New-style Paper Tickets

[Andyjs247]

Not seen a thread about new tickets yet so I will start a new one. I travelled by train yesterday purchasing a ticket at a WMT TVM at Sutton Coldfield and was surprised to receive a new style of paper ticket rather than the usual orange credit card sized ticket with a magnetic stripe on the back. There is a 2-D barcode on the front similar to that on e-tickets with several standard barcodes on the back. I am not a particular fan of e-tickets so prefer paper tickets where possible unless I know I may be short of time to collect a ticket before departure. I have not seen this type of ticket previously.

These tickets appear to be printed on a roll of paper which is 86mm wide, same as the length of a credit card, and about 116mm long (photos attached). Overall size is just over twice the size of a credit card ticket, though the two parts are not cut at exactly the same length.

The paper is more flimsy than credit card ticket stock and no doubt cheaper to produce. The size is not easy to keep flat but does allow text to be printed at a larger size and so is easier to read. I didn’t actually get to scan the tickets as the barriers were open at New Street. Presumably these tickets will be rolled out more widely in the coming months?

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

Credit card sized tickets will eventually disappear - the push is to eliminate as many as possible in the meantime, whilst solutions are identified for the tickets that aren't fully supported as barcode versions.

Even buying a ticket from a self service machine or ticket office puts you in an increasingly small minority in the context of all UK ticket sales.

 

[sot]

It is printed roll ticket type but not on orange stock

 

[Discuss223]

They're a flipping nightmare. They're too big to go in a wallet or pocket unfolded and then when you fold them, it can make the ink fade. And if any water touches them, they're a write off. The carded paper tickets are great and do the job perfectly. I suspect it's about the vendors saving themselves money rather than enhancing the customer experience, it's very poor.

 

[Snow1964]

Also baffling is the ticket appears to be for Saturday 16th Nov, but carries a weblink for restrictions nre.co.uk/GF

If you try the link it starts by saying Monday-Friday

..... so why print a restriction that doesn't apply, are they trying to fill the space having decided on bigger ticket.

 

[JonathanH]

The carded paper tickets are great and do the job perfectly. I suspect it's about the vendors saving themselves money rather than enhancing the customer experience, it's very poor.

The barcode doesn't fit on a credit card sized ticket. Most passengers now use eTickets other than for Cross London journeys.

 

[Discuss223]

The barcode doesn't fit on a credit card sized ticket. Most passengers now use eTickets other than for Cross London journeys.

I don't like E-tickets. I like the real thing. I believe the orange tickets have a black strip that tells the ticket gates all the information it needs, working like a bar code.

 

[Jim the Jim]

They have had them for a year or so where I am. I would prefer it if they made them smaller: perhaps they could print the Aztec code on one side and the human-readable information on the other?

At least they are more resilient than bus tickets!

 

[swt_passenger]

Not seen a thread about new tickets yet so I will start a new one. I travelled by train yesterday purchasing a ticket at a WMT TVM at Sutton Coldfield and was surprised to receive a new style of paper ticket rather than the usual orange credit card sized ticket with a magnetic stripe on the back.
[…]

This has been happening to a lesser or greater degree with some TOCs for quite a while, possibly up to 3 or 4 years searching the forum?

So that’s why you won’t find a dedicated recent thread. The biggest issue that seems to have come up in the forums is that they’ve been wrongly issued for cross London journeys and don’t work LU barriers, and AIUI LU staff can’t check them.

 

[sot]

Is the barcode on ccst just a load of guff then?

They don't follow the same encoding as the large barcodes.

Also the public decoders for them no longer scan certain tickets due to different certificates.

 

[Starmill]

This has been happening to a lesser or greater degree with some TOCs for quite a while, possibly up to 3 or 4 years searching the forum?

So that’s why you won’t find a dedicated recent thread. The biggest issue that seems to have come up in the forums is that they’ve been wrongly issued for cross London journeys and don’t work LU barriers, and AIUI LU staff can’t check them.

To be fair, anyone can check a paper roll ticket. They don't need to scan it.

Now, if you say they don't want to do visual inspection then of course that's a different matter.

 

[swt_passenger]

To be fair, anyone can check a paper roll ticket. They don't need to scan it.

Now, if you say they don't want to do visual inspection then of course that's a different matter.

Yes, I probably should have said they can’t scan them to check their history.

 

[Gloster]

They were brought in at Ryde Esplanade a few months ago. Despite my dislike (euphemism) of technology, they do make things easier at the Pier Head and at Portsmouth Harbour Wightlink. Fold them in three, put them in your railcard wallet with the thingy-bob pattern of the one you are using outwards and the other one folded in. Then you can slap them up against the reader on the gate and go through, which is quicker than some of the staff were. When you return, just change the pattern bit over.

 

[transportphoto]

Theses were previously discussed here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/barcoded-tickets-from-greater-anglia-tvms.259751/

 

[hermit]

They were brought in at Ryde Esplanade a few months ago. Despite my dislike (euphemism) of technology, they do make things easier at the Pier Head and at Portsmouth Harbour Wightlink. Fold them in three, put them in your railcard wallet with the thingy-bob pattern of the one you are using outwards and the other one folded in. Then you can slap them up against the reader on the gate and go through, which is quicker than some of the staff were. When you return, just change the pattern bit over.

Ticket machines at the other Island Line stations are still issuing credit card-size tickets. Much preferable in my view, as more robust. I also find they make good bookmarks.

In my experience the new Wightlink gates at both Portsmouth Harbour and Pierhead have rarely been operational, even for tickets that they can read. On all my recent journeys tickets have been zapped or inspected manually as before.

 

[Ivor]

Yet to see them on Southern.

 

[yorkie]

I don't like E-tickets. I like the real thing. I believe the orange tickets have a black strip that tells the ticket gates all the information it needs, working like a bar code.

Newer orange tickets do not have a magstripe, and instead have Aztec codes.

The magstripe does not contain anywhere near the amount of information that an Aztec code holds.

Magstripes are being phased out, whether people like it or not.

 

[route101]

In Scotrail Land TVMs still issue card tickets but ticket offices and onboard sales are the longer receipt style tickets.

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

One of the other reasons for using the flimsier paper was that the thermal/waxy style paper is not always able to be recycled. Some older orange credit card sized tickets also used chemicals that made recycling impossible. I believe that the magnetic strip still makes them unable to be recycled in any event, even once the chemical was removed from manufacturing.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

The barcode doesn't fit on a credit card sized ticket.

I beg to differ...

 

[MrJeeves]

Is the barcode on ccst just a load of guff then?

They don't follow the same encoding as the large barcodes.

I beg to differ...

Barcoded CCSTs ("type 11", I think?) are no longer accredited by RDG and aren't to be used going forward due to the fact that they do not have security features such as those on the larger barcodes (known as "type 06").

Not many TOCs adopted these anyway, as it was entirely optional. I think it's mainly just Avanti doing it these days?

To quote RDG:

Barcodes in use in the rail industry of this type are encoded at the discretion of the issuing TOC.

 

[Mainline421]

The barcode doesn't fit on a credit card sized ticket.

Someone better tell Thailand then, they have CCSTs just like the UK's but with functional Aztec-style barcodes for years now

 

[Flying Snail]

Credit card sized tickets will eventually disappear - the push is to eliminate as many as possible in the meantime, whilst solutions are identified for the tickets that aren't fully supported as barcode versions.

Even buying a ticket from a self service machine or ticket office puts you in an increasingly small minority in the context of all UK ticket sales.

And we know how much the railway hates minorities.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Nov 2024 ==

One of the other reasons for using the flimsier paper was that the thermal/waxy style paper is not always able to be recycled. Some older orange credit card sized tickets also used chemicals that made recycling impossible. I believe that the magnetic strip still makes them unable to be recycled in any event, even once the chemical was removed from manufacturing.

Are you suggesting these new ticket types are not using thermal paper?

 

[signed]

Also baffling is the ticket appears to be for Saturday 16th Nov, but carries a weblink for restrictions nre.co.uk/GF

If you try the link it starts by saying Monday-Friday

..... so why print a restriction that doesn't apply, are they trying to fill the space having decided on bigger ticket.

The fact that the restrictions aren't in force doesn't mean the ticket isn't under those restrictions, that sounds perfectly normal in the overcomplicated fare system of the railway

 

[yorksrob]

Cheap and low quality.

 

[DarloRich]

been happening for years. The only problem: they don't fit easily into your wallet and you cant use the old ticket as bookmark like you can with the card based tickets.

PS try not to be all curmudgeonly about change. it is 2024 not 1824! E tickets will be the standard ticket type.

 

[AlterEgo]

I don't like E-tickets. I like the real thing. I believe the orange tickets have a black strip that tells the ticket gates all the information it needs, working like a bar code.

Magstripes have very limited data on them and certainly not everything a ticket gate needs to determine the validity of a ticket.

 

[yorksrob]

PS try not to be all curmudgeonly about change. it is 2024 not 1824! E tickets will be the standard ticket type.

Never !!

 

[pedr]

Are you suggesting these new ticket types are not using thermal paper?

Paper tickets with barcodes I've bought from WMT TVMs appear to be printed on ordinary slightly glossy paper with ink/toner. They seem to fold fine, though they're slightly larger than a CCST when folded in half so possibly wouldn't fit into a traditional ticket wallet.

A first-class host on XC took a few seconds to work out what they were looking at, so clearly they're not widespread yet!

 

[Jan Mayen]

Can All Line Rover tickets be printed on paper roll tickets? And will the barcode actually work any barriers?