Progress with 345 071 - 345 080

[Peter Sarf]

This isn’t true, there is no access or walking routes, and the sidings are obviously surrounded by two running lines which would be very intensively used. Not all trains are planned to run to OOC anyways, currently the plan is 18tph, although the full 24tph could be possible in the longer term, and so Westbourne Park will still be used for reversing, just not as intensively.

Are there going to be reversing sidings at Old Oak Common ?.
Surely they wil be needed if Westbourne park is no longer used for reversing.
Or does thaat mean services will go even further West than OOC ?.

 

[Horizon22]

This isn’t true, there is no access or walking routes, and the sidings are obviously surrounded by two running lines which would be very intensively used. Not all trains are planned to run to OOC anyways, currently the plan is 18tph, although the full 24tph could be possible in the longer term, and so Westbourne Park will still be used for reversing, just not as intensively.

Also a good place to “turn short”.

It doesn’t seem like CBTC is going to go out that far, so the benefits of auto-reverse in recovering time are lost.

 

[Bigbru]

Are there going to be reversing sidings at Old Oak Common ?.
Surely they wil be needed if Westbourne park is no longer used for reversing.
Or does thaat mean services will go even further West than OOC ?.

Yes, 3 planned reverse sidings at OOC

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Jun 2026 ==

Are there going to be reversing sidings at Old Oak Common ?.
Surely they wil be needed if Westbourne park is no longer used for reversing.
Or does thaat mean services will go even further West than OOC ?.

Yes, 3 planned reverse sidings at OOC

 

[Russel]

Taken from Today Railways Twitter/X

I know they have to do fault free running somewhere, but is Europe's busiest mainline really the best place to do it?

 

[800001]

I know they have to do fault free running somewhere, but is Europe's busiest mainline really the best place to do it?

Well it's where many of the original 345s were tested, along with Greater Anglia 720s and LNWR 730s, so I would say yes it's a good place.

They have Alstom facilities at Wembley.

 

[Russel]

Well it's where many of the original 345s were tested, along with Greater Anglia 720s and LNWR 730s, so I would say yes it's a good place.

They have Alstom facilities at Wembley.

Given how fragile the WCML can be at the best of times, I'm not fully convinced it's the best place to use as a test track.

 

[800001]

Given how fragile the WCML can be at the best of times, I'm not fully convinced it's the best place to use as a test track.

They have used it for milage accumulation for several years. It is nothing new.

They also did the 710s.

Where would you suggest they test them?

 

[Russel]

They have used it for milage accumulation for several years. It is nothing new.

They also did the 710s.

Where would you suggest they test them?

I don't know, maybe milage accumulation doesn't cause much of an issue, but as someone who commutes using the Trent Valley and get's shafted on an almost weekly basis for one reason or another, throwing something else into the mix just seems to be asking for trouble.

 

[Benjwri]

I don't know, maybe milage accumulation doesn't cause much of an issue, but as someone who commutes using the Trent Valley and get's shafted on an almost weekly basis for one reason or another, throwing something else into the mix just seems to be asking for trouble.

Aventras are a tested platform, they’re unlikely to be breaking down or causing trouble for other services, and will be low priority so it’ll be them getting stuck behind other things.

 

[dannyh73]

They have used it for milage accumulation for several years. It is nothing new.

They also did the 710s.

Where would you suggest they test them?

Some of the early Ilford based 345s were tested between Shenfield and Southend Victoria where they can be slotted into the regular timetable quite easily. Same with the GA 720s.

 

[Liam L]

I don't recall seeing people complaining for the last 2 or 3 years when WMR 730s were running up and down the Trent valley between Crewe and Nuneaton six days a week....

 

[Elecman]

I don't recall seeing people complaining for the last 2 or 3 years when WMR 730s were running up and down the Trent valley between Crewe and Nuneaton six days a week....

Quite

 

[Russel]

I don't recall seeing people complaining for the last 2 or 3 years when WMR 730s were running up and down the Trent valley between Crewe and Nuneaton six days a week....

Plenty of comments about the general unreliability of it though.

My point wasn't to suggest that testing stock causes issues, more that the WCML's reliability and resilience can best be described as fragile and adding in things like milage accumulation that could be done elsewhere, simply adds fuel to the fire when things do go wrong.

 

[apinnard]

Plenty of comments about the general unreliability of it though.

My point wasn't to suggest that testing stock causes issues, more that the WCML's reliability and resilience can best be described as fragile and adding in things like milage accumulation that could be done elsewhere, simply adds fuel to the fire when things do go wrong.

Where else would you recommend?

 

[Class15]

Plenty of comments about the general unreliability of it though.

My point wasn't to suggest that testing stock causes issues, more that the WCML's reliability and resilience can best be described as fragile and adding in things like milage accumulation that could be done elsewhere, simply adds fuel to the fire when things do go wrong.

Let’s do it on the Mildmay line then definitely nothing to go wrong there

In all seriousness, the WCML is the best place for it, the slow lines at the London end are not that intensively used and there’s a big Alstom facility at Wembley. Also, the wiring of the Poplar curve means that 345s could get between Old Oak and Wembley under their own power (reversals at Acton and Kensal Green Junction).

 

[Elecman]

These are just latest production models of an existing proven design, plenty of trains have used the WCML in both directions from Crewe for mileage accumulation

 

[Posa]

Should have made these fully longitudinal from the start, no doubt that will happen in future just like they did on the DLR.

Also looking at the promotional videos they've not used any of the upgrades from the 710's (middle door buttons and video screens).

Both seem a bit of an own goal.

 

[Horizon22]

Should have made these fully longitudinal from the start, no doubt that will happen in future just like they did on the DLR.

Also looking at the promotional videos they've not used any of the upgrades from the 710's (middle door buttons and video screens).

Both seem a bit of an own goal.

They’re not going to fundamentally adjust the layout for 10 extra trains on an original 70. Especially as all trains go to all destinations and heavily interwork throughout the day.

As a proportion, there’s hardly any standard seating on an 345 and would probably only add a handful of seats.

 

[BigB]

Should have made these fully longitudinal from the start, no doubt that will happen in future just like they did on the DLR.

Also looking at the promotional videos they've not used any of the upgrades from the 710's (middle door buttons and video screens).

Both seem a bit of an own goal.

Not really.... You'd have a slightly different sub fleet, and a redesign costs money - far better to make more of what in my experience is a good product that does exactly what is required.

No goals were harmed in the making of these units...

 

[NSEWonderer]

Should have made these fully longitudinal from the start, no doubt that will happen in future just like they did on the DLR.

Also looking at the promotional videos they've not used any of the upgrades from the 710's (middle door buttons and video screens).

Both seem a bit of an own goal.

The own goal would be making them fully longitudinal

 

[Peter Sarf]

Should have made these fully longitudinal from the start, no doubt that will happen in future just like they did on the DLR.

Also looking at the promotional videos they've not used any of the upgrades from the 710's (middle door buttons and video screens).

Both seem a bit of an own goal.

I always aim for the seats that give a better view out of the window. To my despair most other people beat me to it !. So the non-Longitudinal seats appear to be more popular.

As for middle door buttons. I feel having 10 out of 70 with a said button would cause more confusion (as the other 60 don't have them) than it solves. Also best not to tinker with a spec as it ads more cost.

If it were for a different route then spec improvements might be more likely - but we do keep adding cost.

 

[Silent]

7:51 Finally. I don't mind aventras but I feel they are too common.

 

[Omnishambles]

Plenty of comments about the general unreliability of it though.

My point wasn't to suggest that testing stock causes issues, more that the WCML's reliability and resilience can best be described as fragile and adding in things like milage accumulation that could be done elsewhere, simply adds fuel to the fire when things do go wrong.

I would also suggest it has proved more helpful by getting rid of those Avanti trains over the next couple of months to give the test runs some nice fast line runs

 

[800001]

I would also suggest it has proved more helpful by getting rid of those Avanti trains over the next couple of months to give the test runs some nice fast line runs

Even if Avanti had not removed some services the test paths would still be there for these trains to do testing.

As they have been for the last several years testing all the other Alstom units.

 

[Benjwri]

Even if Avanti had not removed some services the test paths would still be there for these trains to do testing.

As they have been for the last several years testing all the other Alstom units.

Not to mention 90mph Aventras are not going to be fitting into Avanti’s 125mph paths.

 

[Omnishambles]

Even if Avanti had not removed some services the test paths would still be there for these trains to do testing.

As they have been for the last several years testing all the other Alstom units.

Even further, I would include maybe a few more paths available maybe after today’s Nuneaton incident

 

[800001]

Even further, I would include maybe a few more paths available maybe after today’s Nuneaton incident

That won't even come into play.

The oaths for testing will be all planned and in schedules.

 

[Omnishambles]

That won't even come into play.

The oaths for testing will be all planned and in schedules.

Just spotted them..but never let the facts get in the way of a good Daily Mail story

 

[dragon814]

I have just noticed on Realtime Trains there is a STP showing for tomorrow 15th. 5Q73 12:44 Derby Litchurch Lane to Old Oak Depot.
Guessing that this could be the first of the new 345's being delivered?

 

[800001]

I have just noticed on Realtime Trains there is a STP showing for tomorrow 15th. 5Q73 12:44 Derby Litchurch Lane to Old Oak Depot.
Guessing that this could be the first of the new 345's being delivered?

It was scheduled to be delivered wc 15th so most possibly yes.