South west trains class 456??

[317663]

I saw a video on YouTube of a southern livered 456 on a south west trains service. I'm planning to go to Queenstown road next week. Will I see 456s, operating for SWT, even though still in SR livery?

 

[user15681]

Which video is this?

As far as I'm aware, they haven't entered service yet and aren't planned to until late spring. Last I heard, driver training runs were happening on the Shepperton branch. Even when they do enter passenger service, they'll initially operate Guildford to Ascot shuttles. So, no, you won't see them in service at Queenstown Road next week I'm afraid. (willing to be corrected on this if somethings changed)

It's possible though that when they do enter service some may still be in SN colours. 12 456s went up to Wolverton recently for the refurb and repaint will take place at the same time, I believe.

 

[Crossover]

All 456's have been transferred to SWT now. I don't know the diagrams they work though, IF they are in passenger service yet

 

[causton]

I'm sure I saw a SWT guard saying something on Twitter about some units entering service in SN colours with the Southern logo removed (sounds familiar, a la FCC?) before being replaced by the refurbished units and then they will head up themselves for the repaint.

 

[317663]

Which video is this?

As far as I'm aware, they haven't entered service yet and aren't planned to until late spring. Last I heard, driver training runs were happening on the Shepperton branch. Even when they do enter passenger service, they'll initially operate Guildford to Ascot shuttles. So, no, you won't see them in service at Queenstown Road next week I'm afraid. (willing to be corrected on this if somethings changed)

It's possible though that when they do enter service some may still be in SN colours. 12 456s went up to Wolverton recently for the refurb and repaint will take place at the same time, I believe.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rNU5Eeb0MpM

 

[user15681]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rNU5Eeb0MpM

Looks to me like driver training. They were (don't know if they still are) doing Strawberry Hill - Kingston - Shepperton - Kingston - Shepperton - Strawberry Hill at one point.

 

[kareeosman]

Pretty sure there is a 456 at Wimbledon train care with SWT livery.

 

[317663]

Pretty sure there is a 456 at Wimbledon train care with SWT livery.

As far as I am concerned, the first painting of this train is due later this month, so that's virtually impossible, maybe you saw a 458?

 

[JB25]

Are SWTs going to update the lights on the 456s?

 

[swt_passenger]

Are SWTs going to update the lights on the 456s?

SWT have just said they will be modified internally to 'match the 455s':

...These trains are compatible with the Class 455 trains within the existing South West Trains fleet
and will be refurbished to the same high quality specification.

http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/extra-capacity-on-south-west-trains.aspx

Porterbrooks's 456 brochure doesn't mention lights being changed either, but you'd have to assume it's a possibility.

http://www.porterbrook.co.uk/downloads/brochures/456 Brochure.pdf

 

[fgwrich]

Are SWTs going to update the lights on the 456s?

Given that everything else in the SWT fleet that uses WIPACS has been updated to the newer design, I wouldn't put it past them coming out of Wolverton Works with these fitted.

 

[swt_passenger]

Given that everything else in the SWT fleet that uses WIPACS has been updated to the newer design, I wouldn't put it past them coming out of Wolverton Works with these fitted.

Is he asking about external or internal lighting though, it isn't clear.

 

[nlogax]

Not sure if this has been asked before, but are there any potential complications with 455s and 456s running together with their (near future) mix of AC and DC traction packages?

 

[JB25]

Is he asking about external or internal lighting though, it isn't clear.

Sorry I mean the external head / marker / tail lights.

 

[edwin_m]

Not sure if this has been asked before, but are there any potential complications with 455s and 456s running together with their (near future) mix of AC and DC traction packages?

Someone will have better knowledge, but I'm pretty sure the new AC traction package software will simulate the existing multiple working interface so they can multi with 455s that still have DC equipment. If so then they would also multi with 456s.

 

[Electrostar]

With the exception of the sole Connex 456 the fleet remained in NSE livery for an awfully long time and certainly looked a mess with peeling paint. The Southern refurbishment gave them a much fresher feel but I noticed the green paint soon faded to quite a different shade than the 455s. I wonder if the red will fare much better?

 

[JB25]

With the exception of the sole Connex 456 the fleet remained in NSE livery for an awfully long time and certainly looked a mess with peeling paint. The Southern refurbishment gave them a much fresher feel but I noticed the green paint soon faded to quite a different shade than the 455s. I wonder if the red will fare much better?

The Green on the 456s was much more noticeably pale. It looked a bit weird sometimes when they were attached to 455s as the green on some almost looked blue.

The 456s should be made into 4 cars in my opinion. I tell you one thing the SWTs overhaul can't come too soon, the interior was seriously depressing when we had them.

 

[user15681]

I'm quite looking forward to see what Wolverton can do with them. They were looking very tired and old by the time they left Southern.

 

[cjmillsnun]

With the exception of the sole Connex 456 the fleet remained in NSE livery for an awfully long time and certainly looked a mess with peeling paint. The Southern refurbishment gave them a much fresher feel but I noticed the green paint soon faded to quite a different shade than the 455s. I wonder if the red will fare much better?

I should think it will. SWT are known for demanding very high standards in their refurbs. The quality of their initial 455 refreshes and conversions from 158 to 159 show what they get.

 

[transmanche]

The 456s should be made into 4 cars in my opinion.

Do you mean just formed into permanently coupled 2+2 units? Or rebuilding two of the carriages to remove the intermediate driving cabs?

 

[swt_passenger]

The 456s should be made into 4 cars in my opinion.

So how does that allow for 10 car trains then, which is the whole point of having them?

 

[JB25]

Do you mean just formed into permanently coupled 2+2 units? Or rebuilding two of the carriages to remove the intermediate driving cabs?

If not removing the driving cabs at least make them open ended so you can pass through them.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

So how does that allow for 10 car trains then, which is the whole point of having them?

See above.

 

[swt_passenger]

If not removing the driving cabs at least make them open ended so you can pass through them.

Too expensive, as pointed out in the Porterbrook 456 brochure linked earlier...

 

[317663]

Too expensive, as pointed out in the Porterbrook 456 brochure linked earlier...

Plus, the 456 would just look terrible

 

[JB25]

I do however think Southern should have made them into 4 car units (minus the driving cabs). They are nice units to drive, can pick up speed quickly, much quicker than the 455s and the brakes are a lot sharper too. But then they are twenty years newer.

 

[455driver]

But then they are twenty years newer.

The 455s were built between 1982 and 1985, the 456s were built in 1990, not exactly 20 years.

The 456s do accelerate better because of their GTO chopper control though.

 

[JB25]

The 455s were built between 1982 and 1985, the 456s were built in 1990, not exactly 20 years.

The 456s do accelerate better because of their GTO chopper control though.

I was told the 455s were over 40 years old. hock:

 

[nlogax]

I was told the 455s were over 40 years old. hock:

Bit of a mixture, if I understand correctly. 455s first saw the light of day in 1982. In addition, each 455/7 contained a single PEP-derived trailer from the original Class 508s..these were built in 1978-79.

Then there are the traction motors. GEC507s (some?) of which were re-used from mid 1940s 4-SUBs.

 

[arty762]

Pretty sure there is a 456 at Wimbledon train care with SWT livery.

No there isn't .

 

[59CosG95]

No there isn't .

Granted, there is a 456 at Wim, near Wimbledon Park Tube, but it is still in Southern livery (albeit with no Southern logo). When the repaints will happen, and whether they'll get retractioned remains to be seen.