TfGM Bee Network - fleet discussion

[toms]

The bus isn't Stockport depot so why should a Queens Road bus have a route not in its depot?

I would imagine a test blind, just like how Wigan depot gnw buses have the bolton 8 on it

The operator will have its route list on one file, which will include all Stagecoach Manchester routes across all depots, it’s for ease of access really, no need to update controller if moved depots. Same with Go Ahead I’m pretty sure

 

[mattyharding]

Will Oldham be fully electric before 2028?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Nov 2025 ==

The operator will have its route list on one file, which will include all Stagecoach Manchester routes across all depots, it’s for ease of access really, no need to update controller if moved depots. Same with Go Ahead I’m pretty sure

I remember one time my friend sent me a picture of a Strata showing a 348 blind and they also operated from QR

 

[mayneway]

The operator will have its route list on one file, which will include all Stagecoach Manchester routes across all depots, it’s for ease of access really, no need to update controller if moved depots. Same with Go Ahead I’m pretty sure

Spot on.
One generic file is loaded onto several usb pen drives and one is sent to each depot.

Same with Metroline, each bus has All Metroline destinations on it.

 

[D Mylchreest]

Spot on.
One generic file is loaded onto several usb pen drives and one is sent to each depot.

Same with Metroline, each bus has All Metroline destinations on it.

Are they not using the internet to distribute data?

 

[mayneway]

Are they not using the internet to distribute data?

No stagecoach used pen drives to update blinds which meant every bus had to be done individually.
The issue is there’s no many different systems and controllers it would be impossible to update remotely.

 

[D Mylchreest]

No stagecoach used pen drives to update blinds which meant every bus had to be done individually.
The issue is there’s no many different systems and controllers it would be impossible to update remotely.

OK for each individual bus, but couldn't the file or files be sent out by internet? Honda-net is for the ark!

 

[toms]

Are they not using the internet to distribute data?

The only thing that is distributed over the internet is the AVA software which Mark Tyrer does for both mobi and Hanover

 

[mayneway]

The only thing that is distributed over the internet is the AVA software which Mark Tyrer does for both mobi and Hanover

Yea and that’s got more blips than the talking clock.

 

[toms]

Yea and that’s got more blips than the talking clock.

I don’t know why Bee Network are so fixated on having everything with McKenna Brothers, would’ve saved hassle and probably money converting Hanover buses to have Hanover Systems, plus Mobi is a pain to update

 

[mayneway]

I don’t know why Bee Network are so fixated on having everything with McKenna Brothers, would’ve saved hassle and probably money converting Hanover buses to have Hanover Systems, plus Mobi is a pain to update

As one of my managers said to me it’s all about saving money and the cheapest option.

 

[M60lad]

Having ridden on quite a number of older MMC400s recently I've noticed that for some reason that different ones have different next stop displays fitted some have had the basic 2 line dot matrix fitted and others have had the screens fitted, is there a reason for this? I am talking about the MMC400s that didn't have next stop displays fitted from new btw not the later ones.

 

[Class 466]

Having ridden on quite a number of older MMC400s recently I've noticed that for some reason that different ones have different next stop displays fitted some have had the basic 2 line dot matrix fitted and others have had the screens fitted, is there a reason for this? I am talking about the MMC400s that didn't have next stop displays fitted from new btw not the later ones.

Any with the tiny LED displays fitted aren’t hanging around in Manchester long term, but need the mods to be compliant with the law.

The 69/20 plate MMCs are also having it retrofitted, despite the fact they already had working displays and announcements… truly more money then sense.

As a side, I also see there’s still no fix on the modded buses to show any form of via points

 

[Dwarfer1979]

I don’t know why Bee Network are so fixated on having everything with McKenna Brothers, would’ve saved hassle and probably money converting Hanover buses to have Hanover Systems, plus Mobi is a pain to update

Long term simplification, it is entirely logical and my employers are doing the same replacing one suppliers equipment with that from our selected supplier (even on brand new vehicles where the stock spec was another system it was removed and replaced before service entry by our contractors. Two systems means double the workload to set up the data and double the workload every time there is a change, extra work to maintain information to know who to deal with when a specific bus has an issue and more risk of mistakes due to the intervention for one system being done on the other at the risk of breaking it. Each supplier will have a different operating system, relying on data in a different format, managed in a different way and requiring different expertise and I don't believe they are such that you can do very much of the set up work for both before going into the specialism.

You may argue or criticise them that they went with the wrong supplier but having a single system throughout the network is a sensible long term strategic decision.

 

[xitz2012@gmail]

Any with the tiny LED displays fitted aren’t hanging around in Manchester long term, but need the mods to be compliant with the law.

Is that also true for the refurbished 16 plates, as they also have the smaller LED displays. If so then it seems a bit daft to spend all that money refurbishing them to Bee Network spec if they aren’t sticking around long term.

 

[mayneway]

Long term simplification, it is entirely logical and my employers are doing the same replacing one suppliers equipment with that from our selected supplier (even on brand new vehicles where the stock spec was another system it was removed and replaced before service entry by our contractors. Two systems means double the workload to set up the data and double the workload every time there is a change, extra work to maintain information to know who to deal with when a specific bus has an issue and more risk of mistakes due to the intervention for one system being done on the other at the risk of breaking it. Each supplier will have a different operating system, relying on data in a different format, managed in a different way and requiring different expertise and I don't believe they are such that you can do very much of the set up work for both before going into the specialism.

You may argue or criticise them that they went with the wrong supplier but having a single system throughout the network is a sensible long term strategic decision.

It’s being done because one person within TFGM has some fascination with all the buses displaying ‘this bus departs in’ countdown and removing perfectly good brand new systems and fitting second rate systems (in my opinion) that drivers will need training to use, rather than a simple touch screen is crazy. A complete waste of tax payers money.

 

[mattyharding]

I wonder if the Bee Network will ever see Yutong U11s in the near future

 

[WibbleWobble]

It’s being done because one person within TFGM has some fascination with all the buses displaying ‘this bus departs in’ countdown and removing perfectly good brand new systems and fitting second rate systems (in my opinion) that drivers will need training to use, rather than a simple touch screen is crazy. A complete waste of tax payers money.

A feature also available in Hanover systems!

 

[toms]

Long term simplification, it is entirely logical and my employers are doing the same replacing one suppliers equipment with that from our selected supplier (even on brand new vehicles where the stock spec was another system it was removed and replaced before service entry by our contractors. Two systems means double the workload to set up the data and double the workload every time there is a change, extra work to maintain information to know who to deal with when a specific bus has an issue and more risk of mistakes due to the intervention for one system being done on the other at the risk of breaking it. Each supplier will have a different operating system, relying on data in a different format, managed in a different way and requiring different expertise and I don't believe they are such that you can do very much of the set up work for both before going into the specialism.

You may argue or criticise them that they went with the wrong supplier but having a single system throughout the network is a sensible long term strategic decision.

I get what you say and there is nothing wrong with what your saying but right now it’s causing more problems than it is solving

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Nov 2025 ==

It’s being done because one person within TFGM has some fascination with all the buses displaying ‘this bus departs in’ countdown and removing perfectly good brand new systems and fitting second rate systems (in my opinion) that drivers will need training to use, rather than a simple touch screen is crazy. A complete waste of tax payers money.

What’s even funnier is that the bus departing countdown is driver enabled and half the drivers don’t use it

 

[mayneway]

What’s even funnier is that the bus departing countdown is driver enabled and half the drivers don’t use it

It will end up being another stick TFGM will hit drivers with when they don’t use it. I can guarantee it.

 

[M60lad]

What vehicles/operators actually have the bus departure countdown fitted? I don't think I've actually seen any Bee Network displays actually showing it to be honest and surely if its fitted drivers will have to be shown how to enable it for it be shown.

 

[py_megapixel]

I believe a retrofitted Mobitec system can control existing Hanover display hardware.

Can a retrofitted Hanover system control existing Mobitec hardware? If not, I can't see how it would be at all practical to standardise on Hanover - it would require ripping out and replacing hundreds of perfectly good destination blinds. Which, as, I'm sure posters in this thread would be quick to point out, would be extremely expensive and a waste of money.

 

[mayneway]

What vehicles/operators actually have the bus departure countdown fitted? I don't think I've actually seen any Bee Network displays actually showing it to be honest and surely if its fitted drivers will have to be shown how to enable it for it be shown.

It’s slowly being fitted to a a number of the older stagecoach and Metroline buses. Posters have gone up at depots saying now it works.

 

[toms]

What vehicles/operators actually have the bus departure countdown fitted? I don't think I've actually seen any Bee Network displays actually showing it to be honest and surely if its fitted drivers will have to be shown how to enable it for it be shown.

Most of diamonds fleet, retrofitted streetdecks, E200s, and electroliners at Go North West, possibly some of stagecoach’s retrofitted vehicles tho I am yet to see it, possibly all of Metrolines ultroliners. Its a driver enabled setting so it’s a lot less common that you actually see it. It only is avaliable on Mobitec Bee Buses atm

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Nov 2025 ==

It’s slowly being fitted to a a number of the older stagecoach and Metroline buses. Posters have gone up at depots saying now it works.

So there is a setting to only show destination on the outside without AVA, which explains why most retrofitted buses are going around without the announcements on, I see on the poster that Luminator Group are mentioned in the bottom right who actually supply the Metrolink announcement systems aswell.

 

[py_megapixel]

So there is a setting to only show destination on the outside without AVA, which explains why most retrofitted buses are going around without the announcements on

Drivers really should be told to select announcements by default and only use destination only mode as a fallback... buses shouldn't be running with accessibility features disabled just because someone has pressed the wrong button.

Perhaps at some point TfGM will start imposing penalties on operators for running trips without the auto announcer enabled, like I believe is already done in London.

 

[mayneway]

Drivers really should be told to select announcements by default and only use destination only mode as a fallback... buses shouldn't be running with accessibility features disabled just because someone has pressed the wrong button.

Perhaps at some point TfGM will start imposing penalties on operators for running trips without the auto announcer enabled, like I believe is already done in London.

Problem is the system is so so glitchy. I had a bus for 4 hours last week where the announcement was stuck on ‘this is where this service ends, please take all belongings with you’ over and over again. No option for me to turn off.

It’s a one man band going around installing the systems and maintaining them and it will be months if not years until it’s perfect.

 

[ACBest]

The destination only mode can be manipulated so that the only things selectable are generic things like Not in Service, or alternatively, destination only mode can be removed altogether - presumably they’ll do one of those in future.

 

[CN12 AWU]

Tbh makes sence to change to one destination system so if more vehicles have Mobitec may aswell convert the rest that way it's easier all round

 

[Mollman]

It’s slowly being fitted to a a number of the older stagecoach and Metroline buses. Posters have gone up at depots saying now it works.

Thanks for sharing, can understand why Countdown is not used - would be far better if the system talked to the ticket machine so that it would automatically know how long until departure. Same goes for diversion, it should be able to use GPS or the ticket machine to automatically know where it is when the diversion ends rather than the driver having to manually input.

 

[ACBest]

Thanks for sharing, can understand why Countdown is not used - would be far better if the system talked to the ticket machine so that it would automatically know how long until departure. Same goes for diversion, it should be able to use GPS or the ticket machine to automatically know where it is when the diversion ends rather than the driver having to manually input.

This is another thing which can be done, if an operator has the link between the destination display and ticket machine installed, which automatically sets the displays, that same link will also automatically set the countdown if that feature is enabled in both the destination display setup, and the Ticketer portal config (the hidden config bit, set by Ticketer support).

 

[MCRTransitYT]

Stagecoach 44901 and 44903 have arrived at Eccles