Virgin XC

[voyagerdude220]

Hi all,

I'm strongly against Arriva taking over the XC franchise, from Virgin, and was wondering if me and VT Dan are on our own, for thinking that VT should have kept the XC franchise? (I'm hoping we aren't!!)

Please vote In my poll. I haven't included a Maybe/Other option, as it wouldn't really work IMO.

Thanks

 

[Donny Dave]

All these topics about Arriva taking over the XC franchise are a bit pointless in my opinion. Couldn't they have been kept in a single thread?

Also, how come several people are quick to slate Arriva several months before they take over the franchise? Are you crystal ball gazers who can tell the future?

 

[Spaceflower]

I cant comment, but they dont seem to be doing particularly well on the buses here in the NE, although this probably isnt entirely their fault but the fares are astronomical.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Couldn't they have been kept in a single thread?

Not to my knowledge.

Are you crystal ball gazers who can tell the future?

Yes, of course I am!

My biggest moan about the take over, is the removal of the shop, amongst other things. My bain basis of my complaints about Arriva taking over though, is the fact that they couldn't even run Arriva Trains Northern properly, and Arriva Trains Wales isn't the most reliable TOC out there either, so goodness knows what AXC will be like..

Let's hope I'm wrong about how well (or bad) it goes...

 

[djw1981]

I guess as ever it depends on the management. FSR is quite well led and likes, FGW, FCC and FTPE seem less popular, as indeed was FNW.

 

[voyagerdude220]

FTPE seem less popular.

I love TPE! (But i'm afraid i'll always be loyal to VT )

 

[me123]

Does this poll not make sense, or is it just me?

I would have voted No, because I like VTs service and will miss them the few times I do catch their train. However, I do hope that Arriva do a good job with the franchise. I have high hopes that this will not be their greatest disaster.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Does this poll not make sense, or is it just me?

I would have voted No, because I like VTs service and will miss them the few times I do catch their train. However, I do hope that Arriva do a good job with the franchise. I have high hopes that this will not be their greatest disaster.

I was meant to select the multiple choice box, but forgot to!

I think I better go off the PC now, before I do any more damage/ make more mistakes.

 

[djw1981]

Can we have the grammar changed as well

Should Virgin have lost the XC franchise?
1. Yes.
2. Yes, but not to Arriva
3. No

 

[me123]

Can we have the grammar changed as well

Should Virgin have lost the XC franchise?
1. Yes.
2. Yes, but not to Arriva
3. No

I second that motion.

 

[Spaceflower]

 

[voyagerdude220]

Before I get a group of angry people on here, complaining about my minor grammar mistake, i'd like to point out that I can't edit my poll.

I did originally type the poll correctly, but accidently un-did the correct typing, and the title reverted to the incorrect version.

I second that motion.

 

[Spaceflower]

Virgin shouldnt have lost the franchise and arriva have rightly taken it over

 

[Mintona]

Yep, that's how it should read. Plus it isn't "should've". I would vote to keep Virgin too, though I am of course willing to give Arriva a chance.

With David though, there are an awful lot of threads on this topic now.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Virgin shouldnt have lost the franchise and arriva have rightly taken it over

*Siren* Error, you sentance does not make sense!!* (Not that i've ever done such a thing like that on Rail UK before )

 

[me123]

Before I get a group of angry people on here, complaining about my minor grammar mistake, i'd like to point out that I can't edit my poll.

I'm just folling about, it happens to everyone at some point. But minor mistake? It makes next to no sense!

(NB Admins, this may sound like I am descending into an argument, but this is not an intentional attempt to provoke someone).

 

[voyagerdude220]

With David though, there are an awful lot of threads on this topic now.

If i had the power to edit/clean up posts, I would personally combine them myself.

As it is though, i can't. :roll:

 

[Spaceflower]

lol, your stuck with it lad

 

[voyagerdude220]

I'm just folling about, it happens to everyone at some point. But minor mistake? It makes next to no sense!

(NB Admins, this may sound like I am descending into an argument, but this is not an intentional attempt to provoke someone).

I should point out at this stage, that I am very tired at the moment, and that my usual [high] standard of punctuation etc is not currently present.

This is due to a punctuation problem with the keyboard, at Ladybank. Arriva Cross Country would like to apologise for the cancellation, and any inconvenience this may have caused you.

 

[djw1981]

And what have the good people of Ladybank done with your keyboard.....

 

[voyagerdude220]

And what have the good people of Ladybank done with your keyboard.....

Sold it on ebay

 

[Guinness]

*Siren* Error, you sentance does not make sense!!* )

Neither does your sentence.

 

[Bonemaster]

Unfortunately it isn't about past performance that wins a rail franchise it is about the bid on the table, Virgin may have done a 100% fleet modernisation, but operation princess went 100% belly up upon which the original franchise was built on

The franchise was then cut short as Virgins best offer to take it out of effective DFT control didnt offer value for money, as such its demise was inevitable.

People maybe upset about the length of the Voyagers but Virgin was more than tranparent about the economics behind the fleet size and it all made sense unfortunatly Hatfield drove this into the ground, outside of Virgins control and by the time that passenger numbers had risen sufficiently, the Voyager production line had closed

 

[Techniquest]

Virgin should not have lost the franchise. Even if fate had conspired to ensure Virgin lost XC, why on God's green Earth was it given to Arriva? You only have to look at their shambles in the UK (particularly ATW before they decided to pump dozens of minutes slack into the timetables, even with which they manage to run late by still!) and have common sense not to give it to an appaling TOC.

As for 'dissing' Arriva XC now before they start running, don't forget that some of us still put up with Arriva all the time. Those of you lucky enough to have TPE as a local operator are, well, lucky.

 

[me123]

This is due to a punctuation problem with the keyboard, at Ladybank. Arriva Cross Country would like to apologise for the cancellation, and any inconvenience this may have caused you.

 

[Bonemaster]

Virgin should not have lost the franchise. Even if fate had conspired to ensure Virgin lost XC, why on God's green Earth was it given to Arriva? You only have to look at their shambles in the UK (particularly ATW before they decided to pump dozens of minutes slack into the timetables, even with which they manage to run late by still!) and have common sense not to give it to an appaling TOC.

As for 'dissing' Arriva XC now before they start running, don't forget that some of us still put up with Arriva all the time. Those of you lucky enough to have TPE as a local operator are, well, lucky.

What a load of rubbish, the name of the franchise winner is the 3rd most important ingredient in the running of a good company

1) You need the DfT to allow you the rolling stock to stand a chance, and good quality rolling stock at that

2) Good local management. NEX got Midland Mainline right yet made a mess of Central Trains, First TPE good First GW appalling, same companies very different outputs

 

[Jord]

who knows if Arriva will do good or bad, but at least give them a chance, but i'm glad Virgin lost the franchise and plus Arriva are going to bring back a few HSTs which is a good thing!

 

[rail-britain]

It wouldn't matter whether Virgin, Arriva, or any other company was awarded the "new" Cross Country franchise
There were going to be quite radical changes in order to integrate the remains of three other franchises and the back-bone of the Cross Country franchise
It was always going to be a difficult franchise to sell, given the great variety of rolling stock required (rural and intercity)
Virgin had done well to inherit three types of rolling stock and standardise the fleet on a single type with two variants
However, the next franchisee was always going to be commited to yet another three types of rolling stock, but without the ability to replace or renew them (and that seems to be a common element of the franchises over the current 5 year window)

Personally, Scottish services are decimated, but that is nothing to do with Arriva, and had Virgin Trains remained the franchisee the same would have happended
The services between Scotland and North West England transfer over to TransPennine Express, also removing shops, but also reducing them from 125mph to 100mph

The DfT WCML timetable for 2008 makes interesting reading though, as Motherwell itself loses a great number of intercity trains, with less than a dozen each day

 

[voyagerdude220]

I may have messed my poll up last night, but at least I've still got the views of members stated in this thread .

but i'm glad Virgin lost the franchise

Why are you so glad that Virgin have lost the franchise, when they didn't cause 100% of the problems which they had?

and plus Arriva are going to bring back a few HSTs which is a good thing!

But don't I remember reading on here that the HSTs are coming into play later than planned??

If the HSTs don't come in service for XC at the start of the new timetable, will Arriva have the ability to won some (if any at all) double-sets around, on the smaller network?

 

[djw1981]

To me, as a punter, Virgin were all about spin and marketing. Which attracted lots of passengers, and then couldn't deal with them as the realities of life on the railways hit virgin hard - you can't just increase capacity at the click of a switch. Whilst there is some spot hire, getting paths etc is very difficult, and thus it is less immediately responsive to customer demand than retail is.

Also, their marketing often failed to be met by the delivery side. Shiny new trains we saw in adverts, but on my most regular journey (edb-NCl) we saw; closed shops or empty shops, smelly/full toilets, vibrations, dirty carriages (until on-train cleaning really got going), overcrowding and smaller trains.

Not all of these were Virgins fault, but you don't care whose fault it is when sat on the floor outside a stinking toilet for 2 hours!