter where when I travelled from Exeter last year.