Unusual Working For FTPE

[John_158]

Last night 17th / 01 /2009 170 308 Worked 1F72 19.10 Leeds-Liverpool Lime Street is this the first time one of FTPEs 170s have worked this route as it is the first i have ever seen.

One thing i couldn't understand about it was the fact that the destination display was not displaying Liverpool just left blank surely these would have Liverpool on them.

Photo attached.

 

[clagmonster]

As of the Decmber timetable change, the 18:03 Hull-Manchester Picc is booked to run through to Lime St. This would hit Leeds at about 19:00. so a 19:10 departure would be fair. Hull-Manchester services do normally produce 170s. Indeed, the 18:03 off Hull did look like being a 170 a couple of weeks ago when I was catching a bus from the interchange.
Last night will have been slightly different as due to engineering works between Brough and Hull, all TPE serivces were being caped at Selby.
As for the destination screen, I assume that Liverpool isn't programed into the PIS, as the units were only originally intended for Hull-Manchester workings.

 

[Stonesourscotty]

They are Definitely booked for Liverpool Journeys on a Sunday and some other Journeys too?

 

[ukrob]

I am pretty sure the 0822 Lime St to Hull is booked for two 170s on a Sunday.

 

[P156KWJ]

170s are on the Manchester-Cleethorpes route now too. They are certainly used on the late night ones between Sheffield and Manchester - those ones at about 2-5 am

 

[Donny Dave]

170s are on the Manchester-Cleethorpes route now too. They are certainly used on the late night ones between Sheffield and Manchester - those ones at about 2-5 am

No 170s have reached Cleethorpes yet (that I know of anyway).

What your think of (I think) is a single self contained diagram that leaves Manchester about 1am, and returns from Sheffield at about half past 3.

 

[D841]

There was a lot of engineering work yesterday, with most TPE services not getting beyond Leeds, going east. This may have been the reason stock was reshuffled and a 170 substituted for a 185. I've certainly never seen a 170 on a Liverpool service on a Saturday or Sunday, but accept they may be booked on the route on Sundays. The 19.10 Leeds - Liverpool on a Saturday is certainly normally a 185.

 

[Bayum]

Yeah - Engineering Works at Micklefield are preventing services going North at Leeds, some services like hourly, were going via Castleford upto York. But there are Engineering works on the ECML past York, so most services were terminating at York anyways

 

[222001]

No 170s have reached Cleethorpes yet (that I know of anyway).

A 170 could have been to Cleethorpes as one Saturday last summer I saw 2x170 stop at Meadowhall on a Cleethorpes to Manchester Airport run. This could have started at Doncaster though.

 

[Techniquest]

Grr, it was nice to know previously that one could avoid the TPX 170s by not going to Hull or indeed the Hull to Manchester workings. Now they're started infecting Liverpool, it surely won't be long until they work the lightly-loaded Cleethorpes trains and possibly in the future the early morning trains to/from York/Newcastle.

I cannot stand those horrible, horrible things. Detested them when they were with SWT, still don't like them now!

 

[clagmonster]

I reckon the SO 18:03 Hull-Lime St (19:08 off Leeds), will form the SuO 08:22 Lime St-Hull, thus these will be the only 170 workings to Liverpool.
There was also talk of some SuO Manc-York workings going over to 170s at some stage, I don't know whether this has/will come to fruition.
So Julian, there aren't many 170 turns to avoid, and remember there are only 8 of them to fall onto 185 turns, so you would need to be unlucky. Personally, I think that for are modern DMU, they aren't all that bad, and the 185s are a whole lot worse.

 

[Max]

I am pretty sure the 0822 Lime St to Hull is booked for two 170s on a Sunday.

Damn, I was hoping this would be a 185, but sadly the reservation system appears to confirm that this is indeed a 170. To be honest, I really dislike the 170s. I find the seats much harder than on the 185s, and I dislike the general ambience. The fact that they are only 2 cars is pretty naff too!

Regarding 170s on unusual diagrams, I believe they are being used much more widely on night diagrams these days, including late night York and Sheffield services. Monday-Saturday the 0600 HUL-LIV and 2022 LIV-HUL services are still booked to be 185s (I believe), as are the 0905 HUL-MAN and the 2220 LDS-HUL services on Sundays, although in the latter case I presume the unit comes to Leeds ECS as I can find no service it would have obviously terminated off. My theory is that the 185 which operates the 1922 LIV-YRK service runs ECS to Leeds after terminating at 2138, although this is only a guess!

 

[43095john]

Saw this at Huddersfield (19:28) and was confused as the back display blind was blank.

 

[Techniquest]

I reckon the SO 18:03 Hull-Lime St (19:08 off Leeds), will form the SuO 08:22 Lime St-Hull, thus these will be the only 170 workings to Liverpool.
There was also talk of some SuO Manc-York workings going over to 170s at some stage, I don't know whether this has/will come to fruition.
So Julian, there aren't many 170 turns to avoid, and remember there are only 8 of them to fall onto 185 turns, so you would need to be unlucky. Personally, I think that for are modern DMU, they aren't all that bad, and the 185s are a whole lot worse.

8 more than I'd like to see on TPX quite frankly. And I much prefer the 185s. The 170s down my way I can tolerate, but the TPX ones...*shudder*

 

[222001]

8 more than I'd like to see on TPX quite frankly. And I much prefer the 185s. The 170s down my way I can tolerate, but the TPX ones...*shudder*

Whats the difference? I've never been on a TPX 170.

 

[Max]

Whats the difference? I've never been on a TPX 170.

The seats are awful...

 

[mbonwick]

Surely TPE would be better getting 8 additional 185s as well as the extra carriges and giving up the 170s?

 

[1D53]

So Julian, there aren't many 170 turns to avoid, and remember there are only 8 of them to fall onto 185 turns, so you would need to be unlucky. Personally, I think that for are modern DMU, they aren't all that bad, and the 185s are a whole lot worse.

9. 170301-309. 309 was previously 399.

 

[Techniquest]

No-one picked up the subtle Futurama reference there then

The seats are absolutely awful when they were with SWT, I doubt they've changed. How anyone can put up with travelling for more than 5 minutes on them I don't know.

 

[Bayum]

Surely TPE would be better getting 8 additional 185s as well as the extra carriges and giving up the 170s?

I thought the point for them getting the 170's in the first place was so they could run at maximum speed on the Hull Line??

Maybe a 3rd Car for the 170's would be better...

And replacing all the 170's that aren't going to be used on Hull ones or something

 

[Max]

I thought the point for them getting the 170's in the first place was so they could run at maximum speed on the Hull Line??

Maybe a 3rd Car for the 170's would be better...

And replacing all the 170's that aren't going to be used on Hull ones or something

This was the reason given. There are definitely a few places where 185s do run at reduced speeds, but it never seemed to make any difference to journey times due to better acceleration. Booked 185 runs aren't timed any differently to those booked to use 170s.

A little off topic, but does anybody know if the 2104 LDS-HUL SuO service is booked to go via an alternative route out of Leeds, perhaps via Castleford? It's booked to take 35 minutes between Leeds and Selby, much more than the usual 20 minutes or so!

 

[clagmonster]

Sorry, I forgot about 399/309.

According to PSUL, the 20:06 Man Picc-Hull goes Leeds-Castleford-Milford Jn-Gascoigne Wood-Selby, hence the extra running time. I wasn't personally aware of anything going that way to Selby, presumably this is for route knowledge retention.

 

[Max]

According to PSUL, the 20:06 Man Picc-Hull goes Leeds-Castleford-Milford Jn-Gascoigne Wood-Selby, hence the extra running time. I wasn't personally aware of anything going that way to Selby, presumably this is for route knowledge retention.

I assumed this was the case, thanks for the confirmation! I'd guess it is just for route knowledge, as you say. And, as far as I'm aware, this train wasn't routed this way before the Dec '08 timetable change, as AFAIK it used to call at South Milford.

 

[222001]

Surely TPE would be better getting 8 additional 185s as well as the extra carriges and giving up the 170s?

I have a feeling they could be getting rid of them when they get their new trains. 170s must be annoying to staff and passengers as they mainly run in 2x170 formation on that route with no through connection. The new (presumably) 4 car trains they get would solve that problem. Dare I say they would have a nice home with EMT!

 

[LilLoaf]

I seen a 170 on the service into Manchester Airport once not sure where it came from like.

I know that some 170 to reach or "infects" as someone rightly points out Liverpool on the sunday think these are diagramed for pairs.

As for the desination sign, maybe the conductor just coundn't be bothered to switch it one. Rather annoying if need to know where the train is going.

 

[John_158]

Must admit it was complete surprise to me when flymo 170508 turned up at Warrington Central but i was thinking to my self "Id laugh if it was a 170" then strangely enough it turned up.

I also have to admit to liking them and find no problems with the seats at all even though this is only the second time I have been on an FTPE 170.

But the thing I do dislike about them is the fact that they are only two carriages which is one of the good points of the 185s must admit the 170s in comparison to 185s are much quieter.

 

[Max]

I seen a 170 on the service into Manchester Airport once not sure where it came from like.

There was one booked morning service from Manchester Airport-Hull on the Sunday timetable last summer, so it could have been this.

 

[Techniquest]

Sorry, I forgot about 399/309.

According to PSUL, the 20:06 Man Picc-Hull goes Leeds-Castleford-Milford Jn-Gascoigne Wood-Selby, hence the extra running time. I wasn't personally aware of anything going that way to Selby, presumably this is for route knowledge retention.

What day(s) does this run? Milford Junction to Selby is required track, so even if it is a 170 I'm going to try and fit it in next time I'm up there.

John_158: When did 170508 appear at Warrington Central then? That's a London Midland machine these days so would be extremely rare to see it up there!

 

[Max]

What day(s) does this run? Milford Junction to Selby is required track, so even if it is a 170 I'm going to try and fit it in next time I'm up there.

Sundays until 16th May!

 

[John_158]

John_158: When did 170508 appear at Warrington Central then? That's a London Midland machine these days so would be extremely rare to see it up there![/QUOTE]

Sorry it was 170308 typo error it was on 1F72 19.10 from LEEDS to Liverpool 20.30 at Warrington Central and was Saturday Gone.