They‘ve already tried that…
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
New Shipley Train Maintenance Facility
- Thread starter SimplyLlama
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
A new article showing the artists impression of the overall site.
www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk
The article in full:-
MORE details on plans to build a £100 million rail depot on a former scrapyard have officially been revealed.
In March, Rail Minister Huw Merriman visited Shipley to announce that the Crossley Evans site would be transformed into an electric train care depot.
The huge facility would bring more than 90 jobs to the town, be completed in 2027, and be known as the Shipley TrainCare Centre.
It would see electric trains repaired, maintained, and stored in Shipley instead of the Neville Hill depot in East Leeds, which will temporarily shut as part of upcoming Transpennine route work.
However, when Neville Hill re-opens, the electric train depot will remain in Shipley.
Now Network Rail has submitted plans for the facility to Bradford Council, with artists’ impressions showing the massive scale of the development.
Buildings on the site will include a 148.5 metre by 41.9 metre maintenance building, an under-frame cleaning facility, a carriage wash machine, and gatehouse building.
The application says: “It has been a long-term ambition of the rail industry to seek improved depot and traincare facilities for the electric fleet serving the Wharfedale and Airedale lines, as the facility currently at Neville Hill is near capacity and is not located centrally to serve the routes.
“A detailed feasibility study of alternative locations was produced during 2021 which identified the location at Shipley as the most suitable in meeting the criteria required for a new depot facility.
“The purpose of the depot is to provide day-to-day railway servicing, maintenance and stabling of trains associated with the Northern franchise and will see the typical class 331 and 333 electric multiple units used on the Airedale and Wharfedale routes utilising the facility.
“The land is currently being cleared of the scrapyard operation. Once cleared the basic trackwork and associated civil engineering works will be established.
“The depot will be operational 24 hours a day throughout the week and weekends. It is anticipated that approximately 92 staff (full time equivalent) will be employed at the site, with normal operation comprising four shift teams with an average shift attendance of up to 28 on site at any one time.”
Referring to the previous use of the site, the application says: “The previous use as a scrapyard was visually and environmentally intrusive, so the provision of modern buildings as part of a depot facility is an improvement in amenity in any event.”
A decision on the application is expected in July.
New images show huge scale of planned £100m rail depot
More details of plans to build a £100 million rail depot on a former scrapyard have officially been revealed.
www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk
The article in full:-
MORE details on plans to build a £100 million rail depot on a former scrapyard have officially been revealed.
In March, Rail Minister Huw Merriman visited Shipley to announce that the Crossley Evans site would be transformed into an electric train care depot.
The huge facility would bring more than 90 jobs to the town, be completed in 2027, and be known as the Shipley TrainCare Centre.
It would see electric trains repaired, maintained, and stored in Shipley instead of the Neville Hill depot in East Leeds, which will temporarily shut as part of upcoming Transpennine route work.
However, when Neville Hill re-opens, the electric train depot will remain in Shipley.
Now Network Rail has submitted plans for the facility to Bradford Council, with artists’ impressions showing the massive scale of the development.
Buildings on the site will include a 148.5 metre by 41.9 metre maintenance building, an under-frame cleaning facility, a carriage wash machine, and gatehouse building.
The application says: “It has been a long-term ambition of the rail industry to seek improved depot and traincare facilities for the electric fleet serving the Wharfedale and Airedale lines, as the facility currently at Neville Hill is near capacity and is not located centrally to serve the routes.
“A detailed feasibility study of alternative locations was produced during 2021 which identified the location at Shipley as the most suitable in meeting the criteria required for a new depot facility.
“The purpose of the depot is to provide day-to-day railway servicing, maintenance and stabling of trains associated with the Northern franchise and will see the typical class 331 and 333 electric multiple units used on the Airedale and Wharfedale routes utilising the facility.
“The land is currently being cleared of the scrapyard operation. Once cleared the basic trackwork and associated civil engineering works will be established.
“The depot will be operational 24 hours a day throughout the week and weekends. It is anticipated that approximately 92 staff (full time equivalent) will be employed at the site, with normal operation comprising four shift teams with an average shift attendance of up to 28 on site at any one time.”
Referring to the previous use of the site, the application says: “The previous use as a scrapyard was visually and environmentally intrusive, so the provision of modern buildings as part of a depot facility is an improvement in amenity in any event.”
A decision on the application is expected in July.
InkyScrolls
On Moderation
Which one is that? They were both there (having been moved slightly north) when I drove to/from BDQ today.
Off topic but can i ask What 01507 is?
InkyScrolls
On Moderation
Not off topic - there have been for many years two diesel shunters stored at Crossley Evans, one of which is 01507.
Hi Harvey, 01507 is a Rushton Hornsby 0-6-0 diesel shunter named "Venom". Regards, Terry
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Passed the area when on my way by train to Carlisle from Bradford on Saturday, and only one rather rusty diesel shunter there, and not 01507 unfortunately.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Passed the area when on my way by train to Carlisle from Bradford on Saturday, and only one rather rusty diesel shunter there, and not 01507 unfortunately.
Last edited:
InkyScrolls
On Moderation
I've been informed by a reliable source that Venom is destined for preservation. I'm afraid I can't give any further details!
Last edited:
InkyScrolls
On Moderation
Correct on both counts!
I am having some difficulty understanding this. The traditional mantra is that electric trains need less maintenance than diesel. Logically more electric trains should reduce the need for maintenance facilities. Yet here we have the TPU (which electrifies York to Manchester) paying for an increase in such facilities. I also seem to recall that one of the benefits of shifting the main tracks at Neville Hill in a southerly direction was to allow the facilities at the Depot to be extended. Similarly the comment re Neville Hill not being centrally located is strange when most of the electric fleet probably runs into Leeds at least once per day.
The East end of Leeds is highly congested. Using valuable paths just to shift in an empty unit is a poor use.
Neville Hill will be shut for a considerable period due to TRU works. Obviously the replacement diesel stabling points at Holbeck and Cobra Sidings will be useless for EMUs. If you're going to build stabling sidings under OHLE with CET and maintenance capabilities you might as well use it as a proper depot.
Which then frees up space at Neville Hill (which is currently full) to service the remaining diesel and incoming bimode fleet.
The realignment of track at Neville Hill gives the 'happy coincidence' of providing more space at the depot, there is no doubt that if the opposite were true and the depot would be reduced in size to improve the alignment this would be going ahead.
Scheduled maintenance is still regularly required as well as stabling, CET emptying, external washing, interior cleaning, unscheduled repairs etc….
Shipley needs to be built due to the Neville Hill TRU works closure and an EMU depot costs far more than stabling sidings for DMU’s. As Shipley is in a far better location than Neville Hill (ie electric units pass it several times a day rather than needing to squeeze a path up the east end of Leeds hence more central) it makes sense to retain it after the NL works as a dedicated EMU maintenance depot.
Only the 2 Doncaster units don’t pass through Shipley each day but they are only on that route for 2 days at a time before rotating back onto the NW triangle. It will also mean that the units that currently stable at Bradford and possibly even Ilkley will be able to stable more securely at Shipley TCC instead. The current Bradford - Carnforth 158 will be able to stable there too saving another path from Leeds - Bradford.
Whilst it is true that Neville Hill is expanding, so too is the size of the train fleet. The 15x replacement fleet will be longer so will need more space than is currently available. Taking the electric fleet out of the equation at Neville Hill helps to solve this problem too.
Looking at Realtime trains for the morning peak (assumed as 0730 to 0900), then the only EMU ECS working is at 0859 to Neville Hill. Hardly worth spending £100m to remove.
As for the closure of Neville Hill "for a considerable period due to TRU works" that is a nonsense itself. I cant recall any such closures ever being necessary elsewhere. But happy to be corrected.
Last edited:
InkyScrolls
On Moderation
I think you'll find @Neptune knows what he's talking about.
It’s not just being built to remove that train though. East Leeds is congested all day and especially so at the start and the end of the day when there are multiple moves on and off depot mixed in with passenger services.
By building a dedicated EMU depot in the centre of the routes that these units work increases availability, and if an in service set swap is required (which happens quite often) then it can be done much quicker and more efficiently without needing to squeeze trains through one of the most congested sections of line in the country.
It is not nonsense and just because you’ve never recalled it ever being necessary elsewhere before doesn’t mean it isn’t happening.
We (being the combined strategic planners from Network Rail, TPE & Northern) are constantly working flat out behind the scenes to make sure that we can plan as substantial a service as possible during the TRU works (ie all the time for the next few years). Anything that is required of more substance to enable the service to continue to run during this period such as Shipley TCC is going to be a fantastic legacy of this. Stabling space at Neville Hill has been a nightmare for years and the double whammy of moving the east EMU fleet out combined with expansion of the depot footprint thanks to TRU will allow for a new and larger replacement fleet for Northern with much more capacity for the passenger.
I hope this explanation makes sense as I suspect from your posts that you have issues with Shipley TCC being built (without giving an actual reason why). It is something that is going to be there for the greater good of the whole network.
Last edited:
Probably should be in the speculation or timetable threads, but...
Wondering if after the new depot is open, the Sunday timetable could be altered to provide an earlier Shipley – Ilkley service for early DalesBus connections? (at present we have to wait for the train from Ilkley to go back). Or maybe starting trains from Bradford Forster Square rather than waiting for trains to come in from Leeds, Ilkley and Skipton?
Wondering if after the new depot is open, the Sunday timetable could be altered to provide an earlier Shipley – Ilkley service for early DalesBus connections? (at present we have to wait for the train from Ilkley to go back). Or maybe starting trains from Bradford Forster Square rather than waiting for trains to come in from Leeds, Ilkley and Skipton?
Undoubtedly could change, though it might also mean the civil engineers agreeing to less maintenance time.
Though the first DalesBus services at 10.00 from Skipton and 10.20 from Ilkley already appear to be timed to connect with trains.
Looking at the planning application it looks like 8 EMUs will fit at Shipley depot at any given time, given that there usually seem to be something between 6-10 East EMUs not in traffic each day, and most of those are presumably at Neville Hill with a couple at Skipton, then surely the stabling at Bradford and Ilkley will need to continue as currently?
More than 8 will be able to be stabled there. Bear in mind the 331’s will be 3 car units (for instance 2 x 331’s will fit on a shed road).
The BDQ units will almost certainly stable on the depot whilst the Ilkley units could, although if they remain stabled at Ilkley for operational reasons that would also make sense.
Less units will be sat around through the day when the Bradford - Ilkley/Skipton services go back up to 2tph.
Hmm.
(Bradford City Council planning application 23/03622/SCR)Planning application said:
Which is reflected in measurements shown on the drawings suggesting a track length of 106m within the shed, which makes for 4x 26m, and certainly not 6x 23m.
Plus the stabling sidings across both sides of the site. A depot is more than just the shed building.
I was replying to your statement that "for instance 2 x 331’s will fit on a shed road" - the planning application clearly states otherwise.
The four stabling roads at the Shipley end of the site appear to be very similar length, theres an underframe wash road and thats it, so even at maximum capacity I can't see how more than 9x 3 or 4 car units can possibly fit on the site.
Sorry I misread that one as I was thinking of the stabling road lengths at the time.
I’ve just been looking at the plans on our system and the plan is for 12 units to stable overnight at Shipley TCC (6x3 car, 6x4 car). There is room for more if required but it’s unnecessary the vast majority of the time as Skipton BRCS will contain the bulk of the fleet overnight. 2 will stay at Ilkley, 2 at Leeds but none will go to Neville Hill at all in the current plan.
Units are planned on Shipley TCC through the day for maintenance swaps.
Hope this helps clear a few questions up.
I mean that clarifies what you meant, but I still don't see how 12 units can be stabled on this site.
Attached has 8 red lines for shed/stabling, 1 yellow for the underframe clean which gives you really a surge capacity of 9...
Also, seems a bit odd that none go to Neville Hill at all, given Shipley isn't going to have a wheel lathe.
Attachments
Can each siding and the shed only hold one unit each or can they hold two each?
Well that’s the official unit plan for when it opens. I trust the person implicitly who has done the detailed work on this (since the start of the planning for this around 3 years ago).
They will go there for the wheel lathe but it isn’t in the LTP plan as you don’t need a unit up there every night (waste of a path most likely lost due to lack of regular use). It will be a VSTP move, most likely planned around one of the maintenance spares.
- Status