TfW class 398 Stadler Citylink tram trains

[positron]

Iirc the new toilets were meant to be quite modular/prefab so they could be installed quite quickly, which hopefully means as the 398s roll out if it becomes clear there's any areas in need of toilet facilities they can add them in.

 

[danludd]

Another classic PR stunt there again. They need to stop promising dates, it's not going to happen. Late summer, but more like 2027-28.

Reality is, 34 units have been delivered. Only a handful of them are in a functional state as previously mentioned. Those that are running are consistently full of faults, a team are onboard to wipe all software. Faults are being hidden off logs, including those of previous brake issues. Evidence has been shown to the unions which they are hiding away. Staff are reporting them, and then dragged up to see management if they refuse to take a unit out. They are not fit for purpose, and it's not going to end well I'm sorry to say.

So far there only 3-4 crew passed out to work them too.

I know you don't believe me, but I wouldn’t even take my family on one of these things.

If everything you've said is factual and you can prove it, why haven't you gone to the press with all of it? You say you want the public to know, but you only post on a rail forum.

Seems like you're getting real time information and very detailed information, so I assume you have pretty good sources. What have you got to lose?

 

[ceiberjeiber]

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== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Jun 2026 ==

If everything you've said is factual and you can prove it, why haven't you gone to the press with all of it? You say you want the public to know, but you only post on a rail forum.

Seems like you're getting real time information and very detailed information, so I assume you have pretty good sources. What have you got to lose?

Maybe he doesn’t want to have the hassle of going to the press?

 

[XFeed]

Just watched a news report on ITV Wales questioning why the units are not yet in service despite previous promises they would be by now and the TfW spokesperson that they interviewed mentioned the they are working with Stadler to resolve complex issues.
There were also questions and surprise from passengers that there were no toilets on board, they did however show the new toilets provided at stations for passengers of the services to jump off and use then catch next service as they will be regular !

I wasn`t if he was referring to the customers habits or very frequent services

 

[Peter Sarf]

Sounds just a little bit defensive about the toilet issue though!

Well they have got to "manage expectations". PR does make me cringe but if there was no information coming out I would be more concerned.

I do wish the 398s had loos but there is a price for that (space onboard and cost of support).
(that enough about seat like comments).

 

[chargesmith]

I find it strange that if the units are as bad as you say they are, and faults (brakes etc) are also as bad as you say. Why are the unions not shouting from the roof tops like they normally do when such serious issues with rolling stock.

Also why are the unions allowing there members to drive the units if they are so bad?

And why is the regulator letting them test on live railways with that supposed level of faults? Would be far too big a risk to the public and the workforce.

Honestly, I had my doubts from the start about many of the claims made from that account, but the claims have now got so ridiculous that they have to be untrue. Probably best to hover over and click Ignore (I have already)

 

[Cardiff123]

The toilet issue has been done to death on here, but for someone with a bladder or bowel condition, holding on 20 minutes for the next toilet can actually be a very long time, especially if you have a condition that means you can need the toilet urgently, without much warning, and can't hold on.
Ideally, it should be no more than 10 minutes to the next toilet, but obviously there's no funding for that.

On this page under the FAQs, it says there will be toilet stops for the last trains of the night from December

Toilets | Transport for Wales

Transport for Wales | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

tfw.wales

What time do the toilets close and what happens on the last train home?
Our new toilets will stay open until the last train has departed the station. Customers are advised to use toilet facilities before boarding the train.

Until late 2026, we’ll continue to use our Class 756 trains on our last services of the day. These trains have toilets on board.

After this, we’ll replace our Class 756s with our tram-trains, adding dedicated toilet stops to our timetable on late-night services. This will allow customers to get off and use the toilet, before getting back on and continuing their journey.

 

[Peter Sarf]

The toilet issue has been done to death on here, but for someone with a bladder or bowel condition, holding on 20 minutes for the next toilet can actually be a very long time, especially if you have a condition that means you can need the toilet urgently, without much warning, and can't hold on.
Ideally, there should be a toilet at every other station, but obviously there's no funding for that.

On this page under the FAQs, it says there will be toilet stops for the last trains of the night from December

Toilets | Transport for Wales

Transport for Wales | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

tfw.wales

I can see there being huge delays on the last (few) services of a Friday or Saturday night.
But then how many loos would be needed on a 398 (or any unit) instead !.
On balance a helpful feature in the timetable though.

 

[Cambrian359]

Does anyone have information that can contradict or correct what VR494 is saying?
While admittedly their comments do seem excessively negative I’ve also yet to see anyone post anything to really contradict or truly explain the continuing multi year delays?
I realise no one is obliged to but when one person is continually shut down you would think someone would step up with factually correct information!( as happens in all other topics)

Unions want to keep current staff levels and at current pay levels so possibly on this occasion they aren’t jumping up and down about issues just yet…..as has been pointed out on this thread tram systems in other parts of uk don’t have conductors and drivers are on considerably less pay.

 

[Tram Inn SB]

I thought the 398 are EN15277 C-III compliant? If this is the case, I wouldn't be worried.

I’ve no idea what that collection of letters and numbers mean, can you expand…

 

[Tram Inn SB]

I find it strange that if the units are as bad as you say they are, and faults (brakes etc) are also as bad as you say. Why are the unions not shouting from the roof tops like they normally do when such serious issues with rolling stock.

Also why are the unions allowing there members to drive the units if they are so bad?

It all depends on how friendly the local ASLEF reps are, it also takes serious evidence of “black” a traction. If ASLEF don’t have that evidence then they won’t and can’t.

If the test drivers are happy then they’ll report back the units are okay, if your on the test link of drivers picking up some overtime, and being taken off your 11 return trips to the Bay on a summer Saturday your not going to rock the boat are you ?

One thing is certain we will not see a 1/4 of the fleet in passenger traffic in 2026.

 

[craigybagel]

Does anyone have information that can contradict or correct what VR494 is saying?
While admittedly their comments do seem excessively negative I’ve also yet to see anyone post anything to really contradict or truly explain the continuing multi year delays?
I realise no one is obliged to but when one person is continually shut down you would think someone would step up with factually correct information!( as happens in all other topics)

Unions want to keep current staff levels and at current pay levels so possibly on this occasion they aren’t jumping up and down about issues just yet…..as has been pointed out on this thread tram systems in other parts of uk don’t have conductors and drivers are on considerably less pay.

Bear in mind that most of the people with access to the facts are also subject to social media policies that mean they can't publicly comment. Whereas alleged former employees can spew whatever bile they wish free from consequences.

Also, whilst there are a few TfW employees on this site, to the best of my knowledge most of them aren't based on the Valleys network.

 

[Philip Roberts]

Bear in mind that most of the people with access to the facts are also subject to social media policies that mean they can't publicly comment. Whereas alleged former employees can spew whatever bile they wish free from consequences.

Also, whilst there are a few TfW employees on this site, to the best of my knowledge most of them aren't based on the Valleys network.

I think the hard part of us too is how much of this is the normal level of faults you get with a brand new train like this (the 197s were criticised for a long time due to faults and 'shoddy' construction)

 

[Wyrleybart]

Bear in mind that most of the people with access to the facts are also subject to social media policies that mean they can't publicly comment. Whereas alleged former employees can spew whatever bile they wish free from consequences.

Exactly so "Craigybagel". It used to be section A of the old rulebook but the wording will presumably now be in the contract of employment.

I have not seen a 398 as I am in a different part of the country, but AIUI these trains are built by a reputable company, andseem to work well on mainland Europe. The issues presumably are due to Stadler having to add all the bells and whistles necessary for them to operate on Network Rail metals. The concept of tram train works elsewhere in Europe so the nuts and bolts of it are probably very equitable.

The more salient point is that if the 398s have any kind of brake unsolicited brake issue they would be parked and scotched on Taffs Well depot with big "not to move" signs all over them. Are they ? Network Rail take a very dim view of rolling stock on their railway which does not have reliable and trusted braking systems. I am not for one minute disputing anything "VR494" says on here, so when was the last time a 398 ventured out of Taffs Well onto Network Rail railway ? Presumably the 398s are actively running up and down the depot sidings daily

 

[positron]

so when was the last time a 398 ventured out of Taffs Well onto Network Rail railway ? Presumably the 398s are actively running up and down the depot sidings daily

Well they don't need to touch network rail infrastructure for the initial planned route (Pontypridd to Cardiff Bay) but they have been doing that bit recently. Idk if they've been through Central (the network rail part) recently though.

 

[Tram Inn SB]

CVL can within reason run whatever they wish on their network, it becomes much more tricky when you want to access any part of network rail.

CVL have stripped out all non critical infrastructure on the CVL to reduce maintenance requirements, I suspect once the 398s are up and running you’ll see additional units ordered or units redeployed to the Rhymney line as well.

Like I’ve said before the CVL will be reduced to a metro like Metrolink in Manchester that is the aim with the reduced costs associated, that is the only way we’ll see extensions - to light rail standards.

Not a bad thing on the face of it, but there needs to be a openness about current problems (there are many) and future plans even if painful politically and industrial relations wise.

 

[800001]

Taken from tfw press release

Transport for Wales enters final stages for tram-trains introduction

Transport for Wales (TfW) is entering the final stages of preparation ahead of the introduction of its first brand‑new tram‑trains on Pontypridd to Cardiff Bay services this summer.

news.tfw.wales

05 Jun 2026​

Transport for Wales (TfW) is entering the final stages of preparation ahead of the introduction of its first brand‑new tram‑trains on Pontypridd to Cardiff Bay services this summer.

Training for traincrew is well under way, with test runs taking place most days.

TfW continues work to install nine new toilet facilities as well as five refurbished toilet facilities across the Treherbert, Aberdare and Merthyr lines, helping ensure customers have access to toilets when the tram-trains are rolled out.

The South Wales Metro aims to improve connections between Cardiff and the Valleys, with more frequent and faster journeys. TfW’s new fleet of fully electric tram-trains are key to delivering this ambitious Metro timetable.

The improved performance of the new trains, combined with the improvements TfW made to the infrastructure, will reduce journey times to around 50 minutes between Cardiff and Treherbert, Aberdare and Merthyr, with a train every 15 minutes. These changes will be delivered gradually in phases.

Tram-trains will also allow TfW’s network to be expanded, as they’re able to run on light-rail tram lines in the future, as part of the Cardiff Crossrail project. This will allow even more communities to access vital rail services.

The tram-trains are designed for Metro style hop-on-hop-off journeys, with level boarding from train to platform, three open and spacious carriages and improved spaces on board for wheelchairs and bikes.

The first of the 36 new tram-trains will be introduced onto Pontypridd to Cardiff Bay services this summer, replacing the older Class 150 trains that currently run on these services.

Dan Tipper, Chief Infrastructure Officer at TfW said: “Our teams are working extremely hard as we move into the final stages ahead of introducing our first tram‑trains into service. With driver and train manager training nearing completion and testing taking place most days, we’re making strong progress towards launching these services.

“The tram‑trains are central to delivering the faster, more frequent journeys promised by the South Wales Metro and, alongside pay as you go, will support a true turn‑up‑and‑go service for communities across the Valleys.”
As with other metro systems across the UK and Europe, TfW’s tram‑trains do not have toilets on board. Transport for Wales recognises how important access to toilet facilities is for customers and has made a significant investment to improve provision where the tram-trains will run.

This includes the installation of nine new station toilets across the network, alongside the upgrade of five existing facilities. These improvements mean that customers travelling on tram‑train services should never be more than 20 minutes away from a toilet when travelling on the network.

Each of the newly installed toilets have been designed with accessibility in mind, including:

• Wheelchair access.
• Support rails.
• Help points on the inside and outside of the toilets.
• Baby changing facilities.
• Sanitary product dispensers.

To keep passengers safe, TfW has upgraded the CCTV and lighting at all stations where the new toilets have been installed. CCTV outside the toilets will be streamed live to TfW’s Integrated Control Centre in Taff's Well, where it’s managed 24/7 by a dedicated team.

Live help points will ensure customers can report any issues, and remote door locking aims to also help reduce vandalism and anti-social behaviour. TfW will also employ mobile teams to keep the toilets clean and secure.

As installation of the new facilities progresses, with six of nine toilets now nearing completion, Transport for Wales will provide temporary facilities at Pontypridd, Trefforest and Radyr while existing toilets at these stations are refurbished. These temporary facilities will open in time for the first tram-trains to enter service.

Further information, including maps showing the new toilet locations, is available on the TfW website - https://tfw.wales/south-wales-metro-toilets

Notes to editors​

---

Toilet facilities across the Treherbert, Aberdare and Merthyr lines will be in place before tram‑trains enter service on these routes, ensuring customers are no more than 20 minutes away from a toilet while travelling on the tram‑trains.

Each new toilet facility will open as soon as construction is complete, with toilets at Aberdare and Abercynon stations expected to be the first to open.

Over half of the new toilets have already been installed at stations, and work is ongoing to open the facilities in time for the introduction of the first tram‑trains onto the Treherbert, Aberdare and Merthyr lines.

For those travelling on board the tram-trains between Pontypridd and Cardiff Bay, passengers are advised to use customer toilets available at Pontypridd, Trefforest, Radyr, Cardiff Queen Street and Cardiff Central.

Further information, including maps showing the new toilet locations, is available on the TfW website - https://tfw.wales/south-wales-metro-toilets

 

[Tram Inn SB]

I’m not sure how it works sustainably wise to have a traincrew on a tram pottering up and down the Welsh valleys paid a combined total per annum of over £120,000 per crew (£50k TM and £70k driver) when proper trams see driver only and only paid circa £40k pa.

Either the unions have played a blinder for the staff (fair play) to the company have a) a financial death wise or b) a plan to reduce those numbers once they can separate off the CVL into a metro tram operation.

 

[MikePJ]

Looks like 398029 made it to Cardiff Bay last night https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/se...26-06-06/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt - is this the first test using the overhead?

 

[Cardiff123]

TfW are obviously outwardly confident that the entire 398 fleet will be in daily passenger service by December. If that doesn't happen, what's the alternative?

Presumably mainline want the 231s now but still can't have them, and presumably 150s will continue to be withdrawn when their allowed miles are up.
December could become the crunch date.

 

[MikePJ]

Well they don't need to touch network rail infrastructure for the initial planned route (Pontypridd to Cardiff Bay) but they have been doing that bit recently. Idk if they've been through Central (the network rail part) recently though.

The last test run via Network Rail metals (via Cardiff Central) was on 30th May. https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:V12406/2026-05-30/detailed#allox_id=0

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Jun 2026 ==

TfW are obviously outwardly confident that the entire 398 fleet will be in daily passenger service by December. If that doesn't happen, what's the alternative?

Presumably mainline want the 231s now but still can't have them, and presumably 150s will continue to be withdrawn when their allowed miles are up.
December could become the crunch date.

The alternative, which we've seen at various points during the past 3-4 years I've lived in Cardiff, is a mixture of cancellations and substitutions of older rolling stock. TfW have deliberately brought a number of 153s back into service to cover for stock shortages in and around South Wales.

 

[Cardiff123]

The last test run via Network Rail metals (via Cardiff Central) was on 30th May. https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:V12406/2026-05-30/detailed#allox_id=0

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Jun 2026 ==


The alternative, which we've seen at various points during the past 3-4 years I've lived in Cardiff, is a mixture of cancellations and substitutions of older rolling stock. TfW have deliberately brought a number of 153s back into service to cover for stock shortages in and around South Wales.

But those 153s can't be used on the Pontypridd lines, and we've been told that Valleys crews competency on the 153s has expired as well to use them on the Rhymney line.

I don't believe the 398s will be binned as there's no alternative, they will have to be made to work eventually. But they are years late and TfW have been spending the last 3 years repeatedly re-announcing the same news.
I watched the ITV Wales report last night, the report rightly pointed out that it was announced in February that the 398s were entering final stages of testing for a spring introduction in passenger service.........we're now at the start of summer and the same news is being re-announced this week, again, this time with news about toilets.

I won't believe they are entering service until they are actually carrying passengers!

 

[MikePJ]

Canning the Penarth-Coryton service and replacing it with buses is one extreme option - that releases up to 7 x 756s for use elsewhere, and those customers (myself included) have a lot of other options for their journey when compared to those in the Valleys.

 

[Caaardiff]

Canning the Penarth-Coryton service and replacing it with buses is one extreme option - that releases up to 7 x 756s for use elsewhere, and those customers (myself included) have a lot of other options for their journey when compared to those in the Valleys.

Never going to happen. There would be uproar from both ends of the line. At best they could lose the Caerphilly part of those runs and just have Penarth to Coryton.

But those 153s can't be used on the Pontypridd lines, and we've been told that Valleys crews competency on the 153s has expired as well to use them on the Rhymney line.

There's still a few 150's on the mainline that could be subbed by those 153's. Are there many more left in storage?

Presumably mainline want the 231s now but still can't have them, and presumably 150s will continue to be withdrawn when their allowed miles are up.
December could become the crunch date.

There's not many left due to retire so they could stretch some more life out of them if needed.

Alternatively the 158's could be kept and sent down South to cover and the 231's can stay on Valleys work.

 

[ceiberjeiber]

Does anyone have information that can contradict or correct what VR494 is saying?
While admittedly their comments do seem excessively negative I’ve also yet to see anyone post anything to really contradict or truly explain the continuing multi year delays?
I realise no one is obliged to but when one person is continually shut down you would think someone would step up with factually correct information!( as happens in all other topics)

Unions want to keep current staff levels and at current pay levels so possibly on this occasion they aren’t jumping up and down about issues just yet…..as has been pointed out on this thread tram systems in other parts of uk don’t have conductors and drivers are on considerably less pay.

Speaking to friends who know people who know more than most it appears many VR494 haters will have egg on their face ‘shortly’ (as TfW seem to like to use this term)

 

[Towers]

The toilet issue has been done to death on here, but for someone with a bladder or bowel condition, holding on 20 minutes for the next toilet can actually be a very long time, especially if you have a condition that means you can need the toilet urgently, without much warning, and can't hold on.
Ideally, it should be no more than 10 minutes to the next toilet, but obviously there's no funding for that.

On this page under the FAQs, it says there will be toilet stops for the last trains of the night from December

Toilets | Transport for Wales

Transport for Wales | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

tfw.wales

Outside of a Class 455 farewell tour, it’s quite difficult to view scheduled toilet stops as anything other than farcical in this day & age! Regardless of the merits or otherwise of turning the ‘big railway’ into a tramway, that’s a pretty shoddy situation.

How many ‘patrons’ are able to use the station facilities at once; are they installing a proper toilet block or just a couple of single lavatories? The tram crews might need to take a flexible approach as to how long these additonal dwells will take with a busy load on the last run on a Saturday night!

 

[Tram Inn SB]

TfW are obviously outwardly confident that the entire 398 fleet will be in daily passenger service by December. If that doesn't happen, what's the alternative?

Presumably mainline want the 231s now but still can't have them, and presumably 150s will continue to be withdrawn when their allowed miles are up.
December could become the crunch date.

There’s little to no chance anything like the whole fleet let alone half will be traffic and running reliably by the December TT change. I can see service suspensions at worst, or a very quick program to hammer the 150s into an extended life into mid 2027.

 

[Cardiff123]

Outside of a Class 455 farewell tour, it’s quite difficult to view scheduled toilet stops as anything other than farcical in this day & age! Regardless of the merits or otherwise of turning the ‘big railway’ into a tramway, that’s a pretty shoddy situation.

How many ‘patrons’ are able to use the station facilities at once; are they installing a proper toilet block or just a couple of single lavatories? The tram crews might need to take a flexible approach as to how long these additonal dwells will take with a busy load on the last run on a Saturday night!

It looks like, apart from main stations like Queen Street and Pontypridd, it could be 1 single, unisex toilet at the stations with toilets. There could be a long wait at some stations on the last train of the night

 

[Tram Inn SB]

Outside of a Class 455 farewell tour, it’s quite difficult to view scheduled toilet stops as anything other than farcical in this day & age! Regardless of the merits or otherwise of turning the ‘big railway’ into a tramway, that’s a pretty shoddy situation.

How many ‘patrons’ are able to use the station facilities at once; are they installing a proper toilet block or just a couple of single lavatories? The tram crews might need to take a flexible approach as to how long these additonal dwells will take with a busy load on the last run on a Saturday night!

There’s no way TFW control will hold trains for passengers to use the WC, it’ll be catch the next one and hope it’s not cancelled.

You only need one high profile incident like a disabled passenger being left isolated on a platform somewhere with no operational WC going to the papers.

There is that chap on YouTube who likes to make a drama with ramps and shouts at staff, no doubt he’ll be making his way to his next payout on the CVL next year.

 

[Tram Inn SB]

It looks like, apart from main stations like Queen Street and Pontypridd, it could be 1 single, unisex toilet at the stations with toilets. There could be a long wait at some stations on the last train of the night

TFW will probably just taxi them to their destination rather than delay the train. I assume the WC at Pontypridd is in the main building ? So you have to exit the train cross the footbridge then walk to the WC, use it then repeat - a good 10 minutes all in I’d expect.