Troublesome Neighbours

[RichmondCommu]

G'day everyone,

Towards the end of last September, working away in Manchester and with my wife working nights and my youngest children back at Uni I decided to stop the night at my Mum's in deepest Derbyshire.

Having been picked up by Mum at the train station we headed off by car to the little hamlet where she and her partner live. The hamlet can only be accessed by narrow country lanes and a few minutes from Mum's there is a railway over bridge and an access point for track workers. As we approached the over bridge (where there is room for two cars to pass) we could see that the lane was blocked by vans. When I got out the car I could see that they were track workers and my exact words were "Hiya, do you mind moving up the lane so we can get by?". The exact response from one of the workers was "Can't you see that we're busy? You'll just have to wait". Not in the mood for an argument I said "Well do you know how long you'll be?" but all I got in return was "As long as it takes". Three to four minutes later and we were on our way.

Now I have no desire to get any one into trouble which is why I've been vague on detail but this all makes a mockery of the sign next to the access point which reminds track workers to respect the local neighbors! All I will say is that I assumed the workers were contractors and not Network Rail as the vans had all been hired and none of their hi-vis vests carried the words 'Network Rail'

Your thoughts on this would be much appreciated!

Kind regards and Happy New Year to you all!

Richmond Commuter!

 

[RoundNewcastle]

G'day everyone,

Towards the end of last September, working away in Manchester and with my wife working nights and my youngest children back at Uni I decided to stop the night at my Mum's in deepest Derbyshire.

Having been picked up by Mum at the train station we headed off by car to the little hamlet where she and her partner live. The hamlet can only be accessed by narrow country lanes and a few minutes from Mum's there is a railway over bridge and an access point for track workers. As we approached the over bridge (where there is room for two cars to pass) we could see that the lane was blocked by vans. When I got out the car I could see that they were track workers and my exact words were "Hiya, do you mind moving up the lane so we can get by?". The exact response from one of the workers was "Can't you see that we're busy? You'll just have to wait". Not in the mood for an argument I said "Well do you know how long you'll be?" but all I got in return was "As long as it takes". Three to four minutes later and we were on our way.

Now I have no desire to get any one into trouble which is why I've been vague on detail but this all makes a mockery of the sign next to the access point which reminds track workers to respect the local neighbors! All I will say is that I assumed the workers were contractors and not Network Rail as the vans had all been hired and none of their hi-vis vests carried the words 'Network Rail'

Your thoughts on this would be much appreciated!

Kind regards and Happy New Year to you all!

Richmond Commuter!

You've got into a few troubles recently including this and the obese Voyager travveler

 

[RichmondCommu]

Yes, as my wife has just noted I've been waiting a while to get things off my chest

 

[Antman]

G'day everyone,

Towards the end of last September, working away in Manchester and with my wife working nights and my youngest children back at Uni I decided to stop the night at my Mum's in deepest Derbyshire.

Having been picked up by Mum at the train station we headed off by car to the little hamlet where she and her partner live. The hamlet can only be accessed by narrow country lanes and a few minutes from Mum's there is a railway over bridge and an access point for track workers. As we approached the over bridge (where there is room for two cars to pass) we could see that the lane was blocked by vans. When I got out the car I could see that they were track workers and my exact words were "Hiya, do you mind moving up the lane so we can get by?". The exact response from one of the workers was "Can't you see that we're busy? You'll just have to wait". Not in the mood for an argument I said "Well do you know how long you'll be?" but all I got in return was "As long as it takes". Three to four minutes later and we were on our way.

Now I have no desire to get any one into trouble which is why I've been vague on detail but this all makes a mockery of the sign next to the access point which reminds track workers to respect the local neighbors! All I will say is that I assumed the workers were contractors and not Network Rail as the vans had all been hired and none of their hi-vis vests carried the words 'Network Rail'

Your thoughts on this would be much appreciated!

Kind regards and Happy New Year to you all!

Richmond Commuter!

Well I'd have had every desire to get somebody into trouble over that sort of attitude, I suspect if you had got your phone out and started recording the conversation their attitude might well have suddenly changed.

And are you sure they weren't a bunch of villains stealing cable or whatever?

In my dealings with NR staff I've always found them to be polite and courteous.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Well I'd have had every desire to get somebody into trouble over that sort of attitude, I suspect if you had got your phone out and started recording the conversation their attitude might well have suddenly changed.

And are you sure they weren't a bunch of villains stealing cable or whatever?

In my dealings with NR staff I've always found them to be polite and courteous.

This is why I was so surprised at what they'd said. In terms of perhaps coming across an act of theft you raise a good point but I think there were too many of them for that to be the case. There were at least half a dozen vans and at 21.00 (you weren't to know that of course) such an act would have surely been too brazen.

 

[Zamracene749]

No excuse for these blokes to be abrupt, even if they couldn't move the vans straight away. Seems big annoying rude things have been getting in your way a lot lately

Night time is prime time for cable thieves. We once caught one where I work at 22.00, busy with a hacksaw, that even had brought along a flask of tea and a tupperware box of sarnies to keep himself sustained over the evening!

 

[edwin_m]

This is why I was so surprised at what they'd said. In terms of perhaps coming across an act of theft you raise a good point but I think there were too many of them for that to be the case. There were at least half a dozen vans and at 21.00 (you weren't to know that of course) such an act would have surely been too brazen.

Not necessarily. Remember that case of a gang turning up with all the appropriate hi-vi etc and stealing a load of track off the (out of use) Leamside line?

 

[trainophile]

And the brazen Hatton Garden jewellery thieves, who masqueraded as gas fitters and construction workers.

 

[andyb2706]

Hi there,

By the sound of it these were definitely not Network Rail staff as they all wear PPE with Network Rail written on them. The company that they work for has to be on the PPE and from your description they were contractors who would have been working for Network Rail.

I would still have memorised their registration number and reported it to Network Rail, as someone who works on the railway I would never dream of speaking to a member of public like that, it is totally unacceptable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Your thoughts on this would be much appreciated!

Certainly seems rude. The correct thing for them to do if they couldn't avoid blocking the lane is to apologise. But if there was any way they could have avoided blocking it they should have chosen that option.

They could *technically* be prosecuted for obstructing the public highway, I guess, though that's unlikely to actually occur.

 

[Philip Phlopp]

This is why I was so surprised at what they'd said. In terms of perhaps coming across an act of theft you raise a good point but I think there were too many of them for that to be the case. There were at least half a dozen vans and at 21.00 (you weren't to know that of course) such an act would have surely been too brazen.

It's always worth a tweet to NR HQ or a call to their helpline, just to double check it's something legitimate.

S&T had a cable theft a few years back, the culprits, if I remember correctly, had acquired an ex NR HGV (probably one of the Mercedes Ategos) from auction and put the NR vinyls back on the side, drove onto the railway and pulled out signalling cable without anybody batting an eyelid.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Hi there,

By the sound of it these were definitely not Network Rail staff as they all wear PPE with Network Rail written on them. The company that they work for has to be on the PPE and from your description they were contractors who would have been working for Network Rail.

Please accept my apologies for the potentially stupid question but what is a PPE?

 

[pjnathanail]

Please accept my apologies for the potentially stupid question but what is a PPE?

PPE stands for personal protective equipment, and would include safety boots, hi viz clothing and other job specific stuff (gloves/masks etc)

 

[wensley]

No I don't but by the same token do you catch a train or do you catch a railway? Assuming that like everyone else you catch the train then surely its a train station?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Please accept my apologies for the potentially stupid question but what is a PPE?

PPE = Personal Protective Equipment.

On the other point this is an interesting read:
http://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2011/oct/18/railway-station-or-train-station

To me it's a railway station and always will be. Train Station is one Americanism too far for me!

 

[RichmondCommu]

It's always worth a tweet to NR HQ or a call to their helpline, just to double check it's something legitimate.

S&T had a cable theft a few years back, the culprits, if I remember correctly, had acquired an ex NR HGV (probably one of the Mercedes Ategos) from auction and put the NR vinyls back on the side, drove onto the railway and pulled out signalling cable without anybody batting an eyelid.

You're not the only forum member to have suggested this and perhaps naively I'd assumed that on a busy main line at 21.00 and a weekday thieves wouldn't have been brazen enough to try anything.

 

[Darren R]

If I may make an attempt to drag the thread back towards its original topic...

Following my own less-than-favourable impression of NR contractors working on the line immediately adjacent to my house, I almost opened a similar thread earlier in the year.

The line was closed for six weeks in the summer for enhancement works, with several contractors involved. Whilst most of the Orange Army I spoke to were friendly and courteous, I was surprised to see a lot of what might be loosely described as low level anti-social behaviour.

Vehicles were parked up on the street in the early hours with windows open and radios blaring. (A neighbour went out to bollock a driver for it on one occasion - it seemed to stop after that!) Floodlights were left on all night even though there was no work being done, and mobile generators likewise. (Gees they're noisy under your bedroom window!) One day I watched from an upstairs window as a track worker re-wrapped his half-eaten sandwiches in clingfilm and then flung them over the wall into a neighbour's garden. The worksite was left strewn with the rubbish they left behind; I was hoping to be looking out onto pristine new railway following completion, but instead it actually looked worse than before they started.

A new retaining wall was constructed as part of the work; the rubbish left on top of it by one worker can still be seen from passing trains - alongside the tools he also left behind. (It'll be interesting to see how long the drill sits there before it's rescued by someone!) Following signalling work, the covers of the concrete conduit for the cables were removed and not replaced. Several months later the channelling is still uncovered - an open invitation to rats and small animals (including a neighbour's cat who was stupid enough to almost find himself stuck: I can't imagine any S&T worker would want to find a decomposing cat!)

After the line had reopened, I discovered that a little-used footpath through a field beside the worksite was littered with the pads that are placed between the sleeper and rail chair. Whilst replacing the old pads prior to the new rails being laid, the worker(s) involved had obviously just flung the old ones over the railway boundary wall, too bone-idle to dispose of them properly.

It's all fairly minor stuff, I know, but completely unneccesary. It creates a bad impression, and if railway staff themselves are leaving such a mess behind, Network Rail can't really take the moral high ground when it comes to dumping.

 

[johnnychips]

It's all fairly minor stuff, I know, but completely unnecessary. It creates a bad impression, and if railway staff themselves are leaving such a mess behind, Network Rail can't really take the moral high ground when it comes to dumping.

This is probably due to Network Rail not supervising its subcontractors properly. I would complain to as many people as possible!

 

[ge-gn]

We (network Rail staff) work bloody hard not to disturb folk. Call 03457114141 to moan about anyone working on the railway. I'm pretty confident it won't be Network Rail staff at fault.

 

[Chrisgr31]

If reported correctly correctly the choice of words used by the workers could have been better. However I wouldn't call a delay of 3 or 4 minutes excessive. I am frequently held up longer by the dustcart making collections in a local village, less frequently by lorries manoeuvring into properties etc.

Perhaps the response of the trackworkers should have been "Sorry, it will take us a couple of minutes to find all the relevant drivers" or "Sorry, can you wait a couple of minutes, we have nearly finished and will out the way very shortly".

What we don't know, is how long they had been there, what they had been doing, what the weather was, whether they were just finishing their shift etc. so were they wet tired hungry and been doing a job that had been difficult, which might explain an element of irritability.

As regards rubbish and mess left by trackworkers I do agree that leaving rubbish behind does seem to be a trend, whether it's empty builders bag, rails, sleepers, general garbage there does seem to be a lot of railway rubbish left by the railway after works which only encourages more rubbish to be dumped.

 

[carriageline]

Report it. Network Rail takes its role as 'neighbours' very seriously, and I believe there are specific managers internally that deals with this specific thing. From previous things I have seen, once they get a couple of complains, them areas become 'hotspots' and details are put in briefing packs etc to say extra attention should be paid to good behaviour.

As others have said, I would be surprised if it's NR staff, a small percentage of the contractors unfortunately leave alot to be desired.

 

[oversteer]

I wonder if they would have expected an ambulance or fire engine to wait a couple of minutes.. Blocking the road is totally unacceptable

 

[edwin_m]

I wonder if they would have expected an ambulance or fire engine to wait a couple of minutes.. Blocking the road is totally unacceptable

Probably so - but maybe they would have moved more quickly for an emergency vehicle, either from public-spiritness or because they would know to expect consequences otherwise. If they'd though the OP might have reported them to Network Rail then this might have had a similar effect.

 

[Antman]

I wonder if they would have expected an ambulance or fire engine to wait a couple of minutes.. Blocking the road is totally unacceptable

Maybe blocking the road was unavoidable but a polite explanation surely wouldn't have been too much to expect?

 

[dviner]

Maybe blocking the road was unavoidable but a polite explanation surely wouldn't have been too much to expect?

If there had been a polite explanation then we probably wouldn't have this thread.

 

[RichmondCommu]

If reported correctly correctly the choice of words used by the workers could have been better. However I wouldn't call a delay of 3 or 4 minutes excessive. I am frequently held up longer by the dustcart making collections in a local village, less frequently by lorries manoeuvring into properties etc.

Perhaps the response of the trackworkers should have been "Sorry, it will take us a couple of minutes to find all the relevant drivers" or "Sorry, can you wait a couple of minutes, we have nearly finished and will out the way very shortly".

What we don't know, is how long they had been there, what they had been doing, what the weather was, whether they were just finishing their shift etc. so were they wet tired hungry and been doing a job that had been difficult, which might explain an element of irritability.

Many thanks for your post. With regard to getting stuck behind the wheelie bin lorry at least you can see that they are moving along and that progress is being made. When I walked back to my Mum's I had no indication as to how long we might have had to wait.

I'll never know how long they'd been blocking the lane before we arrived but Mum's house practically backs on to the railway and trains were tooting their horn until I fell asleep at around midnight. From this I'm guessing that the contractors had not started work when they held us up. Please note that on that stretch of line there is no need for drivers to be tooting their horns unless work is being carried out.

To answer your other question it was a very warm late September evening with no rain and what I would have thought would have been ideal conditions for people working on the track.