Strike related cancellations

[ejstubbs]

Very odd occurrence today. I was booked on the 16:00 LNER service from King's Cross to Edinburgh this coming Sunday. That's the day after the second RMT strike day. Today I received an e-mail from LNER advising that my train was cancelled, and offering me the option to take a refund, or re-book. I opted for the latter and was somewhat surprised to find the 16:00 service on Sunday being offered as a re-bookable option, at zero cost.

I selected that option and the system went ahead and booked me on it. Not unexpectedly, the seat reservations (there are two of us travelling) are different to my original booking. I had a go at amending them and was puzzled to see that the coach my new seats had been reserved in (coach C) wasn't shown on the train plan.

So I abandoned the change of seats and accepted the booking as made by the system. I have now received the confirmation e-mail, and the e-tickets, showing us booked on the same train as before, but in the new seats.

I am left wondering (a) how they managed to re-book us on a supposedly cancelled train, and (b) how they managed to allocate us seats in an apparently non-existant coach.

As things stand at the moment I shall be approaching my journey home on Sunday with some trepidation...

 

[yorkie]

Very odd occurrence today. I was booked on the 16:00 LNER service from King's Cross to Edinburgh this coming Sunday. That's the day after the second RMT strike day. Today I received an e-mail from LNER advising that my train was cancelled, and offering me the option to take a refund, or re-book. I opted for the latter and was somewhat surprised to find the 16:00 service on Sunday being offered as a re-bookable option, at zero cost.

I selected that option and the system went ahead and booked me on it. Not unexpectedly, the seat reservations (there are two of us travelling) are different to my original booking. I had a go at amending them and was puzzled to see that the coach my new seats had been reserved in (coach C) wasn't shown on the train plan.

How odd; Coach C is usually unreserveable

So I abandoned the change of seats and accepted the booking as made by the system. I have now received the confirmation e-mail, and the e-tickets, showing us booked on the same train as before, but in the new seats.

I am left wondering (a) how they managed to re-book us on a supposedly cancelled train, and (b) how they managed to allocate us seats in an apparently non-existant coach.

As things stand at the moment I shall be approaching my journey home on Sunday with some trepidation...

It is not an infrequent occurence that a train will get cancelled and then re-instated, but the re-instated service may be different e.g. it may be a different type of train (2x5 car instead of 1x9 car) and/or it may not go all the way to Aberdeen (I've not looked) and/or it may have a different calling pattern etc...

 

[43094]

If it’s for a Sunday, that service would never have been booked to run to Aberdeen (it’s an Edinburgh terminator).

 

[yorkie]

Looking at Timetablehistory.com (below is the link given out by email, to anyone who booked an itinerary including this train through Trainsplit) it was simply deleted and reinstated:

London Kings Cross to Edinburgh on 21/08/2022 | Train Timetable

Schedule History

• Train added to timetable on 04/02/2022
• Train was cancelled on 16/08/2022
• Train was reinstated on 17/08/2022

	Station​	Arrive​	Depart​	Notes​
	London Kings Cross		16:00
	York	17:46	17:52
	Darlington	18:19	18:21
	Newcastle	18:47	18:50
	Berwick-Upon-Tweed	19:32	19:34
	Edinburgh	20:17

Reservations compulsory
First class available
Restaurant car for first class passengers
Headcode: 1S24, Service ID: GR652100, Train ID: L78475. Last schedule change 17/08/2022.

How odd.

As for coach C, I've no idea what is going on there but maybe @Wallsendmag and/or @Haywain may have some ideas...

 

[skyhigh]

The following message appears on LNER's Twitter-

Due to a technical issue, a number of bookings for 20 or 21 August are incorrectly showing in some customers' accounts as cancelled.

https://mobile.twitter.com/LNER/status/1559894095128141826

 

[ejstubbs]

How odd; Coach C is usually unreserveable

Hmm, I thought LNER was reservations only. Or is that been and gone? (I've not used LNER since before lockdown started.) I just hope I don't end up in an argument over occupation of those seats if they're not supposed to be reservable. I really don't fancy standing all the way to Edinburgh. Or even part of the way, come to that. (There were only seven spaces available on the train when I was rebooking.)

As for cancelling and then reinstating the service - albeit in an amended form - it strikes me as a bit poor to force all the passengers not directly affected by the change to have to re-book. I was out and about most of the day today and barely looking at my phone: if I'd not noticed the e-mail until an hour two later I might have been too late to re-book on the service I wanted and which, for my purposes, was still running.

 

[yorkie]

Hmm, I thought LNER was reservations only. Or is that been and gone?

That ended over a year ago, and even then coach C was not reserveable.

I've not used LNER since before lockdown started.) I just hope I don't end up in an argument over occupation of those seats if they're not supposed to be reservable. I really don't fancy standing all the way to Edinburgh. Or even part of the way, come to that. (There were only seven spaces available on the train when I was rebooking.)

If they are not reserveable and you get there first, no-one is going to turf you out anyway! Try to get to the platform early. Use the Open Train Times or Traksy live maps to see where your train is ahead of it being announced. It can also be worth waiting on the footbridge, to give you a headstart.

As for cancelling and then reinstating the service - albeit in an amended form - it strikes me as a bit poor to force all the passengers not directly affected by the change to have to re-book. I was out and about most of the day today and barely looking at my phone: if I'd not noticed the e-mail until an hour two later I might have been too late to re-book on the service I wanted and which, for my purposes, was still running.

I am unsure how the LNER email is worded exactly but my understanding is that the wording may be interpreted as suggesting you have to re-book but in reality you don't have to do anything.

I don't book with LNER (some of my tickets are, but I don't buy them) but the wording using the retailer I use (which often charges less than LNER, and never more) makes it clear that there are numerous options; here is an example email:

We're sorry to inform you that your trip to London Euston is affected by service changes. Please review your updated itinerary below and replan your journey if needed.

Outbound journey on Tuesday, August 23, 2022

A service in your outbound journey has been cancelled.

£ I don't wish to travel, claim refund now ​

If you still wish to travel:​

• You do not need to purchase additional tickets to complete your journey.
• Take the next available service which matches the route and operator restrictions on your ticket(s).
• *If there isn't a service available matching the route or operator restrictions on your ticket(s), please contact a member of staff at the station or onboard at the earliest opportunity as local arrangements may affect which services you are entitled to travel on.
• Your trip may become affected by further service changes or reinstatements at short notice. Please check the timetable on the day of travel using the 'details' links displayed in your itinerary below.

If you no longer wish to travel:​

• Please use our online refund form to request a refund of your tickets. No administration fee will be charged for refunds due to service disruption.
• If you have printed your tickets, please do not dispose of them until the refund has been processed and the money has been returned to your account.
• It is not possible to refund only the outbound portion of two part return tickets (e.g. Anytime Day Return, Off Peak Return).
• If you want to request a refund of only the inbound portion of a journey which includes two part return tickets, you will need to wait until after your outbound journey is completed before requesting a refund.
• Full details of your refund and compensation rights can be found in the National Rail Conditions of Travel.

Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston​

Departing Tuesday, August 23, 2022. 1 adult.

➔ Your journey starts from Manchester Piccadilly at 14:35, but please arrive in plenty of time.​

Manchester Piccadilly station details.

​ This service has been cancelled. Please take the next service matching your ticket route and operator restrictions.​ ➔ Board the 14:35 service to London Euston (Avanti West Coast). (G65019 service details) You'll arrive at London Euston at 16:40 Leave the train here.​ ​

 

[ejstubbs]

The following message appears on LNER's Twitter-

https://mobile.twitter.com/LNER/status/1559894095128141826

Oh great (I watch LNER's Twitter feed even less assiduously than I check my e-mails). So does that mean that my original booking and seat reservations are actually still valid? Or am I going to have to hope that the suspect reservations in coach C will be good on the day?

 

[yorkie]

Oh great (I watch LNER's Twitter feed even less assiduously than I check my e-mails). So does that mean that my original booking and seat reservations are actually still valid?

Unless you cancelled them or re-booked them, I'd assume so.

Or am I going to have to hope that the suspect reservations in coach C will be good on the day?

Coach C is unlikely to have any reservations (unless something really weird is going on), but if you get there first, no-one is going to be able to chuck you out of the seat, as it's first come first served.

To board first, be at the footbridge in good time before departure (it could be announced 20 or so mins before) and use OTT or Traksy maps to check the platform information so you can get a head-start, to go straight down the escalator from the footbridge to the train.

TRAKSY.UK

Live train maps and timetables

traksy.uk

Live map of Kings Cross and Moorgate to Hitchin

See trains move in real-time on our live map of Kings Cross and Moorgate to Hitchin

www.opentraintimes.com

The headcode you are looking for on the maps is 1S24

 

[Adam Williams]

This was not LNER's fault.

My understanding (thanks to a helpful email from LNER, actually) is that half of the timetable for these dates was .. not loaded, by mistake. And only reinstated the next day. Every retailer sending automated emails when services are cancelled/removed from the timetable would have sent incorrect emails (for a wide variety of TOC services) in response to this mistake.

 

[ejstubbs]

Unless you cancelled them or re-booked them, I'd assume so.

Well, that's what I did, because their system told me to (I made the original booking through LNER). I didn't cancel the original booking - their system said they'd done that - but I did re-book it, because they said I could and I wanted to travel that day.

And their system reserved seats in coach C for us.

If we end up without reserved seats because of this, I'll be mightily hacked off. (We are travelling on advance tickets which AIUI have to have reserved seats.)

 

[yorkie]

Indeed the original issue is not LNER's fault but it sounds like the wording of their automatic emails isn't great.

 

[miklcct]

I have instead got the following email in regard to my journey on "cancelled" trains:

Dear Michael,

TECHNICAL ISSUE AFFECTING SOME BOOKINGS ON 20 AND 21 AUGUST 2022

We’re getting in touch to let you know that due to a technical issue, a number of bookings for Saturday 20 and Sunday 21 August 2022 are incorrectly showing in some customers’ accounts as cancelled.

We are working to rectify this issue, but in the meantime wanted to reassure you that your booked trains shown below will still run and your tickets and seat reservations will still be valid for travel as originally booked.

08:38 Cricklewood to Lincoln on 21 August 2022
08:42 Cricklewood to Lincoln on 21 August 2022
14:20 Lincoln to Cricklewood on 21 August 2022

You can also check your booked train times on our website here before you travel.

If you have booked Passenger Assistance, the arrangements for this also remain the same as originally booked.

Please accept our sincere apologies for any inconvenience we may have caused by sending you incorrect train cancellation information earlier this week.

Kind regards

The LNER Team

 

[ejstubbs]

I am unsure how the LNER email is worded exactly but my understanding is that the wording may be interpreted as suggesting you have to re-book but in reality you don't have to do anything.

This is what it said:

WE ARE SORRY YOUR JOURNEY HAS BEEN CANCELLED

We are getting in touch to let you know that unfortunately your journey for Booking Ref: XXXXXXXXX has been cancelled.



This is due to industrial action on 18 and 20 August, which means LNER will be running a reduced timetable between 17 and 21 August inclusive.

Please accept our apologies for the inconvenience this may cause to your travel plans.

Your Options

· We recommend you login to your LNER account here: https://www.lner.co.uk/my-account/my-bookings/booking-details/?TransactionNumber=XXXXXXXXXX and select a different service by selecting “Change Your Journey”. This change will be free if you select the same ticket type and class and choose a service up to 27 August.

Since we definitely did want to travel on the 21st, I did what was suggested in the e-mail. I received nothing from LNER telling me to ignore it (and Twitter does not count; if you tell someone something like this via e-mail, you send the correction via e-mail too).

Looks like I'm going to have to try to call them tomorrow to find out what the precise status of my booking is.

I really don't fancy playing silly games to grab an unreserved seat, especially lugging a hefty suitcase into the bargain. I don't even know where the footbridge people are referring to actually is, or how to get to it. I've only ever traveled with a reserved seat so it's never been necessary.

 

[skyhigh]

(and Twitter does not count; if you tell someone something like this via e-mail, you send the correction via e-mail too).

To be honest I'm quite surprised they didn't do that. They certainly should have done.

 

[Wallsendmag]

This is what it said:



Since we definitely did want to travel on the 21st, I did what was suggested in the e-mail. I received nothing from LNER telling me to ignore it (and Twitter does not count; if you tell someone something like this via e-mail, you send the correction via e-mail too).

Looks like I'm going to have to try to call them tomorrow to find out what the precise status of my booking is.

I really don't fancy playing silly games to grab an unreserved seat, especially lugging a hefty suitcase into the bargain. I don't even know where the footbridge people are referring to actually is, or how to get to it. I've only ever traveled with a reserved seat so it's never been necessary.

If you want to pm me your booking reference I can check for you

 

[Haywain]

I understand there was a fault in a timetable upload by Network Rail which led to a lot of services being reflected as cancelled, wholly incorrectly.
And for another poster (@ejstubbs), coach C is partly reservable now.

 

[ejstubbs]

If you want to pm me your booking reference I can check for you

Thanks, I'll do that. I've been chatting on Twitter with an LNER person who said: "there are a selection of seats in Coach C on specific services that can be reserved. This being one of them." It would be nice to get it confirmed from a second source, though.

(I've already tried changing the seat reservations via my booking on the LNER web site and it looks like there are no pairs of seats left available to be reserved, so fingers crossed those ones it allocated to us in coach C are 'for real'!)

 

[Haywain]

fingers crossed those ones it allocated to us in coach C are 'for real'!)

They are.

 

[ejstubbs]

And for another poster (@ejstubbs), coach C is partly reservable now.

Yes, that's what the person I've been DMing on Twitter said, too. Funny that coach C didn't show up on the train map when I tried to change the reservations. Or could that just have been because there are no free reservable sets left in coach C?

 

[Haywain]

Yes, that's what the person I've been DMing on Twitter said, too. Funny that coach C didn't show up on the train map when I tried to change the reservations. Or could that just have been because there are no free reservable sets left in coach C?

How many people will it take to convince you?

 

[ejstubbs]

How many people will it take to convince you?

I probably didn't make it clear that I was trying to ask a slightly different question: given that some seats in coach C are reservable on the service in question, was the reason that coach C wasn't included on the train map to change my reservations because all the reservable seats in coach C were taken? I'm just trying to understand how the web page function works is all.

 

[Wallsendmag]

I probably didn't make it clear that I was trying to ask a slightly different question: given that some seats in coach C are reservable on the service in question, was the reason that coach C wasn't included on the train map to change my reservations because all the reservable seats in coach C were taken? I'm just trying to understand how the web page function works is all.

There is a reason for that but i won't bore you with it.

 

[ejstubbs]

Thanks everyone for your advice and guidance about how to deal with this. Wallsendmag has very kindly confirmed that my amended journey booking is sound so we can enjoy ourselves at the wedding tomorrow without having to worry about issues getting home on Sunday

 

[miklcct]

I probably didn't make it clear that I was trying to ask a slightly different question: given that some seats in coach C are reservable on the service in question, was the reason that coach C wasn't included on the train map to change my reservations because all the reservable seats in coach C were taken? I'm just trying to understand how the web page function works is all.

I have reserved seats on coach C using the seat map.

 

[ejstubbs]

Update 1: It turned out that LNER actually had e-mailed me about the mistake which caused my journey to show as cancelled - 23 hours before the erroneous/misleading e-mail was sent, in fact. However, my ISP stuck it in my junk mail folder which isn't visible on my phone, so I didn't see it until I got home yesterday. The e-mail had come from an e-mail address that LNER had never used before when communicating with me - which partly (though not wholly) explains why my ISP thought it was suspicious. I think there's a lesson there, and will be feeding back to that effect.

Update 2: On the day, reservations were not working on the train, though they didn't tell us that until just before departure, by which time it was not practical to relocate ourselves to better seats than the rather cramped ones with a poor view (C83 & C84) that the system had allocated when I (unnecessarily) rebooked. That said, the train was by no means fully occupied, contrary to the impression that had been given by the app when I was rebooking, and in the on-station announcements.

A friend of mine came off somewhat worse when she fell in to the same trap that I did, having originally had a first class ticket but none being available when she went to (unecessarily) rebook, so ended up travelling home standard class - for no reason at all other than LNER's incompetence.

 

[Haywain]

for no reason at all other than LNER's Network Rail's incompetence.

Corrected that for you.

 

[Watershed]

Corrected that for you.

As far as the customer is concerned, Network Rail is just a subcontractor. LNER can blame them all they want but in the public image, it's the TOC's fault.

 

[Adam Williams]

However, my ISP stuck it in my junk mail folder which isn't visible on my phone,

If you post the email headers we might be able to speculate as to whether there was anything LNER could've done to prevent this. In an ideal world they might have used the same From address but I don't think this is a significant black mark against them.

It's always difficult to know if it's down to an ISP being overzealous or the sender neglecting to set-up SPF/DKIM/DMARC properly and/or sending from an IP address with a poor reputation.

 

[Haywain]

As far as the customer is concerned, Network Rail is just a subcontractor. LNER can blame them all they want but in the public image, it's the TOC's fault.

That doesn't alter who made the cock-up.