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Stranded person and dead milage running

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Bryan Andrews

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I find the insurance angle a bit hard to swallow about not registering garage journeys in service.

Yes, an operator's insurance would to some extent be proportionate to the number of miles operated, but i can't see that much difference with one more journey a day.

Some operators tend to register their dead workings (even at either end of a council contracted service) on the basis that they need to run anyway and they may as well be open to occasionally getting a few fares. If you include them as part of the same registration when you start the service, there's no additional service registration cost, and at one time you used to get fuel duty rebate on 'service' journeys but not garage journeys run 'not in service' (although i'm a bit out of date on BSOG or whatever it's called this week.)

Although the added time / mileage involved in running in service / running to or from a bus station terminus rather than going straight to / from depot has got to be paid for, and it may not be considered worth it for the sake of a fare paid once every few weeks. And the time might just push the driver's duty over a 'drivers hours' limit.

In London of course it's different, as TFL don't want odd 'when working' journeys happening that will change (and therefore generate complaints about their removal) if a route moves to a different garage either at re-tender or if the operator has a re-shuffle between garages.

If an operator (or driver acting on their own initiative) charged a fare to carry someone on a non-registered garage journey, that of course would be dodgy...
I can concur that an operator I worked for had a route that ran from A to B schooldays only and B to A at 2359 M-S. These were garage journeys picking up the fuel duty rebate on dead runs. It was as rare as rocking horse s*** to pick anyone up.
 
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Jordan Adam

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A little while back in Aberdeen a driver was driving the last route 12 (Heathryfold - Citycentre - Torry) of the night but the bus was due to terminate in the city centre from Heathryfold. Someone boarded the bus needing to go to Torry, the driver realised that there was no more buses to Torry that night so they called control and asked for permission to take the passenger to Torry, control gave them permission so the passenger managed to get home without being left stranded.

From memory a similar incident happened to an elderly couple on First's route 3 towards Cove (Much longer distance) and once again the driver obtained permission to take them home. I know there's also been a number occasions with Stagecoach here on more rural routes where the driver has taken a passenger to the depot and then gave them a lift home.

I need to try and find the news articles relating to these kind acts, but as i say this was a few years back....
 

Volvodart

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A little while back in Aberdeen a driver was driving the last route 12 (Heathryfold - Citycentre - Torry) of the night but the bus was due to terminate in the city centre from Heathryfold. Someone boarded the bus needing to go to Torry, the driver realised that there was no more buses to Torry that night so they called control and asked for permission to take the passenger to Torry, control gave them permission so the passenger managed to get home without being left stranded.

From memory a similar incident happened to an elderly couple on First's route 3 towards Cove (Much longer distance) and once again the driver obtained permission to take them home. I know there's also been a number occasions with Stagecoach here on more rural routes where the driver has taken a passenger to the depot and then gave them a lift home.

I need to try and find the news articles relating to these kind acts, but as i say this was a few years back....

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/f...stagecoach-driver-for-being-a-good-samaritan/
 

221129

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If the bus is not in service then it is not in service. I would not take anyone back not in service vulnerable or not. Same as an ECS run on the railway.
 

175mph

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If the bus is not in service then it is not in service. I would not take anyone back not in service vulnerable or not. Same as an ECS run on the railway.
Would you just give a "So?! Not my problem!" response if anyone tried to beg you to do otherwise?
 

221129

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Would you just give a "So?! Not my problem!" response if anyone tried to beg you to do otherwise?
I wouldn't risk my job or safety no. If they are that vulnerable I certainly wouldn't be taking them anywhere on my own. Especially as there is no duty of care at that point. If they were that vulnerable I would wait with them and call the police.
 

PeterC

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Would you just give a "So?! Not my problem!" response if anyone tried to beg you to do otherwise?
I think the response would depend on employer attitude. Some bosses will praise you for taking the initiative while others will haul you over the coals.
 

philthetube

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Insurance won’t cover your car if you’re driving illegally. Say you’ve had a drink & are over the limit, then have an accident, the insurance will only cover the bare minimum they have to by law, they won’t cover any damage to your car or you, as they don’t have to & you were driving illegally. If a bus driver is driving a route illegally, expect the same.

If a fare is charged it is illegal. That includes having a pass or return ticket. If a fare isn’t charged that’s gross misconduct. If a fare is charged it has to be a registered bus service. If the bus is “not in service” it’s...well...not in service. I think an insurance company would claim a driver acting on gross misconduct was not within insurance terms. I know it seems hard to believe that an insurance company would try to get out of paying up, but there you go!

But I’d have my doubts about anyone waiting at a bus stop when there’s no timetabled bus. Who goes to wait for the last bus at night without checking when it is?
As you say the insurance would not have to cover any damage to your car, however passenger liability is a totally different ball game and unles a passevger was riding in a vehicle known to be stolen, (or other criminal circumstances) then the insurance would have no choice other than to pay up.
 

Busaholic

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When we get driverless buses the answer will be clearcut: a metallic 'voice' will no doubt intone 'access denied all areas' or something equally uplifting. Until then, I guess the reaction will vary between 'more than my job's worth' and 'be my guest, I'm going there anyway' with some more nuanced. I still maintain that insurance cover is a red herring, and nothing I've read here dissuades me from that view.
 

175mph

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When we get driverless buses the answer will be clearcut: a metallic 'voice' will no doubt intone 'access denied all areas' or something equally uplifting. Until then, I guess the reaction will vary between 'more than my job's worth' and 'be my guest, I'm going there anyway' with some more nuanced. I still maintain that insurance cover is a red herring, and nothing I've read here dissuades me from that view.
Hopefully by then I'll have little to no incentive to use the bus due to having a car.
 

philthetube

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When we get driverless buses the answer will be clearcut: a metallic 'voice' will no doubt intone 'access denied all areas' or something equally uplifting. Until then, I guess the reaction will vary between 'more than my job's worth' and 'be my guest, I'm going there anyway' with some more nuanced. I still maintain that insurance cover is a red herring, and nothing I've read here dissuades me from that view.
which raises the question, how do you take a driverless bus out of service?
 
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