Northern Rail Drivers Strike

[ComUtoR]

Not forgetting those who choose to cross the picket line. 17.8% said no and 18% didn't vote. Strikes can be very divisive.

Someone posted that talks are back on so the threat of a strike proved its value and as the end goal is to avoid it. I hope that there is a sensible resolution.

 

[Llama]

And of those 200 drivers, a third will be rest-day.

It is quite hard to believe that 20% of drivers on SouthEastern are non-union members! If that is indeed the case, then the culture down there is very different to up here. Trainee drivers, even ex-guard RMT members, have virtually all joined Aslef well before they get anywhere near passing out.

Another aspect to the dispute related to the strike is that drivers' rest-day working recently stopped on Northern.

 

[Albatross]

I'm not having that 20% of SE drivers are not in the union.

Well not without a link to some evidence anyway.

 

[Minilad]

I'm not having that 20% of SE drivers are not in the union.

Well not without a link to some evidence anyway.

I find that hard to believe too. Not in ASLEF possibly. But I would be amazed if it's true about all unions

 

[capital12]

With most other industries you don't get a union trying to double the original pay offer and then the employer wanting to compromise by changing T&Cs in exchange for doubling the pay offer.

Would you be happier with a RPI increase for this year and no guarantee of an increase next year?
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That's pretty much a unique problem for the rail industry. In any other industry trainees in the 1st year would be low paid apprentices and you'd need to be a trained before you can get a salary of over £15,000 nevermind £40,000. While for other highly skilled roles where you get a good starting salary it's assumed you have most/all of the skills required before you start employment and the employers don't invest much in on-the-job training.

Trainee drivers are not paid full money until they are fully productive and work their first solo duty. The starting rate is around 20k with a small increase on passing rules and another increase to around 24k when passing the driver final. So the first 12 months is on around 20-21k, then around 24k for the duration of route learning before the full money when out on your own which could be a year to 18months after starting your training.

Definitely not on £40k from day one as you seem to imply above.

 

[northwichcat]

Definitely not on £40k from day one as you seem to imply above.

I was meaning in many jobs you have to be fully trained in the role you are doing to get a salary over £15,000. Yet a fully trained train driver gets over £40,000.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I'm not having that 20% of SE drivers are not in the union.

Well not without a link to some evidence anyway.

True, but it might explain why SE drivers get paid less...

 

[northwichcat]

RMT now balloting Northern drivers for strike action, they claim they would have like a coordinated strike but ASLEF didn't tell them they were balloting drivers.

About how many drivers are RMT members compared to ASLEF members?

 

[Greenback]

I think that the number of drivers represented by RMT is comparitively small.

 

[ComUtoR]

I think that the number of drivers represented by RMT is comparitively small.

It saves them crossing the picket line. Or going sic....

 

[Carlisle]

True, but it might explain why SE drivers get paid less...

So the way things are going we are likely to see a "Southeastern drivers to be balloted for strike action". thread appear in a short time

 

[Greenback]

It saves them crossing the picket line. Or going sic....

It does, but I was answering jcollins and unfortunately forgot to put the quote in!

 

[northwichcat]

I think that the number of drivers represented by RMT is comparitively small.

So a RMT strike on the same day as an ASLEF strike would likely mean even fewer services can run, while a RMT strike alone may just cancel the peak time extras and some lightly used services?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Improved 3% pay offer has been made. Industrial action currently suspended: http://www.aslef.org.uk/information/100012/141661/northern_rail_industrial_action_suspended/

 

[CdBrux]

So a RMT strike on the same day as an ASLEF strike would likely mean even fewer services can run, while a RMT strike alone may just cancel the peak time extras and some lightly used services?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Improved 3% pay offer has been made. Industrial action currently suspended: http://www.aslef.org.uk/information/100012/141661/northern_rail_industrial_action_suspended/

Must be more to it than 3%: 0.3% of £40k is £120 per year, of which £48 will go in income tax and more in NI.

Following the thread I think Northern should be much more worried about their staff clearing off to another company where the work experience is considered better.

 

[splashoutradio]

As has been mentioned already, the strike is now not going ahead. Here's Northern's somewhat vague press release - http://www.northernrail.org/news/7542

 

[Greenback]

So a RMT strike on the same day as an ASLEF strike would likely mean even fewer services can run, while a RMT strike alone may just cancel the peak time extras and some lightly used services?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Improved 3% pay offer has been made. Industrial action currently suspended: http://www.aslef.org.uk/information/100012/141661/northern_rail_industrial_action_suspended/

I think it's fair to say that if the RMT alone were on strike there might be less cancellations, but how many ASLEF drivers would choose to cross a picket line?

As has been mentioned already, the strike is now not going ahead. Here's Northern's somewhat vague press release - http://www.northernrail.org/news/7542

It's often the case that a ballot for action leads to a massive and occasionally ill tempered discussion on here, only for a resolution to be found and the action called off.

 

[Llama]

Strike dates are only suspended pending a meeting of Aslef's Executive Committee tomorrow to consider the improved offer. Not out of the woods yet.

 

[Greenback]

There's a good chance, i think, that the strike will be called off, but we'll see what happens.

 

[455driver]

I I dont think that with 200 drivers Northern is even going to be able to operate a skeleton service. And there is no saying what the RMT drivers are going to do . No doubt some will join the strike .

And will be in breach of their contracts because, as they are non ASLEF members, it isnt 'their' strike to take part in!

This is where being a non member can leave you out on a limb, unprotected by those nasty, expensive unions!

 

[Llama]

Actually, it isn't illegal for members if another union to refuse to cross a picket line organised by another union, perhaps surprisingly. And this also includes non-union members, thanks to the tories fettling with trade union legislation a few years ago.

 

[trainophile]

Won't someone think of the passengers? That's cost me an extra tenner making alternative arrangements while suitable tickets were available.

 

[455driver]

Won't someone think of the passengers? That's cost me an extra tenner making alternative arrangements while suitable tickets were available.

Have a word with the management!
Why would you make arrangements this far ahead, 99% of the time the threat of a strike (especially with this sort of turn out) is enough to loosen the lips of management and move things forward.

 

[trainophile]

Have a word with the management!
Why would you make arrangements this far ahead, 99% of the time the threat of a strike (especially with this sort of turn out) is enough to loosen the lips of management and move things forward.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing . It isn't really "this far ahead" though, in terms of journey planning and grabbing Advance tickets a few days before travel.

Not the end of the world. Just glad they've made some progress, and hope it doesn't recur every few weeks.

 

[DJH1971]

There's a good chance, i think, that the strike will be called off, but we'll see what happens.

Looks like you were right:

http://www.aslef.org.uk/information/141661/northern_rail_industrial_action_suspended/

 

[bnm]

Abellio dipped further into their pockets or raided the piggy bank did they?

I doubt Serco were up for dishing out more dosh to the drivers. They're busy arranging a fire sale of all their non-governmental businesses.

 

[muz379]

RMT now balloting Northern drivers for strike action, they claim they would have like a coordinated strike but ASLEF didn't tell them they were balloting drivers.

About how many drivers are RMT members compared to ASLEF members?

As was said above of the aprox 1400 drivers , aprox 200 are not represented by ASLEF . So the max RMT could claim to represent is 200 , however take from that however many you think wouldn't be in any union .

And will be in breach of their contracts because, as they are non ASLEF members, it isnt 'their' strike to take part in!

This is where being a non member can leave you out on a limb, unprotected by those nasty, expensive unions!

True they will be in breach of contract . But knowing some of them this wont make a shred of difference to them , they might have developed a sudden bout of sickness on Friday morning or anything you never know .

Its not like Northern has a massive redundancy of drivers to start taking serious action against those who strike in breach of their contract anyway .
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Looks like you were right:

http://www.aslef.org.uk/information/141661/northern_rail_industrial_action_suspended/

I love how 87% dislike reading that

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Actually, it isn't illegal for members if another union to refuse to cross a picket line organised by another union, perhaps surprisingly. And this also includes non-union members, thanks to the tories fettling with trade union legislation a few years ago.

Does anyone remember the old parody of a nursery rhyme...

"Hickory, dickory, dock,
The mouse ran up the clock.
The clock struck,
And the mouse came out in sympathy"

 

[Robertj21a]

So what happened to the strike ? The last comments were that it had been suspended pending an ASLEF Committee meeting.

Is it resolved ? ........ for 3% ?

 

[northwichcat]

So what happened to the strike ? The last comments were that it had been suspended pending an ASLEF Committee meeting.

Is it resolved ? ........ for 3% ?

Members are being balloted over the improved offer or not. As well as the pay rise there's also been talks about improving employee/employer relations.

 

[Y961 XBU]

Is there a website anywhere that will state if Northern are going on Strike tomoz or not?