MML electrification included in draft Northern RUS

[Railway]

http://rail-news.com/2010/10/12/midland-main-line-electrification-included-in-draft-northern-rus/

 

[YorkshireBear]

interesting but it doesnt mean anythign yet

 

[swt_passenger]

interesting but it doesnt mean anythign yet

It does mean that during the preparation of what is a 'consultation draft', the DfT as one of the sponsors, has allowed it to be mentioned.

The Northern RUS process has been overseen and
directed by the Stakeholder Management Group
which comprises representatives from the Train
Operating Companies (TOCs), Freight Operating
Companies (FOCs), the Department for Transport
(DfT), Network Rail, the Association of Train
Operating Companies (ATOC), Passenger Focus,
the Passesnger Transport Executives (PTEs) and
the ORR (as observers).

The original link is to a news article, the 128 page document is here - but AFAICT it hardly mentions anything new:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/rus%20documents/route%20utilisation%20strategies/rus%20generation%202/northern/northern%20rus%20draft%20for%20consultation.pdf

 

[WatcherZero]

It does kind of chime with rumours that the government is planning to cancel GWML electrification and instead reinstate MML electrification.

The RUS makes sorry reading for how much lengthening or extra services it says are required and the chance that we will actually get new stock in the short-mid term. It speculates that efficency savings could be had from including a order for the replacement of the Merseyrail DC units with a new AC units order to serve electrification/lengthening on top of the cascade and speculates a Pacer/Sprinter replacement may have better performance charachteristics. In fact perhaps due to ecomic climate theirs very little infrastructure works proposed in it for the next 30 years bar lancashire Trangle and later Transpennine electrification, Northern Hub and Leeds Station.

 

[Geezertronic]

It might be worth seriously considering Bombardier's suggestion of the panto coach(es) in the 22x sets so the 222's can be "converted" if the MML gets electrified.

 

[ukrob]

It does kind of chime with rumours that the government is planning to cancel GWML electrification and instead reinstate MML electrification.

The RUS makes sorry reading for how much lengthening or extra services it says are required and the chance that we will actually get new stock in the short-mid term. It speculates that efficency savings could be had from including a order for the replacement of the Merseyrail DC units with a new AC units order to serve electrification/lengthening on top of the cascade and speculates a Pacer/Sprinter replacement may have better performance charachteristics. In fact perhaps due to ecomic climate theirs very little infrastructure works proposed in it for the next 30 years bar lancashire Trangle and later Transpennine electrification, Northern Hub and Leeds Station.

It is however, the most realistic RUS (draft or otherwise) I have ever seen.

 

[WatcherZero]

As I said, it reflects the economy, the sorry reading comment was more about all the extra services and lengthening it said was needed and the chances we would actually get that in the next 5-10 years.

 

[PhilipW]

Worth pointing out that RUS documents are just 'talking shop' documents. They are commitments to nothing.

I wonder what the point of them is. They probably make the DfT and railway industry feel god that they have produced such nice documents.

As to their benefits, that's highly debatable. Still the railway industry likes to keep on spending lots of much but achieving very little.

How many man hours and how much money spent developing this RUS ? Lots, I fear. Benefits --> practically zero.

 

[tbtc]

Worth pointing out that RUS documents are just 'talking shop' documents. They are commitments to nothing.

I wonder what the point of them is. They probably make the DfT and railway industry feel god that they have produced such nice documents.

As to their benefits, that's highly debatable. Still the railway industry likes to keep on spending lots of much but achieving very little.

How many man hours and how much money spent developing this RUS ? Lots, I fear. Benefits --> practically zero.

I imagine the point is that it allows local "Stakeholders" to have a forum to campaign for their own "wishlists", regardless of the fact that they are unlikely to happen.

I never expect much of them to actually happen (in the short/ medium term), but it does give an indication into the kind of things that are on the table.

I don't know whether to be encouraged by this modest RUS or depressed that things are so desperate that we are having to get excited about really low-key changes.

 

[The Planner]

Worth pointing out that RUS documents are just 'talking shop' documents. They are commitments to nothing.

Trouble is though, if you come up with a scheme and it doesnt make it into the RUS, you are all but knackered.

 

[shinkansen1966]

It does kind of chime with rumours that the government is planning to cancel GWML electrification and instead reinstate MML electrification.

We might have a clearer picture after the Comprehensive Spending Review, on Wed 20 Oct.

 

[swt_passenger]

I imagine the point is that it allows local "Stakeholders" to have a forum to campaign for their own "wishlists", regardless of the fact that they are unlikely to happen.

I never expect much of them to actually happen (in the short/ medium term), but it does give an indication into the kind of things that are on the table.

If you go back and look at some older RUSs such as 'Cross London', you'll find that a fair proportion, probably a majority, of the proposed service and infrastructure changes have happened, or are happening soon.

The problem is, people are so used to things being talked about for years without anything happening that they are conditioned to be highly suspicious of these shopping lists. My suggestion is to wait a few years, as they deal with things 5 or 10 years before they happen...

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Trouble is though, if you come up with a scheme and it doesnt make it into the RUS, you are all but knackered.

Exactly - in the sense that they list what is possible, they are a good starting point - and although they are written up by NR, they do include DfT policy makers on the management board...

 

[tbtc]

If you go back and look at some older RUSs such as 'Cross London', you'll find that a fair proportion, probably a majority, of the proposed service and infrastructure changes have happened, or are happening soon.

The problem is, people are so used to things being talked about for years without anything happening that they are conditioned to be highly suspicious of these shopping lists. My suggestion is to wait a few years, as they deal with things 5 or 10 years before they happen...

That sounds like the kind of "health warning" that should come with these, to stop us getting excited about any short term improvements.

 

[swt_passenger]

That sounds like the kind of "health warning" that should come with these, to stop us getting excited about any short term improvements.

Good point - I mean, look how often in the past we have seen/read franchise announcements of new services and timetables, and in the detailed stuff we then see that they come in SLC2, perhaps two years away.

Or when the platform lengthening is finished in 2013-14...

Or stock overhauls 'over the length of the franchise' or whatever...

Yet you can bet within six months someone will post here complaining that such and such a change hasn't happened yet... :roll:

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Worth pointing out that RUS documents are just 'talking shop' documents. They are commitments to nothing.

Especially so as this one is only a draft. Once they become established and are approved by ORR they are the policy. To assume they have no relevance whatsoever to future happenings is quite wrong.

As a recent example - look at the announcement of Gatwick's new platform. Then go and look it's business case up in the Sussex RUS - if it wasn't in there it wouldn't be happening at all...