Trivia: Trains with unusual stopping patterns

[bicbasher]

That's a pre-Overground relic: Forest Hill and Sydenham were added to what used to be "fast" trains (the "Tats and Cats" I think*) many years ago, and then Brockley and Honor Oak Park to give them a 15 minute service.
There was indeed a period when Penge W and Anerley were closed on Sundays as an economy measure, so the differential pattern made some sense.

(*Sorry, Tattenham Corner and Caterham services, which used to split at Purley)

I remember the semi-fasts on the Sydenham slow which I think started to call at Brockley and HOP in the mid 90s? (They were I think the off-peak Charing Cross services until the timetable revision)

More recently, up until May 2010 the Caterham's did the fast between Sydenham and Norwood Junction.

Hard to believe that as short as 4 or 5 years ago, there were fast peaks between London Bridge and Forest Hill.

 

[paulravuslante]

I found an odd one for this thursday... a Heathrow Connect from Terminal 5 calling at T123, Hayes and Harlington, Southall, Ealing Broadway, Acton Main Line and Paddington.

Can anyone shed any light on this, or any other odd Heathrow workings either in the WTT or variations coming up?

There are a few reasons for this. A minimum service frequency must be maintained between the airport terminals, however the down airport tunnel is closed for engineering works Mondays to Thursdays after 2200. Therefore this Connect, which would normally run empty to T5, runs in service.

Then once out of the airport, Crossrail engineering works on the above days mean the train cannot call at Hanwell or West Ealing.

As for Acton, I'm not sure why the train has to call there but suspect that as a result of the reduced services due to Crossrail works, the former FGW service no longer operates. I actually had a customer alight from the train on driving this one evening and very grateful she was too as she didn't think there were any other trains that evening!

 

[D6975]

I'd be interested to know if there has ever been a service that called at Tiverton Parkway but not Taunton. I know there were services at one time that called at Totnes but not Newton Abbot and there was even once a Virgin Cross Country services which ran fast from Newton Abbot to Taunton without stopping at Exeter.

Yes, back in the 80s there were several cross country services that went Bristol - Tiverton - Exeter. The Newcastle - Plymouth that left Bristol at 16 : xx was one of them.
Curiously, around the same time, the WR HST services via Bristol to the West sometimes called at Weston and Taunton but missed out Tiverton.

 

[Antman]

One I stumbled across today, the 07.08 from Gillingham (Kent) serves all stations to St Mary Cray except Longfield then Bromley South and Victoria whilst the 07.15 (which originates from Ramsgate) serves Longfield Bromley South and Victoria only

 

[cle]

There are the odd trains which run fast from Denmark Hill to Blackfriars (no Elephant) - and in the counter-peak, some of the Sevenoaks trains run fast from Peckham Rye to Bromley South, some with a Catford stop.

 

[plastictaffy]

New Street to Coventry stopper. All shacks but skips Marston Green

That would be because it's served by trains from Northampton. I've never gone into, or come out of New Street without stopping there, either as guard or as passenger. A lot of the trains up there do odd stopping patterns. Take today, 1514 off NS. Called Stechford, Marston Green, Intl, then all stations. So what about Lea Hall and Adderley Park??

 

[OwlMan]

That would be because it's served by trains from Northampton. I've never gone into, or come out of New Street without stopping there, either as guard or as passenger. A lot of the trains up there do odd stopping patterns. Take today, 1514 off NS. Called Stechford, Marston Green, Intl, then all stations. So what about Lea Hall and Adderley Park??

Thats because there is not enough time between the Virgin & XC services to path a train calling at all stations -there is a complex pattern of station calls so every station gets a regular service to Cov & Brum.

 

[Antman]

There are the odd trains which run fast from Denmark Hill to Blackfriars (no Elephant) - and in the counter-peak, some of the Sevenoaks trains run fast from Peckham Rye to Bromley South, some with a Catford stop.

A few years back there was an evening peak Ashford via Maidstone East train that ran fast from Victoria to Otford.

 

[craigwilson]

One I stumbled across today, the 07.08 from Gillingham (Kent) serves all stations to St Mary Cray except Longfield then Bromley South and Victoria whilst the 07.15 (which originates from Ramsgate) serves Longfield Bromley South and Victoria only

And Chatham.

There are also three additional services before that one which originate at Ramsgate. The one before goes Gillingham-Chatham-Bromley South-Victoria, whereas the two prior services (the first two of the day) additionally include Rochester.

Another strange one is the very first Ramsgate-Victoria of a Saturday, which goes Gillingham-Chatham-Rochester-Sole Street-Meopham-Longfield-Farningham Rd-Swanley-St Mary Cray-Bromley South-Victoria, additionally going via the Catford Loop between Bromley and Victoria. Pretty much all other Ramsgate-Victoria trains go via Herne Hill.

 

[ValleyLines142]

One I did notice today was 1M53 1252 Plymouth to Manchester, which doesn't call at Taunton, Wolverhampton, Stafford, Macclesfield and Stockport. Very unusual for a CrossCountry service not to call at these stations, Taunton and Wolverhampton especially.

Another one I noticed was 1B51 0539 Cardiff Central to Milford Haven making calls at Pontyclun, Llanharan and Bridgend, when 2L41 0551 Cardiff Central to Maesteg makes stops also, so there's two trains to Pontyclun, Llanharan and Bridgend within ten minutes of each other!

 

[southern442]

There are also three additional services before that one which originate at Ramsgate. The one before goes Gillingham-Chatham-Bromley South-Victoria, whereas the two prior services (the first two of the day) additionally include Rochester.

Another strange one is the very first Ramsgate-Victoria of a Saturday, which goes Gillingham-Chatham-Rochester-Sole Street-Meopham-Longfield-Farningham Rd-Swanley-St Mary Cray-Bromley South-Victoria, additionally going via the Catford Loop between Bromley and Victoria. Pretty much all other Ramsgate-Victoria trains go via Herne Hill.

Someone mentioned about peak southeastern services skipping Orpington, I have also seen in the national rail timetables non stop runs from Waterloo East to Sevenoaks. Also do you know if there are any trains that skip Bromley South?

I was once on a late night Sunday train to Haywards Heath stopping at Clapham jn, Streatham common, Norbury then all stations to East Croydon then Purley, gatwick airport, Three bridges and Haywards Heath.

 

[craigwilson]

Someone mentioned about peak southeastern services skipping Orpington, I have also seen in the national rail timetables non stop runs from Waterloo East to Sevenoaks. Also do you know if there are any trains that skip Bromley South?

The 1S88 0010 London Victoria to Ramsgate (the last service all the way to Ramsgate of the night) does not call at Bromley South, running fast to Rochester. As far as I am aware its the only train (to these parts of Kent at least) that skips Bromley.

 

[mm333]

There's one train a day that passes through Brough non-stop - the 0736 TPX Manchester Piccadilly-Hull. I've no idea why it doesn't stop.

 

[bicbasher]

Someone mentioned about peak southeastern services skipping Orpington, I have also seen in the national rail timetables non stop runs from Waterloo East to Sevenoaks.

There are two fasts to High Brooms as well in the evening peak at 1722 and 1802.

 

[SprinterMan]

One I did notice today was 1M53 1252 Plymouth to Manchester, which doesn't call at Taunton, Wolverhampton, Stafford, Macclesfield and Stockport. Very unusual for a CrossCountry service not to call at these stations, Taunton and Wolverhampton especially.

Another one I noticed was 1B51 0539 Cardiff Central to Milford Haven making calls at Pontyclun, Llanharan and Bridgend, when 2L41 0551 Cardiff Central to Maesteg makes stops also, so there's two trains to Pontyclun, Llanharan and Bridgend within ten minutes of each other!

2L41 isn't shown as calling at Pontyclun, Llanharan or Pencoed there....

 

[Muzer]

Not in the same league as some of these, but the last Southampton-bound train of the day from London has something strange going on that I'd be happy if someone could explain.

Firstly, it seems to "count", but not quite (!), as belonging to the next day, as Saturday mornings (ie Friday nights) have different timings, but it doesn't exist on Monday mornings (ie Sunday nights).

Firstly it leaves Waterloo at 0105, calling at Vauxhall, Clapham Junction, Wimbledon, Surbiton and Woking (I don't have the timetable for the local London stops, this is from RTT). Fair enough. Then it calls at Farnborough and Fleet, "to let passengers leave the train only". You'd think from all these stops so far that it's a stopping train, which would make perfect sense for the last train of the day, but no - it then runs fast onto Basingstoke, Winchester and Eastleigh, missing out the stops of Micheldever and Shawford, again with the condition of "to let passengers leave the train only". Then it does even more weird things, calling at Southampton Airport (Parkway), NOT Swaythling, but it DOES call at St. Denys, again all with the same condition of alight only. Finally it terminates at Southampton Central.

What on earth? Why's the calling pattern like it is? Why is nobody allowed to get on after Woking?

 

[Antman]

Not in the same league as some of these, but the last Southampton-bound train of the day from London has something strange going on that I'd be happy if someone could explain.

Firstly, it seems to "count", but not quite (!), as belonging to the next day, as Saturday mornings (ie Friday nights) have different timings, but it doesn't exist on Monday mornings (ie Sunday nights).

Firstly it leaves Waterloo at 0105, calling at Vauxhall, Clapham Junction, Wimbledon, Surbiton and Woking (I don't have the timetable for the local London stops, this is from RTT). Fair enough. Then it calls at Farnborough and Fleet, "to let passengers leave the train only". You'd think from all these stops so far that it's a stopping train, which would make perfect sense for the last train of the day, but no - it then runs fast onto Basingstoke, Winchester and Eastleigh, missing out the stops of Micheldever and Shawford, again with the condition of "to let passengers leave the train only". Then it does even more weird things, calling at Southampton Airport (Parkway), NOT Swaythling, but it DOES call at St. Denys, again all with the same condition of alight only. Finally it terminates at Southampton Central.

What on earth? Why's the calling pattern like it is? Why is nobody allowed to get on after Woking?

I don't know for sure but I can only think this 'set down only' rule is to make it easier to run a rail replacement bus in the event of engineering work.

 

[cle]

And so they can run early and ignore the timetable!

 

[northwichcat]

09:01 Sunday Chester-Southport omits Lostock Gralam and Ashley - the only Northern Mid-Cheshire train in the week to not stop at those stations.

This is instead of an 08:59 departure with calls at Lostock Gralam and Ashley and has apparently been done because there is more demand from the Wirral stations for Delamere Forest (the first train from Liverpool arrives at Chester at 08:56 on Sunday) then there is at Lostock Gralam and Ashley.

 

[Antman]

And so they can run early and ignore the timetable!

Yes and if nobody wants to get off at a particular station the rail replacement bus doesn't have to go there at all

 

[tractakid]

How about http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W71151/2013/06/30/advanced?

Is this the only SN WLL train that runs fast from CLJ to ECR? and does it stop at SRS?

 

[Deerfold]

I don't know for sure but I can only think this 'set down only' rule is to make it easier to run a rail replacement bus in the event of engineering work.

Indeed - in the same way the 2330 London - Leeds is set down only all the way. With all tickets usually checked well before the first stop at Peterborough.

A little more on topic, it's the only Northbound train not to call at Wakefield Westgate - so when there is engineering work or the drivers are route training there's no need to put on a bus from Doncaster or Leeds. Annoys various people in Wakefield as it runs too late to connect usefully into any other services (except the 0505 back from Leeds if you don't mind 2 or 3 hours in Leeds in the middle of the night and results in a last train of 2135 to Wakefield). It's perhaps surprising that it also doesn't stop at Retford as the time penalty would be minimal (less surprising is the remaining East Coast stop of Stevenage which is well served by late FCC services).

And

 

[MichaelAMW]

The 0509 Plymouth to Paddington is a little unusual west of Exeter: Plymouth - Newton Abbot - Teignmouth - Exeter St Davids. I doubt many people are going to use this train from anywhere west of Taunton though from Exeter it calls at Tiverton Parkway, Taunton, Bridgwater, Highbridge & Burnham, Weston-super-Mare, Worle, Yatton, Naislea & Backwell, Bristol Temple Meads, Bath Spa, Chippenham, Swindon, Reading and London Paddington.

The 0530 Plymouth to Paddington is also unusual in that it calls at Dawlish but not Teignmouth although the reason for this is quite clear as Teignmouth is served by the 0509.

I'd be interested to know if there has ever been a service that called at Tiverton Parkway but not Taunton. I know there were services at one time that called at Totnes but not Newton Abbot and there was even once a Virgin Cross Country services which ran fast from Newton Abbot to Taunton without stopping at Exeter.

In my undergraduate days in Exeter there were various strange workings, particularly in terms of non-stop runs (as far as the public were concerned, of course). E.g. from summer '85:

2200 FO Newcastle - Newquay non-stop Chesterfield - Bristol & Bristol - Plymouth
2220 FO Newcastle - Paignton non-stop Wakefield - Bristol
0630 Bradford - Paignton non-stop Burton - Bristol
0759 Nottingham - Paignton & 0820 Liverpool - Paignton Non-stop B'ham - Taunton
0700 Newcastle - Paignton non-stop Derby - Bristol
0917 Leeds - Penzance non-stop Derby - Taunton & then to Plymouth
1110 Paignton - Manchester non-stop N Abbot - B'ham/Wolves date depending
0853 Penzance - Newcastle non-stop Plymouth - Bristol then to Sheffield

The WCML had its moments too, e.g.

1925 Euston - Liverpool calling Lichfield, Hartford, Runcorn

 

[Rhydgaled]

Fishguard boat train calls at bridgend, Llanelli, whitland and Fishguard

It calls at Bridgend now does it? Not long ago it was Llanelli, Whitland, Fishguard only (on the way back it stops at Carmarthen, plus those served on the outbound journey). Not much else runs through Pembrey & Burry Port, Port Talbot Parkway and Bridgend without stopping. Also, despite it being the only express service into and out of S.W.Wales, it is booked for an inner-suburban unit (class 150).

 

[SprinterMan]

It calls at Bridgend now does it? Not long ago it was Llanelli, Whitland, Fishguard only (on the way back it stops at Carmarthen, plus those served on the outbound journey). Not much else runs through Pembrey & Burry Port, Port Talbot Parkway and Bridgend without stopping. Also, despite it being the only express service into and out of S.W.Wales, it is booked for an inner-suburban unit (class 150).

It doesn't call at Bridgend.

Adam

 

[class303]

One that's always puzzled me is the 16.33 Glasgow central to Wemyss Bay service that doesn't stop it IBM. it's the only train in either direction that misses out IBM. I fail to see the logic of it. perhaps those more informed on here or scotrail will be able to enlighten me.

 

[VTPreston_Tez]

I once had a Virgin XC service from Preston to Bournemouth, "calling at Manchester Piccadilly, Macclesfield..."
I think it was then non stop Brockenhurst. I can't remember the full thing

 

[swt_passenger]

Not in the same league as some of these, but the last Southampton-bound train of the day from London has something strange going on that I'd be happy if someone could explain.

Firstly, it seems to "count", but not quite (!), as belonging to the next day, as Saturday mornings (ie Friday nights) have different timings, but it doesn't exist on Monday mornings (ie Sunday nights).

Firstly it leaves Waterloo at 0105, calling at Vauxhall, Clapham Junction, Wimbledon, Surbiton and Woking (I don't have the timetable for the local London stops, this is from RTT). Fair enough. Then it calls at Farnborough and Fleet, "to let passengers leave the train only". You'd think from all these stops so far that it's a stopping train, which would make perfect sense for the last train of the day, but no - it then runs fast onto Basingstoke, Winchester and Eastleigh, missing out the stops of Micheldever and Shawford, again with the condition of "to let passengers leave the train only". Then it does even more weird things, calling at Southampton Airport (Parkway), NOT Swaythling, but it DOES call at St. Denys, again all with the same condition of alight only. Finally it terminates at Southampton Central.

What on earth? Why's the calling pattern like it is? Why is nobody allowed to get on after Woking?

Look at this from the opposite perspective though, as an altered main line service...

It's simply a service in the regular Waterloo - Weymouth xx05 pattern, truncated at Southampton, with a few extra stops added. Some of those stops, such as Farnborough, Fleet and Eastleigh, allow them to not run an 0109 semi-fast that would otherwise be needed.

Then some extra inner suburban stops allow for 'last departures' heading away from London that would otherwise need an earlier connecting train to run to Woking.

The St Denys call means they don't have to keep running the local DMU until 0230.

Doesn't seem that odd really.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

The daytime stopping pattern on the Robin Hood Line is annoying.

Northbound Worksop trains omit Bulwell.
Southbound Worksop trains omit Newstead.
Requires a thirty minute wait in Mansfield in one direction from either.

This was caused by the singling of the line through Bulwell with the introduction of the tram. Stopping both Worksop trains at Bulwell (within minutes of each other) caused delays so hence the current pattern.

The rail line should have been doubled between Hucknall & Newstead (or at Newstead) when the singling in the Bulwell section occurred.

It was even worse during the Leaf Fall Timetable when Bulwell & Newstead disappeared virtually altogether.

 

[ushawk]

I once had a Virgin XC service from Preston to Bournemouth, "calling at Manchester Piccadilly, Macclesfield..."
I think it was then non stop Brockenhurst. I can't remember the full thing

I really, really doubt it ran non-stop from Macclesfield to Brockenhurst - avoiding places such as Wolverhampton, Birmingham, Reading and Southampton.