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TFL & "Managed Decline"

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Goldfish62

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It causes the emergency brakes to come, on most models of bus. Sometimes the driver has to restart the ignition to get the door to close properly .wasting the time of other passengers. So it is quite a selfish act.
It's incredibly selfish and is breach of the Public Service Vehicles (Conduct of Drivers, Inspectors, Conductors and Passengers) Regulations 1990. Hopefully the perpetrator will be caught on CCTV soon.
 
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Horizon22

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And it happens commonly in London too - at least I do it all the time if I'm on a rear platform bus which is stuck in traffic a bit short of its stop. I see no reason to be imprisoned on a bus, having my journey slowed down. The main problem is that it's not so easy to open the door from the outside if you want to hop on.

The more convenient public transport is, the easier it is to ban private cars.



Not desperation - speed and convenience.

"Imprisoned on a bus" That's a lot of hyperbole! I don't think waiting until the next stop classifies as a significant impediment to your liberties.
 

Goldfish62

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Why? Simple convenience. They aren’t allowed to do it, but many simply do it anyway. There are no consequences of doing so (aside I suppose from the risk of being run over/colliding with a cycle).

I don’t think believe there’s any kind of offence being committed by simply exiting a passenger vehicle on a public road (in stark contrast to egressing from a train of course).
Interfering with the operation of the doors without permission of the driver is a breach of PCV byelaws which is punishable by a fine at a magistrates court.

It is not appropriate to openly admit or even encourage illegal activity such as this on this forum.
 

rebmcr

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Interfering with the operation of the doors without permission of the driver is a breach of PCV byelaws which is punishable by a fine at a magistrates court.

It is not appropriate to openly admit or even encourage illegal activity such as this on this forum.
Nobody has done so, calm down.
 

43066

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Interfering with the operation of the doors without permission of the driver is a breach of PCV byelaws which is punishable by a fine at a magistrates court.

Is it? Please can you point to the specific offence? Are there any examples of people being prosecuted and fined for this?

It is not appropriate to openly admit or even encourage illegal activity such as this on this forum.

Nobody has done that as far as I can see.
 

Egg Centric

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They have if you read some of the posts so no, I won't calm down. Bus drivers don't need that sort of behaviour.
If you want to see what bus drivers have to put up with, may I recommend this hilarious book

I cannot see people who put up with that kind of behaviour being especially worried about someone opening a door.

One of the things about buses is they're used by people without any other options.
 

Busaholic

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It's incredibly selfish and is breach of the Public Service Vehicles (Conduct of Drivers, Inspectors, Conductors and Passengers) Regulations 1990. Hopefully the perpetrator will be caught on CCTV soon.
I agree. It can't be justified in other than an emergency situation.
 

AlbertBeale

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I agree. It can't be justified in other than an emergency situation.

If a bus is securely stopped, alongside the kerb, in stationary traffic, not having reached its official stop, and I'm on the rear platform and the driver won't open the door, then I often do open it myself (as other people I know do). This has no negative effect on anyone else - the only thing it might do is speed up other people's journeys by cutting dwell time at the next stop. I consider it a perfectly reasonable response to the slowing down of my journeys caused by the closing of the rear platforms. Public services should be run for the benefit of the public.

The only time I open the door in a different situation is if the driver has skipped the stop I wanted to get off at.

"Imprisoned on a bus" That's a lot of hyperbole! I don't think waiting until the next stop classifies as a significant impediment to your liberties.

If I'm held on a bus against my wishes, and I'm in a situation where I can get off without causing harm or delay to anyone else, I do consider it a completely unwarranted restriction on my liberties to be told I can't let myself off if I want to.
 

philthetube

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If a bus is securely stopped, alongside the kerb, in stationary traffic, not having reached its official stop, and I'm on the rear platform and the driver won't open the door, then I often do open it myself
having driven buses for long enough I can assure you that bus drivers, just like car drivers do not drive along hugging the kerb, this would result in large number of heads being removed by wing mirrors.

you are trying to justify the unjustifiable.
 

Horizon22

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If I'm held on a bus against my wishes, and I'm in a situation where I can get off without causing harm or delay to anyone else, I do consider it a completely unwarranted restriction on my liberties to be told I can't let myself off if I want to.

If you're that concerned about your "liberties" I would suggest you walk. Would you like to get off a train at another stop that isn't a schedule because its conveninent? Or a tram? Bus stops have specific infrastructure and unless you are in a hail-and-ride section I'm sorry but this is a ludicrous point of view.
 

birchesgreen

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If I'm held on a bus against my wishes, and I'm in a situation where I can get off without causing harm or delay to anyone else, I do consider it a completely unwarranted restriction on my liberties to be told I can't let myself off if I want to.
The bus driver kidnapped you?
 
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Considering as many as 20% of all bus passengers aren't bothering with wearing a mask at present on any given bus, I know quite a few drivers who have other things to worry about right now than sorting "prosecutions" for hitting the door release.
 

the sniper

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If you're that concerned about your "liberties" I would suggest you walk.

To be fair, we should probably be glad that Albert hasn't climbed on top of, or glued himself to, said bus in order to save the planet! :lol:
 

LUYMun

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And it happens commonly in London too - at least I do it all the time if I'm on a rear platform bus which is stuck in traffic a bit short of its stop. I see no reason to be imprisoned on a bus, having my journey slowed down. The main problem is that it's not so easy to open the door from the outside if you want to hop on.

It's definite that not many bus drivers are as complete jobsworths as that out there. I'm sure they would open the doors to let you off if the bus is that close to the next stop, giving that you prepared to get off, such as standing up to get ready to leave or pressing the stop bell.
 

AlbertBeale

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To be fair, we should probably be glad that Albert hasn't climbed on top of, or glued himself to, said bus in order to save the planet! :lol:

My direct action and/or civil disobedience to save the planet tends to be directed against vehicles other than buses, you'll be glad to hear....
 

duncanp

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I agree. It can't be justified in other than an emergency situation.

When you get on a bus, you agree to the conditions of carriage, amongst which is a rule that says that the doors can only be opened at an authorised bus stop, or safe stopping space if on a hail and ride section of route.

Bus drivers do sometimes let people off at locations other than bus stops if the bus is held up in traffic, but they don't have to do this, and strictly speaking they would get into trouble with their employers if they did.

All this talk of being imprisoned on a bus is nonsense.
 

Feathers44

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Entitled, self-important nonsense.

”I’m more important than everyone else so can inconvenience them to save myself 30 seconds.”
 

Bletchleyite

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Considering as many as 20% of all bus passengers aren't bothering with wearing a mask at present on any given bus, I know quite a few drivers who have other things to worry about right now than sorting "prosecutions" for hitting the door release.

I doubt anyone has been prosecuted for it ever, to be honest, but it is a bit selfish to delay the bus for your own purposes, and if in doing so the passenger injured a cyclist then I would hope the cyclist sues.
 

leytongabriel

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There are bus drivers who in lengthy traffic queues just before bus stops MAY open the doors a short distance beforehand and others who will keep passengers in until the doors are in line with the bus stop, some cycles of traffic lights later. Isn't this the context of spirit, letter or blatant contravention of regs by both passengers and drivers. Common sense is a wonderful thing .
 

Mojo

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There are bus drivers who in lengthy traffic queues just before bus stops MAY open the doors a short distance beforehand and others who will keep passengers in until the doors are in line with the bus stop, some cycles of traffic lights later. Isn't this the context of spirit, letter or blatant contravention of regs by both passengers and drivers. Common sense is a wonderful thing .
I was on a bus a few months ago in a traffic jam caused by temporary traffic lights which spent a long time on red. After leaving the stop before mine I pressed the bell. As we had been stationary for quite a while, the driver opened the doors to let someone off. He then failed to stop at the actual bus stop, and thus I was over carried. Quite annoying.
 

matt_world2004

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There are bus drivers who in lengthy traffic queues just before bus stops MAY open the doors a short distance beforehand and others who will keep passengers in until the doors are in line with the bus stop, some cycles of traffic lights later. Isn't this the context of spirit, letter or blatant contravention of regs by both passengers and drivers. Common sense is a wonderful thing .
The red book allows drivers to open the door away from bus stops providing it is safe to do so
 

Snow1964

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It seems the Mayor of London is using press releases about jobs elsewhere in UK to try and justify funding, ahead of expiry of temporary funding extension by Government

  • Mayor outlines how thousands of highly skilled green jobs that support TfL’s supply chain in the north and across the country would be at risk if projects including bus manufacturing, Central Line improvements and new Tube trains were delayed due to lack of funding.
  • London’s bus orders support 3,000 jobs across the UK alone, and TfL works with thousands of SMEs as well as major suppliers.
  • New Routemaster buses at risk of being removed from roads and continued electrification of the capital’s bus fleet under threat, with the date for a zero-emission fleet likely to slip till at least 2037.

 

Wolfie

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It seems the Mayor of London is using press releases about jobs elsewhere in UK to try and justify funding, ahead of expiry of temporary funding extension by Government



Put it this way, if l was Khan all expeditiure would take place in London and absolutely nothing in Red Wall areas.
 

Busaholic

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It seems the Mayor of London is using press releases about jobs elsewhere in UK to try and justify funding, ahead of expiry of temporary funding extension by Government



BJ and co. are aware they could lose virtually every Parliamentary seat in London and still hold more than half GB's seats, at least in theory. So stuffing London for the temerity of voting in Sadiq Khan again is of no concern while the government is under the 'control' of a sub-Trumpian figure. In reality, if the Tories lost all those London seats they'd lose a swathe of Home Counties seats too, perhaps mostly to Liberal Democrats, let alone what happens next time in those 'redwall' seats. If Johnson is still in charge, expect him to desert Uxbridge for a supposedly much safer seat at the next Election. Yet, many a slip twixt cup and lip.....
 

The Ham

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Although there's appearing to be a shift in view in the other direction (although still admitting that it's subject to funding):


London’s new transport chief could put Crossrail 2 back on the agenda​


London’s new deputy mayor for transport has outlined his desire to resurrect Crossrail 2 and the Bakerloo Line Extension as he appeared before a London Assembly committee for the first time yesterday.
Seb Dance replaces Heidi Alexander, who stepped down from the role last month, as London mayor Sadiq Khan’s transport chief earlier this month. He told the Confirmation Hearings Committee yesterday that he wanted to see the stalled projects back on the table.
Both schemes – the proposed new link from Hertfordshire to Surrey,and the additional stretch of Tube line from Elephant & Castle to Lewisham – were put on hold earlier in the pandemic as Transport for London (TfL) saw its finances deteriorate.
But Dance said yesterday: “We have to ensure the existing transport system is not only reliable but people also have a sense that we are investing for the future. Projects such as Crossrail 2 and the Bakerloo Line Extension that have had to go back on the shelf because it is impossible to countenance moving forward with them in the current financial situation… if we get long-term funding then those are the kind of ideas I would like to bring back.”
He also backed construction of east London’s controversial Silvertown Tunnel, saying the under-construction 1.4km road crossing of the Thames would allow for 37 extra bus services an hour and play a “huge role” in reducing local congestion.
“Imagine a scenario where public and active transport makes up 80% of journeys in London and all private vehicles are zero emission,” he said. “You still wouldn’t have capacity at Blackwall Tunnel alone to run the cross-transport links [required].”

The former Labour MEP for London said securing long-term funding was his priority as deputy mayor for transport.
“I am not going to pretend it is an easy time [to join], especially having seen the hit to TfL’s finances,” he said. “Funding is the primary challenge; we have a situation where at the peak of the pandemic ridership fell by 95%. There is no longer the £2bn capital funding London used to get to run its transport system; two-thirds of our income is from fare revenue alone, whereas in Paris and New York the majority is from government funding.
“We have had to ask the government for support in the day-to-day management of transport services. We don’t want to have to continue to have to ask government for short-term extensions. It is like pressing the snooze button on the alarm; we all do it sometimes because we can’t face the reality of getting up early but sometimes we have to grasp the nettle. Long-term capital decisions need to be made, we need to give confidence to investors that they can put money into our transport systems and get a return.”
Dance conceded that he had not had a key role to date in running major construction projects.
“In terms of delivery of a major capital project and being directly accountable, no I wouldn’t say there is an obvious example [from my CV] but as with many other briefs I picked up as an MEP, I’m a very fast learner.”

He said that after securing long-term funding, his targets in the role were to reduce carbon emissions, principally by slashing car use and boosting public and active travel, and to ensure TfL’s working relationships were “well managed”.
Dance hinted that more tolls could be introduced on drivers in the capital.
“Going forward, certainly there will be many ideas for road user charging that we will actively consider. There will be a need to look at the long-term application of road user charging. It may well be part of the answer.”
Asked if he would commit to staying in his role to the end of the mayoral term, in 2025, Dance told the committee: “I can give you that commitment 100 per cent. The honour that I feel at being asked to serve the city I was born in and love very deeply is insurmountable – every day I pinch myself that I have this role.”
 

43066

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Considering as many as 20% of all bus passengers aren't bothering with wearing a mask at present on any given bus, I know quite a few drivers who have other things to worry about right now than sorting "prosecutions" for hitting the door release.

A lot more than 20% unmasked on the buses I’ve been on, and rising by the day. Whether passengers are wearing masks or not is nothing to do with bus drivers. If they choose to make an issue of it then more fool them.
 
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