Royal Mail Trains

[Adam0984]

Just seen the Shieldmuir to Warrington Mail train pass through Preston and it got my thinking is the mail sorted on the train as it used to be or is it purely just transporting to be sorted at its destination?

 

[Elecman]

Just transports mail now unmanned except the driver

 

[Adam0984]

Thought so. With Royal Mail cut backs and better sorting technology at the depots makes it a costly exercise

 

[Greenback]

The last TPO's ran almost ten years ago now didn't they?

 

[CallySleeper]

The last TPO's ran almost ten years ago now didn't they?

Final TPOs ran on 9/1/04.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Over ten years ago now! "The last TPO services ran on the night of 9 January 2004" according to the postal heritage website.

 

[Greenback]

Good grief, longer than I thought, how time flies!

I don't suppose anyone here ever worked on a TPO? I worked for the Royal Mail myself in the 80's and 90's, but never fancied applying to work on them. The night work put me off, as I was young then and very keen on socialising!

 

[jopsuk]

Indeed. The way the mail is sorted now does not fit with the way the TPOs operated. As far as I can tell (wikipedia and cross referencing) TPOs ceased with all mail traffic whatsoever (there were also simple mail transport trains, hauled and Class 325) in 2004, but the 325s were brought back out of store by Christmas that year, which continues. Almost all just on the WCML.

For those that know more: from pictures it looks like the 325s still have shoe beams but no actual 3rd rail shoes? I guess if they do need to head to kent they just get hauled?

 

[Greenback]

In my view, the fact that the dedicated TPO vehicles were old and needed to be replaced was a big factor in Royal Mail ceasing their operations. This was probably brought forward a few years due to declining mail volumes, but it would happened sooner rather than later anyway.

The other big factor was investment in new technology, which meant it was increasingly cost effective to centralise operations into fewer, bigger mail centres.

 

[GatwickDepress]

I recall seeing a 325 at Tonbridge's old postal platform, having come from Willesden, around 2003ish, though I have no idea how long those services lasted...a few months?

I guess the third rail shoes are removed since there's no regular services anymore; it wouldn't be cost-efficient to keep the shoes on?

 

[carriageline]

How many trains run out of stonebridge? I seem to remember the signaller saying about 4 a day?

 

[33056]

How many trains run out of stonebridge? I seem to remember the signaller saying about 4 a day?

6 in total, 1F00 / 1A91 to and from Warrington, 1S96 / 1A97 to and from Shieldmuir / Warrington and 1E06 / 1M80 to and from Low Fell.

The 325 unit service to Tonbridge did not last as long as the WCML and ECML services worked by these units but it was a lot longer than a few months (five or six years at a guess).

 

[matt]

Three based on what ran yesterday. 1 to Warrington, 1 to Sheildmuir and 1 to Low Fell

 

[Mugby]

I wonder how long they'll last now that Royal Mail is privatised!

 

[BantamMenace]

Privatisation will bring environment accounting to the fore as well as financial accounting so if it comes down to a couple of pence in it between road and rail, rail will prevail.

Whether it will even come close financially is a whole different kettle of fish

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Good grief, longer than I thought, how time flies!

I don't suppose anyone here ever worked on a TPO? I worked for the Royal Mail myself in the 80's and 90's, but never fancied applying to work on them. The night work put me off, as I was young then and very keen on socialising!

A guy I work with used to drive the mail trains out of Stonebridge Park back in the day. We were talking about them once and he said they were a pain in the backside because it wasn't unknown for TPO's to pull the communication cord to stop the train and add a few minutes delay if they were falling behind with their work. I'm sure it didn't happen as regularly as he was implying (mess room bravado and all that) but it must have been annoying when it did happen.

 

[mr williams]

I'm sure that some of you living on the Cardiff-Crewe line in the 1970s might well have travelled on a TPO, as it had a couple of passenger carriages in the consist and formed a scheduled service to Crewe, leaving Cardiff at around 20.00 with the return departure from Crewe at about 01.30. IIRC it only called at Newport, Pontypool, Abergavenny, Hereford and Shrewsbury (Cwmbran wasn't open in those days).

I specifically remember one of the mail carriages had a postbox so you could, in theory, post a letter from the platform!

 

[ExRes]

A guy I work with used to drive the mail trains out of Stonebridge Park back in the day. We were talking about them once and he said they were a pain in the backside because it wasn't unknown for TPO's to pull the communication cord to stop the train and add a few minutes delay if they were falling behind with their work. I'm sure it didn't happen as regularly as he was implying (mess room bravado and all that) but it must have been annoying when it did happen.

I know everyone has their own unique and personal experiences but in 6 years of pre and post Stonebridge work I only ever had the cord pulled on me once, overheating on my 90 hauled Up NETPO filtering back to the coaches making them think that there was a fire onboard, any contact required was normally made by the cab to coach telephone. Any deliberate messing about would have been reported to Control due to the massive late running fines

 

[33056]

In it's heyday, the PPM figures for mail trains were far better than any of the TOCs, usually 95% or more.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I specifically remember one of the mail carriages had a postbox so you could, in theory, post a letter from the platform!

You could; I sent myself a postcard through this means once in order to get the special postmark. Still got it somewhere... For the message I wrote the date, place and the full formation of the train.

 

[Beveridges]

In it's heyday, the PPM figures for mail trains were far better than any of the TOCs, usually 95% or more.

So much for the comments in that other thread about "unreliable 47s" leading to the loss of mail on rail.

It was the best performing service the railway had and was probably 2 or 3x faster than road.

 

[transmanche]

In it's heyday, the PPM figures for mail trains were far better than any of the TOCs, usually 95% or more.

I recall this being highlighted by the press at the time: in particular that the claim of 'poor reliability' was a sham.

 

[Greenback]

A guy I work with used to drive the mail trains out of Stonebridge Park back in the day. We were talking about them once and he said they were a pain in the backside because it wasn't unknown for TPO's to pull the communication cord to stop the train and add a few minutes delay if they were falling behind with their work. I'm sure it didn't happen as regularly as he was implying (mess room bravado and all that) but it must have been annoying when it did happen.

I'm not saying it never happened, but I'm sure that this was very rare. I think that the mail staff may have got away with it once or twice in a blue moon by claiming it was accidental, but any regular abuse of the communication cord would not have bene tolerated by either party.

I specifically remember one of the mail carriages had a postbox so you could, in theory, post a letter from the platform!

I believe that all the TPO services had posting facilities right to the end.

I recall this being highlighted by the press at the time: in particular that the claim of 'poor reliability' was a sham.

I remember articles in railway magazines during the 1980's and 1990's. It seem,ed that every time the mail carrying contract wa sup for renewal, Royal Mail claimed the trains were unreliable. BR always countered with figures showing that they were very reliable! All part of the negotiating game!

 

[glbotu]

I was at Newcastle this weekend and there was a 325 in one of the sidings, just after the Team Valley trading estate (heading into town), is that where it lives, or was it in some sort of special use?

 

[Beveridges]

Royal Mail claimed the trains were unreliable

Yet Roads are reliable ?

Or do they just allow hours of extra time in the schedule when it goes by road for inevitable delays / motorways coming to standstill in rush hour & following accidents which happen every day / motorway engineering works & diversions - the list is endless. Roads are a pain.

 

[transmanche]

I was at Newcastle this weekend and there was a 325 in one of the sidings, just after the Team Valley trading estate (heading into town), is that where it lives, or was it in some sort of special use?

That's sounds like where the mail sorting/distribution centre is. (Red blob on the map.) It has its own siding/platform.

 

[Beveridges]

I can confirm Royal Mail was 95% reliable as I used to do regular trainspotting at Warrington / Stafford back in the good old days, and the mail trains were damn reliable. They would appear exactly on time around 95% of the time.

 

[Freightmaster]

I was at Newcastle this weekend and there was a 325 in one of the sidings, just after the Team Valley trading estate (heading into town), is that where it lives, or was it in some sort of special use?

That's the terminal known in railway terms as "Low Fell RMT" (Royal Mail Terminal);
there is a nightly train from there to/from London.

MARK

 

[Carlisle]

In it's heyday, the PPM figures for mail trains were far better than any of the TOCs, usually 95% or more.

Yes I'm sure that's right as I did hear of a few occasions when a virgin train was held somewhere on the WCML to let the TPO fly past :roll:

 

[Beveridges]

Yes I'm sure that's right as I did hear of a few occasions when a virgin train was held somewhere on the WCML to let the TPO fly past :roll:

I remember trainspotting at Wigan in the late 1990's. At around 19:00 an 87-hauled Virgin West Coast Express to Glasgow when 'on time' was always put into the back platform (Plat. 6) to let a mere 4-car Mail train overtake! The mail was always on time to the minute.