Sold non-discounted ticket, refused refund/change

[Flamingo]

The only places that can issue a refund as far as I know is the seller (who can non-issue a ticket through the same machine), or Head Office/Customer Services (you know what I mean) who might charge £10 depending on circumstances.

I'm sure lots of people will be along soon to correct me.

 

[yorkie]

To be fair its a small, but very vocal and noticeable/memorable, minority.

Though in the London are, I believe it's a bit more than a small minority, but that's another story...!

 

[bb21]

The only places that can issue a refund as far as I know is the seller (who can non-issue a ticket through the same machine), or Head Office/Customer Services (you know what I mean) who might charge £10 depending on circumstances.

I'm sure lots of people will be along soon to correct me.

Oh, it may not be possible as far as technology goes at the moment. I am not disputing that.

But really there is no reason why it cannot be implemented, especially when both ticket offices are operated by the same company.

 

[Flamingo]

It would be a logistical nightmare - and very open to abuse. What would stop any body claiming a refund on every ticket they found on the floor from the nearest ticket seller (or indeed from their own machine)?

 

[jon0844]

Though in the London are, I believe it's a bit more than a small minority, but that's another story...!

Like bad cyclists.

It would be a logistical nightmare - and very open to abuse. What would stop any body claiming a refund on every ticket they found on the floor from the nearest ticket seller (or indeed from their own machine)?

I suppose I can see a potential fraud where you pick up used tickets without a discount, then get them changed to a discounted ticket. Your profit is the difference, although I suspect that there are any number of ways to put a stop to this plan quite quickly.

I can't remember the last time I bought a ticket with cash, which makes it harder to prove that I had at least made a purchase at that location/time for the amount on the ticket. I doubt I'll be buying any ticket for cash again in the future.

 

[bb21]

It would be a logistical nightmare - and very open to abuse. What would stop any body claiming a refund on every ticket they found on the floor from the nearest ticket seller (or indeed from their own machine)?

There will be some concerns, yes, and it will need to be a compromise between a few issues. There is no perfect solution for this, but I don't think that should stand in the way of making it an easier process.

There could be a limit to the number of refunds per given period, for example, and staff discretion should be allowed for less clear cut cases. Of course exact details of these control measures would need to be thought through should there be the desire to implement it. As long as this is made possible, then ticket office staff would at least have the facility should they need it.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

The only places that can issue a refund as far as I know is the seller (who can non-issue a ticket through the same machine), or Head Office/Customer Services (you know what I mean) who might charge £10 depending on circumstances.

I'm sure lots of people will be along soon to correct me.

Lets not confuse refunds with non-issues.

.... but I don't think that should stand in the way of making it an easier process....

I don't think the TOCs would agree with you on this one.

....There could be a limit to the number of refunds per given period, for example, and staff discretion should be allowed for less clear cut cases. Of course exact details of these control measures would need to be thought through should there be the desire to implement it. As long as this is made possible, then ticket office staff would at least have the facility should they need it.

Who will pay for the database to hold the information? Who will monitor and maintain it? Would you have to provide ID to make sure someone else is not using your 'quota'? What would happen if you met your 'quota' and now 'genuinely' needed a refund?

To be fair, I think staff do have enough discretion already, but they do have to be very sure of when they use it. It is fair to say discretion is not as wide spread as it used to be because some people take advantage of it, but it is still there.

 

[bb21]

I don't think the TOCs would agree with you on this one.

But that is down to opinion and attitude.

I don't know which one is right. There may not be a "right" and a "wrong". I just have the inclination that it should be an easier process for such occasions. Such a system may not even need to be called upon often, if clerk error is rare. Perhaps the industry do not feel that passengers being inconvenienced in these situations are significant issues.

Who will pay for the database to hold the information? Who will monitor and maintain it? Would you have to provide ID to make sure someone else is not using your 'quota'? What would happen if you met your 'quota' and now 'genuinely' needed a refund?

If there is a desire to provide this facility, money will be found. It is not a mammoth project. It is only a database, and in all likelihood a small one which would require very minimal maintenance. Perhaps ID should be required when processing such a refund so that if the process is abused then it can be spotted. The "quota" is a virtual concept. It does not have to be limited to the number of refunds. It can be applied to the total amount of refund, or a combination of the two, and/or other measures.

We have computerised ticketing systems, yet we cannot process adjustments to tickets sold at another station, even if running the same system by the same company. That sounds wrong however you look at it. That is also the central issue really that I am getting to. All the talk about "quotas" is all about how this system is used. There could be zero "quota" and every case be left to the clerk in question to decide if so wished.

To be fair, I think staff do have enough discretion already, but they do have to be very sure of when they use it. It is fair to say discretion is not as wide spread as it used to be because some people take advantage of it, but it is still there.

Just because some people abuse these facilities does not mean it should not be provided. There is a balance to be struck somewhere. If you implement a system of this sort, it is inevitable that some people will take advantage and there may be some related monetary losses, but meanwhile you generate goodwill from those who will not be inconvenienced when an issuing error occurs.

Where the balance is, I don't know, and it is not one for me to find. It is just an idea for possible improvements.

 

[jon0844]

GTR has responded to my email (so they did get it, even if they don't send any 'your email has been received' email).

I've been told it's too late to sort now (even if the delay wasn't of my doing) but they're going to refund me as a goodwill gesture - once I email them a scan of my ticket/Gold Card.