ScotRail HST Introduction - Updates & Discussion

[Clansman]

Stirling, Perth and Dundee maybe, but are there sufficient staff to allow this at the smaller stations?

During the day, yes.

 

[GrimShady]

I remember downloading this a few years back. Much better!

 

[physics34]

I remember downloading this a few years back. Much better!

wow, the 170 in that livery looks lovely.

 

[Clansman]

I'm not one for wishful nostalgia but them Westies are a nice touch to the IC livery.

 

[GusB]

I'd like to have seen the HSTs in the old Scotrail livery, but I'd prefer a Stag over a Westie!

 

[BRX]

A simpler solution would be to develop an electronic reservation system for bikes for access both on board and at stations - so you can delegate the duties to station staff for removing/adding bikes in the power cars.

For example;

Stirling, Perth, Pitlochry, Kingussie, Aviemore, Elgin, Inverurie, Dundee, Leuchars

All of the stations above are staffed and most are key interchange points of which trains normally sit for at least 3 minutes at a time upon arrival - sufficient time in my opinion.

Isn't part of the purpose of having a guard on board that they can do this kind of stuff? It doesn't seem terribly onerous to open a door and let someone take a bike in or out. It's what they do on Greater Anglia where you can put your bikes in the DVT. Your supposed to have a compulsory reservation - which makes sense to make sure there's actually space - but in practice they always seem pretty relaxed about it and it seems to work. And those are longer trains than a 4 or 5+2 HST.

 

[route:oxford]

A simpler solution would be to develop an electronic reservation system for bikes for access both on board and at stations - so you can delegate the duties to station staff for removing/adding bikes in the power cars.

For example;

Stirling, Perth, Pitlochry, Kingussie, Aviemore, Elgin, Inverurie, Dundee, Leuchars.

Is the cant part of the can't at these stations?

Wide doors, wide gaps on curved platforms, awkward cant and no stepboard isn't the best of mixes.

 

[jzw95]

Is the cant part of the can't at these stations?



Wide doors, wide gaps on curved platforms, awkward cant and no stepboard isn't the best of mixes.

Virgin currently loads and unloads bikes from HSTs at these stations with no problem. As these routes require reservations for cycles (on both Virgin and ScotRail), the guard knows when to expect someone getting on/off with a bike, and is waiting at the cycle space door. Pretty straight-forward.

 

[route:oxford]

Virgin currently loads and unloads bikes from HSTs at these stations with no problem. As these routes require reservations for cycles (on both Virgin and ScotRail), the guard knows when to expect someone getting on/off with a bike, and is waiting at the cycle space door. Pretty straight-forward.

Not always.

The railway is a weird and wonderful place where what is considerd safe in one workplace is dangerous in another.

More importantly, there are probably quite a few cyclists who are happy that the compartment that is storing their £8000 carbon fibre bike is safely locked until final destination.

 

[47271]

I remember downloading this a few years back. Much better!

Lovely!

Sorry to keep repeating myself on this, but the Scotrail HST power cars should have yellow applied in exactly the way shown in this illustration, with a darker treatment above waist height, and yellow again on top of the cab. That darker bodyside section could be Scotrail blue, a city skyline vinyl or an enormous picture of Elaine C Smith in silhouette, it doesn't matter, but they need the yellow.

It's an important part of the original Kenneth Grange design, and from all angles gives an impression of sleekness and speed lost from all of the post BR liveries. What they've come up with for Scotrail isn't the worst - First Great Western solid blue with a yellow square plonked round the windscreen has to win the prize for most unsympathetic HST power car look - but it still seems like a missed opportunity, especially when it's the last hurrah for this design classic.

I'll stop now!

PS - actually putting buffers on a production HST, as in Grand Central, is the most unsympathetic thing you can do to its appearance, but that's another thing entirely...

 

[jzw95]

More importantly, there are probably quite a few cyclists who are happy that the compartment that is storing their £8000 carbon fibre bike is safely locked until final destination.

The cycle compartment on the VTEC trains is locked, which is why the guard has to be there to load/unload the bikes. People being irritated because they can't get their bike on the train is a much more likely scenario than someone showing up with a hugely expensive bike and then worrying that someone else is going to try and swap their cheaper bike for the expensive one at an intermediate station!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

PS - actually putting buffers on a production HST, as in Grand Central, is the most unsympathetic thing you can do to its appearance, but that's another thing entirely...

You do know why a handful of power cars have buffers, right? It's nothing to do with Grand Central, they just ended up with those ones.

 

[47271]

You do know why a handful of power cars have buffers, right? It's nothing to do with Grand Central, they just ended up with those ones.

Oh yes, I know this particular bit of design vandalism was committed by BR relatively early in the life of the trains - I only mentioned Grand Central because that's where you see the victims now.

Anyway, I said that was going to stop ranting so don't encourage me! [emoji38]

 

[jingsmonty]

It's sort of a reasonable point and not ideal by any means but the 6 bike spaces in the power cars do make up for the overall loss of spaces to a fairly large extent. A lot of the pressure on the HML is from long distance cyclists doing either LEJOG or shorter touring routes in the Highlands out of Inverness. These can all be accommodated in the Power Car provision.

For me I think if they had a slightly more flexible policy that also allowed access to the power car provision at selected key intermediate locations that would probably be enough.

Maybe just Perth, Stirling, Dundee and Aviemore. That would cover nearly all the places with high demand for bike usage and still leave the Guard free to not worry about bikes for most of the journey.

That's a good point. Pretty pointless having extra storage provision if it can't be accessed. Seem to remember that storage for other sporting equipment was mentioned as well (I'm thinking mainly of Skis/Snowboards, etc) -pretty vital to have access to these at Aviemore, I would think. Personally, I'd think that it would have to be advance booking and that the Conductor would be responsible for securing/removing items from power car storage & that the dwell times would have to take account of this...someone at Abellio should have thought this through before now..
Also seems pointless to have locked out toilets that could be used for storage - could use power car storage area for end to end items & any overspill only. Definetly looks like a 'turn up & board' approach won't work though, which is a shame, but needs must. I suppose..

 

[Northhighland]

wow, the 170 in that livery looks lovely.

Not a chance. In modern Scotland everything has to be branded with a Saltire. Any thing else is regarded as treason.

 

[me123]

Not a chance. In modern Scotland everything has to be branded with a Saltire. Any thing else is regarded as treason.

No it doesn't, and no it isn't.

 

[GrimShady]

Given all the BS nationalism we have these days isn't about time the stag and westie made a resurgence?

The saltire livery is livery very, very boring

 

[route:oxford]

Not a chance. In modern Scotland everything has to be branded with a Saltire. Any thing else is regarded as treason.

Not true.

There are no Saltires on, or Gaelic signage for "Job Centre Plus"

 

[me123]

Given all the BS nationalism we have these days isn't about time the stag and westie made a resurgence?

The saltire livery is livery very, very boring

I disagree. I very much like the livery, and it is entirely appropriate for the national rail operator to carry the national flag. It's hardly without precedent: Amtrak trains bear the US flag, and airlines often have their national flag represented (Virgin Atlantic being a notable example of an airline bearing the Union Flag).

I don't have a problem with the stag and westie, but I think the old Scotrail livery is very dated and really shouldn't make a comeback in that form.

 

[physics34]

Not true.

There are no Saltires on, or Gaelic signage for "Job Centre Plus"

lol...or Off Licences either

 

[Northhighland]

I disagree. I very much like the livery, and it is entirely appropriate for the national rail operator to carry the national flag. It's hardly without precedent: Amtrak trains bear the US flag, and airlines often have their national flag represented (Virgin Atlantic being a notable example of an airline bearing the Union Flag).

I don't have a problem with the stag and westie, but I think the old Scotrail livery is very dated and really shouldn't make a comeback in that form.

The wider point is the hijacking of the Saltire by nationalists, it is now everywhere as part of the grievo max agenda along with Gaelic signs, even in parts of Scotland where Gaelic was never spoken. They are trying to create a shortbread tin image of a past utopia that never existed in Scotland.

The Saltire livery is very boring, however as a regular endurer of Scotrail, the colour of the trains is not really relevant, if they were reliable, ran on time, cleaner, offered a better standard of customer service then we might make progress. However none of these things are likely to happen soon.

 

[Rick1984]

As my brother pointed out the Saltire livery is very poorly applied on some trains, such as the class 156, the spotty bit being a very poor vinyl

 

[me123]

The wider point is the hijacking of the Saltire by nationalists, it is now everywhere as part of the grievo max agenda along with Gaelic signs, even in parts of Scotland where Gaelic was never spoken. They are trying to create a shortbread tin image of a past utopia that never existed in Scotland.

So tha national government using the national flag is the problem here? Doesn't just about every government use their own flag for something? :roll:

 

[Carntyne]

The wider point is the hijacking of the Saltire by nationalists, it is now everywhere as part of the grievo max agenda along with Gaelic signs, even in parts of Scotland where Gaelic was never spoken. They are trying to create a shortbread tin image of a past utopia that never existed in Scotland.

The Saltire livery is very boring, however as a regular endurer of Scotrail, the colour of the trains is not really relevant, if they were reliable, ran on time, cleaner, offered a better standard of customer service then we might make progress. However none of these things are likely to happen soon.

Who forces you onto the train every day?

 

[Altnabreac]

Not true.

There are no Saltires on, or Gaelic signage for "Job Centre Plus"

Wrong re Gaelic.
http://www.paperclip.org.uk/lewis/pictures/Lewis2007b079.JPG

 

[GusB]

Source:
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/new-scotrail-trains-english-hand-10188448

ScotRail have been accused of introducing “new” trains – with 10million miles on the clock.

A fleet of refurbished InterCity 125 trains will come into service on routes from Glasgow and Edinburgh to Inverness and Aberdeen next year.

The 26 high-speed trains date back 40 years. They were introduced by British Rail in 1977.

Having travelled about 1000 miles a day, they have now each covered about 10million miles.

The InterCity 125s are being used by Great Western *Railway in England, where replacement electric stock is being phased in.

They are being leased for 12 years by Dutch operators Abellio, who will spend £54million refurbishing them...

I'm guessing it must be a slow news day at Record HQ. For how long has this information been in the public domain?

 

[ainsworth74]

Couple of years!

 

[me123]

40 year old trains in a bit of a "Trigger's Broom" kind of way. Most of each carriage will be much newer than that, and the upcoming refurb will bring them to a high standard.

Slow news day for the Record.

 

[47271]

Get used to it. Every time there's a minor aircon fault, the tea trolley wobbles or a light flickers on a Scotrail HST, the age of the stock will get trotted out by the usual suspects...

 

[jopsuk]

what will (after the work for Scotrail) still be 40 years old? Body/chassis, couplers, bogies?