Out of court settlement

[bhzs_1234]

Hi,

I have stupidly got myself into a terrible situation and would appreciate any support as I await my letter from the Thameslink.

Around 8 months ago, I got an ok the spot that fine that I paid because I didn't have the right ticket and an expired Railcard. I paid the fine on the spot, but I was in a really bad place mentally due to bereavement and then completely forgot about renewing my Railcard.

Since then, I have continued to use my expired Railcard, and got fined again last week, but this time an incident was reported and also its been sent to investigation. This time I was caught for the expired Railcard and also because I purchased the ticket on the train, 4 minutes before the inspector scanned it (I got on by not buying the correct ticket).

During this time of him writing up my witness statement, I was in the middle of revising for my exam in a couple hours and honestly, I didn't really listen to much of what he was saying and just assumed he would give me a fine, and I mistakenly told him I got on at the wrong station (The actual stations are close and the price is practically the same, I just got confused because I interchange sometimes).


Now I am waiting anxiously for my letter to come through, I am scared because it's a second time offense, but the first time was an on the spot fine. I have also been using my Railcard discount and buying wrong fares every now and then.


Is there anything I can do proactively or do I just have to wait for them to write first? How long would it take for them to write to me? And what's the expected outcome?


On the day of this fine, I purchased the correct Railcard as well, and have been using it correctly buying the correct tickets since yo try show me remorse as well.


Any advice as of now would be great, and I can update once they write to me if I can't do anything now to get ahead.... Also tagging @Hadders as I have seen you're quite an expert here.

Thanks in advance for any help and info.

 

[Tevion539]

Well there’s nothing you really can do until you get the letter. You could buy a new railcard to prove to the TOC (if you’re still eligible for one) that you’re taking accountability to ensure it doesn’t happen again. I expect them to trawl your travel history.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Thanks for your reply @Tevion539 - Do you think I will be able to settle out of court, and yes, I purchased the new railcard I am eligible for on the same day - will they be able to see that too when they investigate? I really don't want a criminal record. How will they check my history? Will they check my card, the app I used to buy it or both? I use multiple cards and apps because sometimes apps are laggy an also different cards because they don't all accept my card.

 

[Tevion539]

I purchased the new railcard I am eligible for on the same day - will they be able to see that too when they investigate?

I’d imagine you’d need to send proof of it to them in your response.

How will they check my history? Will they check my card, the app I used to buy it or both?

If you’ve bought digital tickets and you were stopped with one, they can request your history from the retailer and factor in every invalid fare in their decision. They’ll likely only check their own app and the retailer you used to buy the ticket you was stopped with unless they suspect you’ve used others.

Do you think I will be able to settle out of court

Personally, I am of the belief that you make the mistake once, but I don’t (personally) believe the same mistake can be made again for four months after being caught once already. Others may be more sympathetic.

In any case, it is Thameslinks prerogative to settle out of court. With the right attitude in your response, it should be achievable. Having a valid railcard will show you’ve at least made some effort to prevent this happening again.

 

[AlterEgo]

How many tickets have you bought with the expired railcard? Which train company stopped you? Did your ticket also cover your full journey even though it had been illegally discounted?

 

[enyoueffsea]

When your letter does arrive and you respond to it, you’ll need to be a lot more honest than you have been in your initial post.

You have been short faring and applying an expired railcard for a prolonged period of time, despite being caught on at least one occasion.

It wasn’t an accident to buy shorter tickets than your journey, you didn’t forget to renew your railcard, it was intentional fare evasion.

You weren’t confused, you gave the RPI a different station intentionally.

You’ll be able to settle this out of court, it’ll likely cost you a reasonable sum to do so depending on how many journeys you have made. But in order to get a settlement you need to drop all of the nonsense and be honest.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Thanks @enyoueffsea , @AlterEgo and @Tevion539 - I have probably been short farting and applying an expired railcard once a week for the last 7/8 months. I am completely willing to pay the fine, I just hope that they will give me the chance. To reiterate, I now have a valid railcard that I bought after my fine,and yes @AlterEgo, even though I bought it on the train, I then had the correct ticket but with the expired railcard... Also, I have been fined only only once before and it was a penalty fare that I paid on the spot. If I reply being completely honest like you mentioned @enyoueffsea - do you think I could get the out of court settlement? would i need to hire a lawyer, or if I write a sufficient letter aided by this forum, do you think it will be enough?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 31 May 2025 ==

Also, what is the latest they can reach out to me before I can consider that they won't reach out and prosecute? Is it 3 months or longer?

 

[Tevion539]

A lawyer isn’t necessary at this point. They have up to 6 months from the date you were caught to prosecute you. (I believe.) you really do need to be honest with Thameslink when they reach out.

 

[enyoueffsea]

@enyoueffsea - do you think I could get the out of court settlement? would i need to hire a lawyer, or if I write a sufficient letter aided by this forum, do you think it will be enough?

You should get a settlement. Some great people on here who will review your draft response to their letter and ensure it gives you the best opportunity.

I would only advise instructing a solicitor if their response to you is negative and escalatory.

I suspect the only thing you can do now other than wait for the letter is to calculate how much a settlement figure is likely to be and put that to one side ready to pay when needed.

That’ll be the anytime single fare (x2 for a return) for each journey you have not correctly paid, whether that be due to a short fare or expired railcard, or both. If you were short faring before your railcard expired, expect them to be included too.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

Just to clarify a few things here.

Based on your location I assume you're dealing with Govia Thameslink Railway. They are normally one of the more pragmatic train companies to deal with when it comes to this sort of thing as long as you co-operate with their investigation, and haven't come to their attention before.

A problem here is you have come to their attention before. I don't think that will necessarily mean they won't offer you an out of court settlement but you'll likely have to work a bit harder to get one. Clearly, it's up to GTR to decide how to proceed and we cannot guarantee what the outcome will be.

When GTR's letter arrives asking for your version of events post a redacted copy of it in this thread along with your draft reply and forum members will proof read it for you.

 

[swt_passenger]

Hi,

I have stupidly got myself into a terrible situation and would appreciate any support as I await my letter from the Thameslink.

Around 8 months ago, I got an ok the spot that fine that I paid because I didn't have the right ticket and an expired Railcard. I paid the fine on the spot, but I was in a really bad place mentally due to bereavement and then completely forgot about renewing my Railcard.

That reads as though you got a normal penalty fare, although people often call it a fine, it is not.

Since then, I have continued to use my expired Railcard, and got fined again last week, but this time an incident was reported and also its been sent to investigation. This time I was caught for the expired Railcard and also because I purchased the ticket on the train, 4 minutes before the inspector scanned it (I got on by not buying the correct ticket).

That isn’t what usually happens. You either get a penalty fare, or you get reported for further investigation. It’s rare to get both results for one incident. Penalty fares are not something that can be issued later through the post, it seems from your later comments you have not been given one.

During this time of him writing up my witness statement, I was in the middle of revising for my exam in a couple hours and honestly, I didn't really listen to much of what he was saying and just assumed he would give me a fine, and I mistakenly told him I got on at the wrong station (The actual stations are close and the price is practically the same, I just got confused because I interchange sometimes).

I think this was a wrong assumption to make.

 

[bhzs_1234]

I received my letter today - almost 5 months after the incident. Any advice would be appreciated on what I should include to try maximize my chance to settle this out of court. Tagging @Hadders again for help please, as well as anyone else kind enough to help .

Also, is there a way I could try time my response to try push it to 14 days and try minimize the timeframe to try push it to the 6 month limit or is that not recommended?

Thanks in advance everyone!!

 

[WesternLancer]

I received my letter today - almost 5 months after the incident. Any advice would be appreciated on what I should include to try maximize my chance to settle this out of court. Tagging @Hadders again for help please, as well as anyone else kind enough to help .

Also, is there a way I could try time my response to try push it to 14 days and try minimize the timeframe to try push it to the 6 month limit or is that not recommended?

Thanks in advance everyone!!

FWIW I would not tend to think you can string it out and they will go away. They must have a date setting for the 6 month prosecution deadline so may just send it to court to avoid missing that deadline. They are not under any obligation to give you 14 days to reply after all - they could go to court at any point if they so wish I suspect.

If you actually want to maximise your chance of settling this out of court you really need to co-operate.

Here's a general response I have seen hadders post before and should be a good guide to what you need to do now. You must reply by hard copy post too - so dates wise you need to factor that in for delivery.

When you receive the letter post a redacted copy of it in this thread, along with your draft reply and forum members will proof read it for you. You'll find lots of example letters you can use in this section of the forum but the reply basically needs to mention:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident (you could mention that you bought the correct Railcard after the incident for example, as a practical example of what you did, and enclose a copy)
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and Greater Anglia's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

The Railway company will probably offer you an out of court settlement. Expect to have to pay the cost of the fare for the journey you made at the full Anytime rate with no credit given for any invalid ticket you purchased. In addition they will charge an admin fee, typically £150. They will also audit your online ticket purchase history and if this shows you've purchased other railcard discounted tickets since the railcard expires they will factor the cost of these journeys into the settlement.

Settlements usually have to be paid in full within a few days of them being offered so if money is tight you might want to think about how you will raise the sum required at short notice.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Thanks a lot, what do you guys think of this as a response?

Dear Sir/Madam,


I am writing in response to your Notice of Intention to Prosecute dated X October 2025, which I received on X October 2025.


I would like to sincerely apologise for travelling without valid tickets. This occurred during a period of financial stress, under pressure and uncertainty while I was a student, and I made a series of poor decisions that I deeply regret. I take full responsibility for my actions.


When I was stopped on May 16th, I incorrectly stated that I had boarded at Horley, when I had actually boarded at Three Bridges and was travelling without a valid railcard. I was extremely nervous and preparing for an exam that was on that day which led to a moment of confusion. While it was not an intentional attempt to mislead, I now fully recognise how serious and inappropriate that was. I am genuinely sorry for this mistake and for any inconvenience caused.

Since this incident, I have reflected on my actions and taken steps to ensure it never happens again. On the same day, before sitting my exam, I immediately purchased and began using a valid digital 16–25 Railcard (issued by Trip.com, QR code XXX). This event completely opened my eyes about how wrong my actions were and I have been buying the correct, valid tickets since this incident. This has been a difficult but important lesson, and I am committed to ensuring it never happens again.

I would be extremely grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter out of court. I am willing to pay any outstanding fares along with any reasonable administrative costs incurred, and I am prepared to do so promptly. I assure you that I have learned from this and will continue to act responsibly when travelling in future. I sincerely hope that, given my full cooperation and genuine remorse, this matter can be brought to a close without further action.

Thank you for taking the time to consider my response.

Yours faithfully,

XXX

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Oct 2025 ==

@jfollows , @Hadders, @WesternLancer , and any one else willing, would really appreciate your feedback to the above letter, hoping to send this off first thing tomorrow morning.

Does printing this and stapling it make a difference or do I need to hand write it? (poor handwriting hence the question).

 

[jfollows]

It’s too long and you seem to be making too many excuses. I’d suggest cutting them out, they won’t make a difference and they’re only there to make you feel better.
Print rather than write if you have the option.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Thanks! I made some changes to try shorten it - do you think it is okay now? And have I forgotten to add anything? Thanks in advance for your help!!

Dear Sir/Madam,


I am writing in response to your Notice of Intention to Prosecute dated X October 2025, which I received on X October 2025.


I would like to sincerely apologise for travelling without valid tickets. This occurred during a period of financial stress and uncertainty while I was a student. I made poor decisions and I deeply regret my actions.


When I was stopped on May 16th, I incorrectly stated that I had boarded at Horley, when I had actually boarded at Three Bridges and was travelling without a valid railcard. I was extremely nervous and preparing for an exam that was on that day which led to a moment of confusion. While it was not an intentional attempt to mislead, I now fully recognise how serious and inappropriate that was. I am genuinely sorry for this mistake and for any inconvenience caused.

Since this incident, I have reflected on my actions and taken steps to ensure it never happens again. On the same day I purchased and began using a valid digital 16–25 Railcard (issued by Trip.com, QR code XXXXXX). This has been a difficult but important lesson, and I am committed to ensuring it never happens again. I have now been buying the correct, valid tickets since this incident.

I would be extremely grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter out of court. I am willing to pay any outstanding fares along with any reasonable administrative costs incurred, immediately. I assure you that I have learned from this and will continue to act responsibly when travelling in future. I sincerely hope that, given my full cooperation and genuine remorse, this matter can be brought to a close without further action.

Thank you for taking the time to consider my response.

Yours faithfully,

XXXXX

 

[jfollows]

For me, this reads better, yes.

Nothing personal, I’m just trying to put myself in the shoes of the recipient of your letter.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Thank you - do you think it's enough for an out of court settlement?

Any other feedback is also much appreciated

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks! I made some changes to try shorten it - do you think it is okay now? And have I forgotten to add anything? Thanks in advance for your help!!

Dear Sir/Madam,


I am writing in response to your Notice of Intention to Prosecute dated X October 2025, which I received on X October 2025.


I would like to sincerely apologise for travelling without valid tickets. This occurred during a period of financial stress and uncertainty while I was a student. I made poor decisions and I deeply regret my actions.


When I was stopped on May 16th, I incorrectly stated that I had boarded at Horley, when I had actually boarded at Three Bridges and was travelling without a valid railcard. I was extremely nervous and preparing for an exam that was on that day which led to a moment of confusion. While it was not an intentional attempt to mislead, I now fully recognise how serious and inappropriate that was. I am genuinely sorry for this mistake and for any inconvenience caused.

Since this incident, I have reflected on my actions and taken steps to ensure it never happens again. On the same day I purchased and began using a valid digital 16–25 Railcard (issued by Trip.com, QR code XXXXXX). This has been a difficult but important lesson, and I am committed to ensuring it never happens again. I have now been buying the correct, valid tickets since this incident.

I would be extremely grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter out of court. I am willing to pay any outstanding fares along with any reasonable administrative costs incurred, immediately. I assure you that I have learned from this and will continue to act responsibly when travelling in future. I sincerely hope that, given my full cooperation and genuine remorse, this matter can be brought to a close without further action.

Thank you for taking the time to consider my response.

Yours faithfully,

XXXXX

Well I don’t believe it wasn’t intentional to short fare so I don’t think they will believe that either (even if it was) so leave it out or rewrite it.

Towards the end it’s not really about acting responsibly it’s about paying the correct fare - so if you are actually committed to doing that (ie ceasing your fare evasion habits first good) then say that. And do that.

 

[jfollows]

Agreed, it was intentional albeit misguided or whatever.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Ok thank you very much @WesternLancer, @jfollows - Is this better

Dear Sir/Madam,


I am writing in response to your Notice of Intention to Prosecute dated 6 October 2025, which I received on 7 October 2025.


I would like to sincerely apologise for travelling without valid tickets. This occurred during a period of financial stress and uncertainty while I was a student. I made poor decisions and I deeply regret my actions.


When I was stopped on May 16th, I incorrectly stated that I had boarded at Horley, when I had actually boarded at Three Bridges and was travelling without a valid railcard. I was extremely nervous and preparing for an exam that was on that day which led to a moment of confusion. I now fully recognise how serious and inappropriate that was, and I am genuinely sorry for this mistake and for any inconvenience caused.

Since this incident, I have reflected on my actions and taken steps to ensure it never happens again. On the same day I purchased and began using a valid digital 16–25 Railcard (issued by Trip.com, QR code XXXXXXX). This has been a difficult but important lesson, and I am committed to ensuring it never happens again. I have now been buying the correct, valid tickets since this incident.

I would be extremely grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter out of court. I am willing to pay any outstanding fares along with any reasonable administrative costs incurred, immediately. I assure you that I have learned from this and now will pay the correct fare (as I have done since the incident). I sincerely hope that, given my full cooperation and genuine remorse, this matter can be brought to a close without further action.

Thank you for taking the time to consider my response.

Yours faithfully,

XXXXX

 

[WesternLancer]

Ok thank you very much @WesternLancer, @jfollows - Is this better

Dear Sir/Madam,


I am writing in response to your Notice of Intention to Prosecute dated 6 October 2025, which I received on 7 October 2025.


I would like to sincerely apologise for travelling without valid tickets. This occurred during a period of financial stress and uncertainty while I was a student. I made poor decisions and I deeply regret my actions.


When I was stopped on May 16th, I incorrectly stated that I had boarded at Horley, when I had actually boarded at Three Bridges and was travelling without a valid railcard. I was extremely nervous and preparing for an exam that was on that day which led to a moment of confusion. I now fully recognise how serious and inappropriate that was, and I am genuinely sorry for this mistake and for any inconvenience caused.

Since this incident, I have reflected on my actions and taken steps to ensure it never happens again. On the same day I purchased and began using a valid digital 16–25 Railcard (issued by Trip.com, QR code XXXXXXX). This has been a difficult but important lesson, and I am committed to ensuring it never happens again. I have now been buying the correct, valid tickets since this incident.

I would be extremely grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter out of court. I am willing to pay any outstanding fares along with any reasonable administrative costs incurred, immediately. I assure you that I have learned from this and now will pay the correct fare (as I have done since the incident). I sincerely hope that, given my full cooperation and genuine remorse, this matter can be brought to a close without further action.

Thank you for taking the time to consider my response.

Yours faithfully,

XXXXX

Probably good enough to go I’m thinking

 

[SuspectUsual]

I’d replace “led to a moment of confusion” with something like “contributed to a bed decision”.

Confusion tends to imply it was accidental

 

[WesternLancer]

I’d replace “led to a moment of confusion” with something like “contributed to a bed decision”.

Confusion tends to imply it was accidental

Good point

 

[bhzs_1234]

Thanks all. I will send it tonight!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Oct 2025 ==

Last question actually. Do you get any brownie points for delivery by hand? I am only 20 mins away from the reply address

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks all. I will send it tonight!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Oct 2025 ==

Last question actually. Do you get any brownie points for delivery by hand? I am only 20 mins away from the reply address

You need a tracked postage service I suspect. If they have a letter box you may be able to deliver it by hand i suppose but you need proof of delivery in case you need it. Saying you delivered it by hand doesn’t provide proof in the event such proof might be required. Which hopefully it won’t be.

 

[bhzs_1234]

Okay thanks. I will get it sent in the post tomorrow morning and hopefully it will be delivered ASAP. Thanks a lot

 

[WesternLancer]

Okay thanks. I will get it sent in the post tomorrow morning and hopefully it will be delivered ASAP. Thanks a lot

If you use 1st class tracked it should be speedy but if you are not hard up against thier return deadline then 2nd class tracking is cheaper.

Add your reference number to your letter. Keep a copy of every page you send.

Download and keep the tracking delivery proof from Royal Mail.

 

[blimmo]

I would expect that a video of you putting the letter through their letterbox would be just as good proof of delivery as whatever royal mail provide. Probably not better in any way though so unless it's easier/cheaper tracked delivery is more conventional.

 

[WesternLancer]

I would expect that a video of you putting the letter through their letterbox would be just as good proof of delivery as whatever royal mail provide. Probably not better in any way though so unless it's easier/cheaper tracked delivery is more conventional.

That’s a reasonable point.