Reform UK discussion

[nw1]

I think there are things that can happen (listed a, b and c in my last post) that can prevent it. But none of that is currently happening right now, or happening enough. So as of typing this right now, with Farage still the leader, I think it's unfortunately what we're currently heading towards.

Another thing that is going in Reform's favour at the moment is just how much they're being talked about, especially in the mainstream media and on social media. I see Reform related content on social media everywhere without even trying to look for it, but very little, for example, Lib-Dem content. This forum is an example. We're up to 26 pages now about Reform, nothing for Lib-Dems. Now imagine that kind of ratio of discussion levels replicated on other sites or social media and suddenly the visibility or spotlight of Reform is glaringly more obvious.

Imagine the current rise/fascination/coverage of Reform like this. 2 people walk into a shop and you're behind the counter.

One customer calmly walks in, gets what they needs, smiles to you and asks how you are, pays and leaves calmly and you've known them for years.

The other is a new customer to the shop. They speak really loudly and are in a very energetic mood. They're talking to anyone they can telling whatever they want to whoever will listen, they do a little dance or scream when they realise no one in the shop is giving them attention and then when they pay, they tell you that you did a great job before making a grand over the top exit.

Which person are you going to pay more attention to as they walk around the shop? Which person is going to get noticed more by the other customers in the shop? Which person is more likely to say or do something that gets their behaviour posted on social media?

In case anyone was wondering and didn't figure it out, the first customer is practically everyone else in politics. The new customer is Reform/Farage.

But do people like the new customer? They would come across as annoying to me.

As I have stated several times I suspect a lot of people are complacent due to the election likely being in 4 years' time and if things don't change, there will be a lot more action.

On the other hand, things could change and it could just be a rather bizarre mid-2020s fashion. As recently as the winter, Labour and the Tories were vying for first place in the polls. Remember the SDP bubble in the early 80s? Came to nothing.

 

[styles]

But will that kind of pessimism not be self-defeating?

Do you honestly think we are condemned to 5 years of Reform and there is absolutely nothing we can do about it? Do you not have any form of hope or optimism at all? Do you honestly think that we're screwed until at least 2034? (Which for some of us is much of the rest of our working life, which is a grim prospect indeed).

...

If people think we're screwed, then we will just crawl into our shells and do absolutely nothing. We need hope.

Only if we let it be. I guess my question is - what are you going to do about it, personally?

I do take the time to write to my MP/MSP/councillor, sign petitions, go on protest marches, even take part in what XR would call 'spicy' action with a risk of arrest. Maybe you do some of this too. But I am in all honesty not the person to rally thousands of people to either protest the negative actions of Reform, or support the positive actions of another party (which ought to be Labour but they're being rubbish).

Unless there is mass campaigning within other parties to change their policies and their communication, or rebellion on the streets to make clear what change we want, it's not going to come; and Reform will plug that gap by quite rightly pointing to the uselessness of Labour and Conservatives.

Do you really not think that people will start realising that, despite our problems, at least the UK is a liberal democracy at the moment and voting in a party which is not exactly middle-of-the-road or moderate, and has a leadership that doesn't come across as particularly professional, is a huge risk to our way of life? I do note that small-c conservatives often talk about "preserving the British way of life" and to me, preserving the British way of life is best attained by voting in tried and trusted parties.

I actually think there's a generation of voters who want a leader who isn't 'professional'. Starmer might've won votes on the basis people are sick of the chaos of the last few Conservative and Conservative/LibDem coalition governments, but he's hardly inspiring. People are holding their noses voting for him, across the political spectrum. Outlandish Instagrammers and politicians are popular, much as I dislike it. To beat them you need to be at least mildly charismatic.

It is early days though. I suspect many feel that 4 years is a long way in the future and if we're still in the same position in 2 years' time, when the election will be a lot closer, or even in one year's time, there will be a lot more urgency. At the moment people are perhaps a bit complacent, but I suspect that will change.

Also there are no significant anti-Reform protest groups, so unless you're the kind of person with "leader" qualities (and we're not all like that, let's be honest) there isn't a whole lot we can do right now other than talk to potential Reform voters to dissuade them (and I don't know any personally in any case). That's my own feeling, certainly.

Until there is a significant "anti" movement there isn't a lot we can do. But I suspect that "anti" movement will arise as the urgency of the situation increases.

I do think that, unlike Brexit where people did get complacent and thought Remain would gain more votes easily, a lot of us - right now - are genuinely frightened of a Reform win and this will only increase in the next four years. This is where I think the situation and the Brexit referendum differ.

Plus the Trump factor of course. The next election will presumably be just after Trump leaves power and there will be a sense of "thank God that's over" amongst many. After four years of Trump will we really want to bring in a cheap and nasty, imitation BritTrump here in the UK?

Also another unknown is the Tory factor. What if they get a leader which causes people to swing back to them? People thought the Tories were finished in the 2019 EU elections... and then along came Boris.

I do think there are plenty of strands of hope and it's not at all helpful to get into self-defeating pessimism this far out from the next election. For one thing the prospect of the country being screwed for most of the next 10 years does one's mental health no good at all.

It is early days, and I'm not going to try and call an election result 4 years in advance. But I'm confident that if Labour don't sort themselves out, the next election is going to be a shambles, and not deliver a result you or I would want.

Yes hopefully the end of Trump's second term will leave people craving stability, but an inspiring yet capable party and leader need to be present for that still. Also keeping with the theme of not predicting things 4 years away, we don't know what Trump's legacy will be. Sure it wasn't enough for him to win a consecutive term, but clearly the American people didn't find him so reprehensible that they wouldn't vote him back in again, because they've done just that.

I do think it all really comes back to what people are going to do themselves though.

Starmer left to his own devices will continue to be ineffectual and uninspiring. Badenoch will continue to make weird remarks to win over Reform voters and slag off Labour to keep up the Labour-Tory pantomime people are bored of now. Meanwhile Farage will continue to brush off dodgy councillors as exceptions and harp on about boats in the Channel and waste in the NHS, and probably do quite well out of it.

We can't leave these things to political parties because clearly the larger parties have lost focus, and the smaller parties need miracles to reach the critical mass required to overcome first-past-the-post. Alas, most people will like carry on complaining from the sidelines. If that happens, then yes, I'm pessamistic.

 

[nw1]

Only if we let it be. I guess my question is - what are you going to do about it, personally?

If there was more of an anti-Reform movement I would get involved. But at the moment there isn't. My feeling is that there will if the situation doesn't change soon and people start getting seriously worried about the next election.

I am not the "leader" type who can kick-start protest movements, sadly.

I do take the time to write to my MP/MSP/councillor, sign petitions, go on protest marches, even take part in what XR would call 'spicy' action with a risk of arrest. Maybe you do some of this too. But I am in all honesty not the person to rally thousands of people to either protest the negative actions of Reform, or support the positive actions of another party (which ought to be Labour but they're being rubbish).

Unless there is mass campaigning within other parties to change their policies and their communication, or rebellion on the streets to make clear what change we want, it's not going to come; and Reform will plug that gap by quite rightly pointing to the uselessness of Labour and Conservatives.



I actually think there's a generation of voters who want a leader who isn't 'professional'. Starmer might've won votes on the basis people are sick of the chaos of the last few Conservative and Conservative/LibDem coalition governments, but he's hardly inspiring. People are holding their noses voting for him, across the political spectrum. Outlandish Instagrammers and politicians are popular, much as I dislike it. To beat them you need to be at least mildly charismatic.

Which is strange as I, personally, have had quite enough of charismatic politicians to last a lifetime. I crave the days of dull but stable politicians like Major and Brown, even May. There is a caveat there - if Boris can save us from Reform, I'd be willing to have him back, much as I am no fan of his.

It is early days, and I'm not going to try and call an election result 4 years in advance. But I'm confident that if Labour don't sort themselves out, the next election is going to be a shambles, and not deliver a result you or I would want.

Yes hopefully the end of Trump's second term will leave people craving stability, but an inspiring yet capable party and leader need to be present for that still. Also keeping with the theme of not predicting things 4 years away, we don't know what Trump's legacy will be. Sure it wasn't enough for him to win a consecutive term, but clearly the American people didn't find him so reprehensible that they wouldn't vote him back in again, because they've done just that.

True, but in retrospect Trump I was perhaps not as bad as all that. Trump II is a car-crash in slow motion. I suspect a lot of people went for him because they'd lived through, and understood, Trump I. Our next election will be following Trump II and all the chaos that is ensuing.

I do think it all really comes back to what people are going to do themselves though.

Starmer left to his own devices will continue to be ineffectual and uninspiring. Badenoch will continue to make weird remarks to win over Reform voters and slag off Labour to keep up the Labour-Tory pantomime people are bored of now.

On the other hand can we assume that Badenoch, or even Starmer, will be leaders in the run-up to the next election. I suspect Badenoch will go; not sure about Starmer.

Meanwhile Farage will continue to brush off dodgy councillors as exceptions and harp on about boats in the Channel and waste in the NHS, and probably do quite well out of it.

Perhaps, I'm more optimistic that four years is plenty of time for their reputation to be tarnished.

We can't leave these things to political parties because clearly the larger parties have lost focus, and the smaller parties need miracles to reach the critical mass required to overcome first-past-the-post. Alas, most people will like carry on complaining from the sidelines. If that happens, then yes, I'm pessamistic.

Could something similar to France last year happen I wonder? The left organised and prevented the hard-right from gaining the premiership. Or are we just less politically active than France as a nation?

 

[jon0844]

Following discussions on here, Jenrick comes across as someone who puts on a hard-right act to attempt to appeal to certain people, rather than a hard-right ideologue. He was a Remainer of all things originally, believe it or not.

People lurching to the right usually do so because there's a lot of money to be made*. Most people are grifting, but once they're onboard they're not easily going to change course - especially as they may well run the risk of being severely harmed politically by turning against those who helped them. Look at Liz Truss and Nigel Farage bigging it up with the Republicans and being guest speakers at Turning Point USA and other events. It's especially useful if you want to set yourself up if and when you're no longer in power.

So someone putting on an act shouldn't be given the benefit of the doubt. They're fully aware of what they're doing, and it is often going to be to the detriment of others.

* Obviously those on the left are paid copious amounts of money by George Soros if you believe every Facebook page out there.

 

[styles]

If there was more of an anti-Reform movement I would get involved. But at the moment there isn't. My feeling is that there will if the situation doesn't change soon and people start getting seriously worried about the next election.

I am not the "leader" type who can kick-start protest movements, sadly.

Yes I am in a similar boat. I am not a "leader" type when it comes to protests and political movements. I do take part in some local action groups though, at least to try and influence local decisions. I find the groups have a decent amount of influence, moreso than the political parties in some cases. But then I see it as a sort of civic duty to get involved in such things.

Much as I despise Russell Brand, his whole, "I don't vote.", thing in his Paxman interview did raise an interesting point about our democracy - people are often so obsessed with the political parties that we don't do anything else to engage in democracy. The parties can't be trusted these days, and a vote once every 5 years in an election run under a broken voting system, really is not that much of a political engagement. If we just wait 4 years for the next general election, and hope our vote will make a difference, we'll be disappointed.

Which is strange as I, personally, have had quite enough of charismatic politicians to last a lifetime. I crave the days of dull but stable politicians like Major and Brown, even May. There is a caveat there - if Boris can save us from Reform, I'd be willing to have him back, much as I am no fan of his.

I agree to an extent, and certainly see where you're coming from. I expect Starmer has done well out of being, frankly, boring. He was more of a 'strong and stable' ticket than May ever was, but without the catchphrase. But I also want a leader with a personality and conviction. Starmer is a weathercock, not a signpost, and this week on the benefits reforms it's really shone. We have to go back over a century to find a backbench rebellion the size Starmer was facing against his welfare reform bill this week - he is evidently not inspiring his party, and I'd suggest he's not inspiring the public either. Instead he's bending to popular opinion. We don't need that. If we wanted that, we'd jus elect the YouGov CEO as Prime Minister and be done with it.

I would like to see somebody with perhaps the personality of William Hague, but the politics of somebody more liberal. He was statesmanlike, in that you could trust him to go to a UN/NATO/G7 meeting and come out solid, and had convictions which he didn't flounder on. He could occasionally make a good quip against Blair. But try finding that in the cabinet or the shadow cabinet.

True, but in retrospect Trump I was perhaps not as bad as all that. Trump II is a car-crash in slow motion. I suspect a lot of people went for him because they'd lived through, and understood, Trump I. Our next election will be following Trump II and all the chaos that is ensuing.

On the other hand can we assume that Badenoch, or even Starmer, will be leaders in the run-up to the next election. I suspect Badenoch will go; not sure about Starmer.

Labour isn't the kind of party to throw their leaders to the pigs at the first sign of trouble. In fact it's practically unheard of in modern times - the typical operation is they stay on to the next election, then lose the election and stand down on that basis. I expect Starmer will lead us into the next election, and in a way, that concerns me. He's going to be up against whatever mediocre candidate the Tories muster up (I agree it's unlikely to be Badenoch), and Farage, who as we've established over the past year, and in fact in his own political career, is actually very capable of winning over the British electorate.

Perhaps, I'm more optimistic that four years is plenty of time for their reputation to be tarnished.

Could something similar to France last year happen I wonder? The left organised and prevented the hard-right from gaining the premiership. Or are we just less politically active than France as a nation?

Maybe. France has a particularly special protest culture which the UK doesn't quite have. I remember in 2012-2013 a students' union officer trying to convince me that we need wildcat strikes to solve the tuition fee crisis. I didn't disagree in principle, but can you really imagine Unison and UCU calling wildcat strikes? I can't, personally. Maybe that's what we need. I'm self-employed, so no union for me, but I could down tools for my client, though they would sue me for a lot of money for doing so I suppose. Let's be honest, I'm not going to do it (I'm too chicken), and I doubt anybody else in this post would either.

I suspect for the UK the answer lies somewhere between the current modus operandi of complaining from the sidelines while occasionally marching down Whitehall with a mixture of Palestine/trade union/anti-Reform banners; and the French approach of calling last-minute strikes and dumping manure on the strategic road network.

 

[jon0844]

I expect Starmer will lead us into the next election, and in a way, that concerns me. He's going to be up against whatever mediocre candidate the Tories muster up (I agree it's unlikely to be Badenoch), and Farage, who as we've established over the past year, and in fact in his own political career, is actually very capable of winning over the British electorate.

I think it's quite likely Farage has an aspiration to throw Reform under the bus and try and take over as leader of the Conservatives if he gets a chance.

 

[The Ham]

Given how a lie is around the world before the truth has got it's boots on, I wonder if the way to dampen support for Reform is for people to say semi believable things about their policies.

For example, "I wonder how much their health insurance is going to cost? If it's £100 a month, I couldn't afford that, how about you? Without paying that there could be a two teir health provision."

By putting a price on it then Reform have to counter it, put a price to their policy and have to explain it more, explain what will be the provision for those not able to pay. However if people were to get quotes for themselves for health insurance from BUPA, Vitality, etc of about that much (or more, especially if they are older and there's a lot of people who are older who support Reform) then they maybe fearful that's how much it'll be.

It doesn't necessarily impact those who support Reform who are younger, who may not be concerned about their health, however £100 a month could be a lot of money for them.

Another one could be, "I think Reform quite like the idea of copying ICE in America where they can take people off the street and deport them without a trail, even if they say they don't in public."

If people were to look into it they would find that it's happening, but again Reform would have to do the work to explain that they don't want to do that, however the last part of the sentence would mean that there's still going to be some doubt that they may still do it.

It's a more risky one, but it would dampen support from those who are not so supportive of that side of things. As would "I wonder if Reform would look at putting those with disabilities to work in exchange for keeping their payments*, it would be so much easier if they were in one place and then there wouldn't be a need for all businesses to cater for them to have access?".

*I deliberately used the word payments, as it may put doubt in the mind of those of retirement age as to if pensions are/aren't included if they get to a point where their health means they need help with things like going up and down stairs.

If you really wanted to you could create a fake social media account and have them day things like "I'm looking forwards to Reform's £100 a month health insurance, as it'll mean I can see a doctor when I want.". "I'm looking forwards to Reform copying the US, let's just deport without trial those who shouldn't be here, if a few tourists get caught too, so be it.". "I'm fed up of disabled people getting all this money, I hope Reform make them work all together so business don't have to do woke things like provide strep free access, that costs businesses lots of money.".

 

[nw1]

I would like to see somebody with perhaps the personality of William Hague, but the politics of somebody more liberal. He was statesmanlike, in that you could trust him to go to a UN/NATO/G7 meeting and come out solid, and had convictions which he didn't flounder on. He could occasionally make a good quip against Blair. But try finding that in the cabinet or the shadow cabinet.

I know what you mean. In fact you have hit the nail on the head there - we don't have much in the way of statesperson-like politicians nowadays.

And Reform will certainly not be statesperson-like, in my opinion. "Bringing the UK into disrepute" would IMO be understatement of the century. Nobody would take us seriously, though various countries would probably try to exploit us. This is why I think the so-called patriots needs to think long and hard about support for them. Will they really give the UK a good image?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Jun 2025 ==

Maybe. France has a particularly special protest culture which the UK doesn't quite have. I remember in 2012-2013 a students' union officer trying to convince me that we need wildcat strikes to solve the tuition fee crisis. I didn't disagree in principle, but can you really imagine Unison and UCU calling wildcat strikes? I can't, personally. Maybe that's what we need. I'm self-employed, so no union for me, but I could down tools for my client, though they would sue me for a lot of money for doing so I suppose. Let's be honest, I'm not going to do it (I'm too chicken), and I doubt anybody else in this post would either.

True though the French instance I was specifically referring to was how the general Left came together rather quickly this time last year to prevent RN gaining control of parliament by providing an alternative to the RN for those who did not support Macron. I wonder whether we need a new left/centre political movement here which is quite populist but neither authoritarian nor xenophobic nor transphobic. Such a movement could potentially take votes from Reform (as well as Labour).

I suspect for the UK the answer lies somewhere between the current modus operandi of complaining from the sidelines while occasionally marching down Whitehall with a mixture of Palestine/trade union/anti-Reform banners; and the French approach of calling last-minute strikes and dumping manure on the strategic road network.

I agree things need to ramp up and become more focused. We do of course still need Palestine protests IMO, but they need to be separate. Focused protests for specific issues, not generic protests on about 10 different things.
But I would be amazed that if we are still in the same position in a year or two, there are not large, and targeted, anti-Reform protests.

One problem we have in this country is we make our protests a bit too late. To take two examples where I was an active participant: anti-austerity protests after Cameron II got in, and anti-Brexit protests after the referendum (though admittedly given Brexit hadn't happened, they could still have had the desired effect).

This time though I think it will be different. People were not worrying about Brexit in 2012, or even in 2015 when the referendum was in the Tory manifesto. People are worrying about Reform in 2025, so I would be amazed not to see frequent targeted mass protests in two years' time if the situation has not improved. I'd like to think that there would be the occasional general strike too, especially in areas with Reform councils - but I'm not sure if that's in the UK culture. We'll see, I guess.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Jun 2025 ==

Given how a lie is around the world before the truth has got it's boots on, I wonder if the way to dampen support for Reform is for people to say semi believable things about their policies.

Could be a good strategy. I think we need non-partisan groups to mount such campaigns.

Anyway I think I'm going to take my leave of this thread for a while now as an active participant - the whole thing is not doing my mental wellbeing much good, though I am still hopeful of a few things:

a) an active protest movement will be in place before too long if the situation does not improve;
b) both partisan and, perhaps more importantly, non-partisan groups will start mounting online campaigns to attack them;
c) poor performance, or possible authoritarian behaviour, in councils will have a significant effect;
d) perhaps this is a bubble and as the election approaches, people will seek security and stability and thus gravitate back towards the tried-and-tested parties;
e) the actions of Trump might persuade people not to vote for them if he carries on in the same way he has been doing for the remaining 3.5 years;
f) maybe a new populist movement of the left and/or centre will arise and take votes from Reform;
g) maybe the Tories will choose an effective leader. While I am no Tory, they are a route out of this mess.

As I said I think people are complacent now but in two years' time, or even one year's time, they won't be and we'll see much more of a sense of urgency as the election comes closer. Remember this Reform love-in is a new thing, it's only come about since April - people haven't had much time to react yet. As recently as the winter the polls were basically showing a Labour/Tory tussle for first place.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Love a good spreadsheet, thanks (in advance)

Here you go. I actually think the programme makers have done a decent job getting the balance right with the MPs they've had on Question Time. You could argue Reform are underrepresented compared to their share of the vote, and the SNP and Plaid are overrepresented but that's just small sample sizes and having a nationalist when the programme is in Scotland / Wales. The Tories are hugely over represented, but I think that's more a question of wanting a representative of the official opposition than anything else



The real issue is the non-MP panellists:

2 of those 3 series were BEFORE the last general election, so what was the representation of Reform on QT at that point best compared to? the Polls? UKIP at previosu election?

All of these are since the election - first one was September 2024.

 

[SteveP29]

I think there are things that can happen (listed a, b and c in my last post) that can prevent it. But none of that is currently happening right now, or happening enough. So as of typing this right now, with Farage still the leader, I think it's unfortunately what we're currently heading towards.

A) Another thing that is going in Reform's favour at the moment is just how much they're being talked about, especially in the mainstream media and on social media. I see Reform related content on social media everywhere without even trying to look for it, but very little, for example, Lib-Dem content. This forum is an example. We're up to 26 pages now about Reform, nothing for Lib-Dems. Now imagine that kind of ratio of discussion levels replicated on other sites or social media and suddenly the visibility or spotlight of Reform is glaringly more obvious.

B) Imagine the current rise/fascination/coverage of Reform like this. 2 people walk into a shop and you're behind the counter.

One customer calmly walks in, gets what they needs, smiles to you and asks how you are, pays and leaves calmly and you've known them for years.

The other is a new customer to the shop. They speak really loudly and are in a very energetic mood. They're talking to anyone they can telling whatever they want to whoever will listen, they do a little dance or scream when they realise no one in the shop is giving them attention and then when they pay, they tell you that you did a great job before making a grand over the top exit.

Which person are you going to pay more attention to as they walk around the shop? Which person is going to get noticed more by the other customers in the shop? Which person is more likely to say or do something that gets their behaviour posted on social media?

In case anyone was wondering and didn't figure it out, the first customer is practically everyone else in politics. The new customer is Reform/Farage.

A) Lib- Dems are very much not a threat to the country, they don't espouse extreme views or solutions to common everyday problems. Reform threaten everything this country has been rebuilt on since 1945 and yes, before anyone says anything, I know successive Governments since 1979 have taken advantage of this and the population, allowing situations to form where we are squeezed more and more for what remains of what they are paid.

B) I would hope that the customer never came into the shop again while I was on shift, I certainly wouldn't indulge his/ her attention craving.

 

[sor]

Flags again.

Warwickshire council boss vetoed Reform's Pride Flag removal request

Reform UK accuses Warwickshire council's chief executive of a "coup d'etat" in a Pride flag row.

www.bbc.co.uk

Reform UK has accused Warwickshire County Council's chief executive of a "coup d'etat" in a row over removing a Progress Pride flag.
Zia Yusuf, head of Reform's department of government efficiency, made the claim after Monica Fogarty refused to remove the flag before the end of Pride month from outside the council's Shire Hall headquarters in Warwick.
Acting Reform Warwickshire leader George Finch wrote to the council's chief executive asking for the flag, which includes the colours of the trans rights movement and traditional rainbow colours, to be removed.
But the chief executive refused the request, stating in an email response to Finch that she was responsible for such decisions.

It seems the teenager and reform councillor who is acting leader of Warwickshire Council (the former leader recently resigned citing health concerns) thinks that he can impose Reform's flag edict by email. The CEO has rightly pushed back, stating that she will not make any changes until an actual policy is formulated and approved by councillors. Of course this has riled up Yusuf, Farage and their social media hangers on. I suspect it couldn't be because Reform have only 22 out of 57 councillors and it's not certain that they'd get it through a vote.

I suppose we'd see more of this if they got into power at Westminster.

 

[jon0844]

Flags again.

Warwickshire council boss vetoed Reform's Pride Flag removal request

Reform UK accuses Warwickshire council's chief executive of a "coup d'etat" in a Pride flag row.

www.bbc.co.uk

It seems the teenager and reform councillor who is acting leader of Warwickshire Council (the former leader recently resigned citing health concerns) thinks that he can impose Reform's flag edict by email. The CEO has rightly pushed back, stating that she will not make any changes until an actual policy is formulated and approved by councillors. Of course this has riled up Yusuf, Farage and their social media hangers on. I suspect it couldn't be because Reform have only 22 out of 57 councillors and it's not certain that they'd get it through a vote.

I suppose we'd see more of this if they got into power at Westminster.

Good to see they're focussing on the important things.

But at least they didn't get physical.

Reform's Amanda Clare charged with assault and criminal damage

The councillor has been charged in connection with an incident at a Pride event, police said.

www.bbc.co.uk

Reform UK councillor Amanda Clare has been charged with assault and criminal damage after an incident at a Pride event.

The councillor who represents the Winsford Dene ward on Cheshire West and Chester Council, is to appear before magistrates in Crewe on Friday 8 August.

Cheshire Police said they were called to reports of a disturbance at Winsford Pride at around 16:30 BST on Saturday, where they arrested Ms Clare, who is known as Mandy Clare.

Ms Clare, 54, from Malpas, has been bailed pending her court appearance.

(There's video showing she punched someone at the event)

 

[m0ffy]

I smell a rat here. Pride Month finished yesterday and it’s likely the council is about to take its pride flag down anyway. This spat feels well timed to be able to claim “victory”.

 

[sor]

Good to see they're focussing on the important things.

But at least they didn't get physical.

(There's video showing she punched someone at the event)

Reminiscent of UKIP MEPs having a punchup in the European Parliament.

I smell a rat here. Pride Month finished yesterday and it’s likely the council is about to take its pride flag down anyway. This spat feels well timed to be able to claim “victory”.

True, though the email from the CEO points out that they are currently flying the Armed Forces Flag (I believe this is not an official flag of the MoD but presumably a way to show support) and perhaps most importantly for Reform, the Ukraine flag replaced the pride flag over the weekend. Both would presumably go against the revised Reform flag edict which IIRC only allows the UK flag, St George's flag and the relevant county flag.

 

[styles]

Reminiscent of UKIP MEPs having a punchup in the European Parliament.

True, though the email from the CEO points out that they are currently flying the Armed Forces Flag (I believe this is not an official flag of the MoD but presumably a way to show support) and perhaps most importantly for Reform, the Ukraine flag replaced the pride flag over the weekend. Both would presumably go against the revised Reform flag edict which IIRC only allows the UK flag, St George's flag and the relevant county flag.

Lee Anderson was asked about the Armed Forces flag when this flag policy was proposed and did the usual brushing off of the issue saying something like it's absolute nonsense and we only want to get rid of political flags like rainbow flags. It made no sense. That was a GB News interviewer pulling him up on that as well!

 

[Ant1966]

Here you go. I actually think the programme makers have done a decent job getting the balance right with the MPs they've had on Question Time. You could argue Reform are underrepresented compared to their share of the vote, and the SNP and Plaid are overrepresented but that's just small sample sizes and having a nationalist when the programme is in Scotland / Wales. The Tories are hugely over represented, but I think that's more a question of wanting a representative of the official opposition than anything else

View attachment 182867

The real issue is the non-MP panellists:

View attachment 182868



All of these are since the election - first one was September 2024.

Ah, sorry, my bad. Didnt realise they had series so often!

 

[Harpo]

It’s not quite burning books, but it’s getting bloody close. Another warning from history, from Reform.

A council has removed all transgender-related books from the children's sections of its libraries, its leader has said.

In a post on social media, Kent County Council leader Linden Kemkaran said the books were to be removed with immediate effect in a "victory for common sense in Kent".

Paul Webb, Reform UK's communities portfolio holder who oversees libraries, said the move came after a "concerned member of the public" contacted him.

Backlash after trans books removed from children's library section

KCC says the move came after a "concerned member of the public" contacted them.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[SuspectUsual]

It’s not quite burning books, but it’s getting bloody close. Another warning from history, from Reform.

Backlash after trans books removed from children's library section

KCC says the move came after a "concerned member of the public" contacted them.

www.bbc.co.uk

It's now being widely reported that the statement that these books were in the children's section of the library is a lie. You just can't trust Reform

 

[alex397]

As soon as books start being banned by authorities (and not just quietly banned, but with fanfare) it is a real cause for concern. Shame on them.
But not really surprising from those hateful people who are only interested in publicity and stirring up trouble.

 

[AlterEgo]

It's now being widely reported that the statement that these books were in the children's section of the library is a lie. You just can't trust Reform

It wouldn’t matter anyway. It’s probably where those books would have been most useful.

 

[burneside]

It's now being widely reported that the statement that these books were in the children's section of the library is a lie. You just can't trust Reform

Where is it being widely reported? I can only see news stories online that repeat the claim that the books were removed from the children's section.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Where is it being widely reported? I can only see news stories online that repeat the claim that the books were removed from the children's section.

If you look at the tweet I’ve linked below, you can see that:

(1) the books weren’t in the children’s section at all

(2) the library record for each of them shows them categorised as adult non-fiction

https://x.com/reformexposed/status/1940714523117126095?s=46&t=_YJpC0NnDFgt_77zD1Eteg

(Link to tweet from the Reform Exposed account fact checking the original claim)

 

[brad465]

Another Reform UK MP no longer has the whip; James McMurdoch rescinded it following a Sunday Times' investigation alleging he took out Covid bounce back loans, to values well above the required turnover for eligibility of the businesses in question:

Reform MP James McMurdock gives up whip over business allegations, party says

James McMurdock denies any wrongdoing over claims relating to pandemic-era loans taken out by his companies.

www.bbc.co.uk

Reform UK MP James McMurdock has given up the party whip after a newspaper raised questions over tens of thousands of pounds worth of loans he took out under a Covid-19 support scheme.
The MP for South Basildon and East Thurrock has denied any wrongdoing, saying all his business dealings prior to entering Parliament were compliant with regulations, but said he asked to have the whip suspended as a "precautionary measure".
The claims published by the Sunday Times, external relate to loans McMurdock took out amounting to £70,000 via two companies.
Reform said it will carry out its own internal investigation and that McMurdock had agreed to "cooperate in full".
Prior to the Sunday Times story being published, the party's chief whip Lee Anderson said McMurdock had informed him he had "removed the party whip from himself pending the outcome of an investigation".
The paper alleged that McMurdock borrowed tens of thousands of pounds under the government's Bounce Back loans scheme, which was designed to help struggling businesses during the Covid-19 pandemic.
The newspaper said the loans were worth a total of £70,000 and were applied for through two companies - JAM Financial Limited and Gym Live Health and Fitness Limited.
JAM Financial Limited is alleged to have taken out the maximum loan of £50,000, a level of loan that required a turnover of at least £200,000.
Gym Live Health and Fitness Limited is alleged to have taken out loans worth £20,000, which would have required a turnover of £80,000.
The newspaper claimed that JAM Financial Limited had no employees and negligible assets until the pandemic, and that Gym Live Health and Fitness Limited was dormant until January 31, 2020.
BBC News understands Reform's internal investigation is likely to be led by someone from outside the party and will take at least a few weeks.
In statement, McMurdock said his business dealings had been assessed by "appropriately qualified professionals" and "absolute compliance was confirmed".
He continued: "As a precautionary measure, and for the protection of ReformUK, I have asked to have the whip suspended temporarily."
McMurdock won his seat last July by just 98 votes, beating Labour into second place and taking the seat from the Conservatives.
A since-deleted profile published on Reform's website quoted McMurdock as saying he worked in business prior to standing for the party, including at the banks Goldman Sachs and Lehman Brothers.
He is the second of the five Reform MPs elected in 2024 who have since lost the party whip, after Rupert Lowe was suspended in March.
That came after the party alleged the Great Yarmouth MP had made "threats of physical violence" against then-chairman Zia Yusuf.
The Crown Prosecution Service later said Lowe would not face criminal charges over the claims, which he called "false" and a "brutal smear campaign". He now sits in the Commons as an independent.
Reform's Sarah Ponchin won the Runcorn by-election in May, taking the party's Commons cohort back to five.
However, McMurdock quitting the party whip means Reform now has four sitting MPs.

 

[317 forever]

Reform might just have peaked and be starting to dip in terms of votes (as well as share in the polls). They have recently lost 2 by-elections, 1 to the LibDems and the other to the Conservatives.

Reform UK lose two council by-elections in England

REFORM UK have lost two council by-elections in England after being forced to defend their seats when the incumbents stood down.

uk.news.yahoo.com

REFORM UK have lost two council by-elections in England after being forced to defend their seats when the incumbents stood down.

At the English local elections in May, Reform won 677 seats across the country, of 1600 that were contested at the vote.

It provided a boost to Nigel Farage’s party’s prospects in the polls. They also polled third in the Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse by-election weeks later, which was won by Scottish Labour.

But, just a few months later, and two seats the party were forced to defend due to swift resignations from two councillors were taken by other parties.



In Durham, the poll was called when Reform’s Andrew Kilburn stood down after just nine days.

After winning the Benfieldside ward in the May 1 elections, Kilburn resigned after it was discovered he already worked for Durham County Council.

Legislation disqualifies council employees from standing as councillors at the same time.

On Thursday July 3, LibDem Terry Rooney (below) won the by-election with 824 votes, beating Labour’s Kevin Early who returned 800 votes. Reform came third with 747 votes.

(Image: JOSHUA NICHOL) "I'm humbled to serve the community where I live and where I grew up,” Rooney said after the result was announced.

"This result confirms that it is only the Liberal Democrats who can beat the Reform Party across County Durham, as both the official opposition group and the strongest electoral force challenging the Reform Party's broken promises."


The by-election is understood to have cost around £22,800.

Rooney added: "I have campaigned for the Reform Party's millionaire backers to pay for the £23,000 of council taxpayers' money they have wasted on this by-election due to their own incompetence nominating an ineligible candidate.

"They must now listen to the people of Consett and Benfieldside and pay back the council taxes that could have been used on play areas, potholes, or helping disabled children."

In Nottinghamshire, Reform UK councillor Desmond Clarke quit just days after winning the local elections and helping the party take control of the local authority.

Reform won 40 of the 66 seats available on Nottinghamshire County Council in May, and will still maintain control of the authority.


And now, the previous Conservative representative for the Newark West division won over Reform with just eight votes.

Keith Girling won with 680 votes, while Reform candidate Caroline Hinds came in second place with 672 votes. Labour placed third with 316 ballots.

Turnout was 21.99 per cent.

Speaking after his win, Girling told the BBC: "It's showing the Conservatives aren't dead. We're alive and kicking and we're going to work hard for our communities.”

He added that the circumstances that led to the by-election definitely had “a bit of an impact”.

"We've knocked on a lot of doors and some of those that voted Reform [in May] were very angry at the fact he resigned," Girling added.

"It's cost about £25,000 to run this election, from a party that said they're going to save money."

 

[Acfb]

Reform might just have peaked and be starting to dip in terms of votes (as well as share in the polls). They have recently lost 2 by-elections, 1 to the LibDems and the other to the Conservatives.

Reform UK lose two council by-elections in England

REFORM UK have lost two council by-elections in England after being forced to defend their seats when the incumbents stood down.

uk.news.yahoo.com

The polls are all over the shop regarding Reform, Survation and Yougov have them only 1/2% ahead of Labour now but other pollsters still have them 5-8% ahead of Labour. Must be quite hard for pollsters to gauge as a lot of current Reform voters probably stayed at home in last year's General election.

 

[Harpo]

The polls are all over the shop regarding Reform, Survation and Yougov have them only 1/2% ahead of Labour now but other pollsters still have them 5-8% ahead of Labour.

And at the end of an absolutely shocking first year for Labour. Four years left for Labour to try and become coherent, competent and maybe even supportive of its traditional target electorate.

 

[styles]

4 years ahead is too early to expect any accurate polling. They do give a general picture of the public's mood, but beyond 'Reform are a bit more popular than Labour', there's nothing to be gleamed from the difference betwen being 2% ahead and 5% ahead 4 years out.

The question is - can Labour turn things around? It would be one thing if they were using their first year to push through unpopular tax changes then 4 years demonstrating an improving economy; but it seems as though they're just fumbling around in the dark, with a weak leader, and firing policy decisions from the hip before thinking about the long-term consequences.

 

[sor]

Reform UK to introduce less stringent ‘common sense’ vetting system for candidates

Exclusive: Party says those who previously failed vetting are ‘strongly encouraged’ to reapply under new criteria

www.theguardian.com

Reform UK has told its members it is introducing a less stringent “common sense” vetting system for would-be candidates after complaints the previous checks were too strict, despite a recent series of controversies linked to the party.

In a message sent to members and also posted by a regional party branch, Nigel Farage’s party said the updated vetting was “more proportionate than before and designed to strike the right balance between party reputation, individual freedom of expression and public confidence”.


This new system would be seen as “a blank slate”, said the message to members, seen by the Guardian, adding: “If you have previously failed vetting, you are strongly encouraged to reapply under the new standards.”

They had a candidate that was disqualified because he worked for the council he wished to seek election to - which was apparently only discovered after he had won, thus forcing a by election. If that is the standard of vetting at present, I genuinely don’t know how they can go even lower.

 

[Bald Rick]

excellent. I might apply and try and get in undercover. Surely they won’t check this forum…

 

[Harpo]

Surely they won’t check this forum…

Or anywhere else it seems.