Marriage: What's the point?

[DarloRich]

The formal "bit of paper" that is signed after the marriage ceremony to which you make reference to is something that has been there for ages long past and is something that originally was intended to be a copy of the entry made in the parish Register of Marriages.

One might well ask for how long have marriages been noted in such a way in Britain and also how many countries of the world issue such a document that is a copy of an official record kept. I can only speak for marriages celebrated in a Christian ceremony or at a Register Office with regards to the registering of a marriage and it makes an interesting thought how marriages celebrated by Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, etc, people and those living under Communist regimes lead to the issuing of a similar document.

I know what the marriage certificate is for. I have dealt with enough of them! Marriages abroad or under different religions will generate a similar document that you will need to "register" the marriage in the UK


That doesn't answer the question though does it? Why the need for the formalisation of a relationship? Can my relationship not offer emotional, psychological and spiritual support and well-being because we lack that formalisation?

 

[Greenback]

It's not the bit of paper that's important, it's more the public commitment, making vows etc that matter to some people, including me.

I went through the stages of building a relationship, from seeing someone regularly to co-habitation and eventually a register office marriage. We didn't rush anything, we wanted to eb certain that we would last as a couple, and we have. As far as I was concerned making a public declaration was a serious matter, not to be taken lightly and should be seen by family and friends that I wanted to remain with my partner for the rest of my life.

I think that not enough people take it seriously these days. If they don't, then they're probably better off not bothering with the ceremony or the bit of paper at all. It's a personal thing, though. I don't want to impose anything on anyone, either way.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I got married first time at 21, but sadly we split up and divorced after eight years of marriage. I don't think the marriage failed because we "didn't take it seriously" or because we went into it lightly, we certainly weren't naive, although I think we were both different people at 30 than we were at 20. I married because I wanted to commit and the public statement of that commitment was important to me. My ex-wife was the same. I also think we probably stayed together longer than if we hadn't been married.

I'm getting married again in July. For pretty much the same reasons. I value the public commitment that marriage brings, and think it important. My fiancee feels the same. In some ways marriage changes nothing compared to co-habitation- you're still the same people, in the same relationship, doing the same things- but in some ways it changes everything. For me, it adds an additional layer of security to the relationship; making a public commitment is a huge step.

But that doesn't mean people who choose not to marry have less worthwhile relationships. You can have a strong, secure relationship without marrying and you can have a weak, fragile relationship in marriage (just ask Katie Price). It's a personal choice and there is no inherent value in the choice: I'm not more committed because I prefer to marry, you're not less committed because you choose not to.

 

[DarloRich]

It's not the bit of paper that's important, it's more the public commitment, making vows etc that matter to some people, including me.

I went through the stages of building a relationship, from seeing someone regularly to co-habitation and eventually a register office marriage. We didn't rush anything, we wanted to eb certain that we would last as a couple, and we have. As far as I was concerned making a public declaration was a serious matter, not to be taken lightly and should be seen by family and friends that I wanted to remain with my partner for the rest of my life.

I think that not enough people take it seriously these days. If they don't, then they're probably better off not bothering with the ceremony or the bit of paper at all. It's a personal thing, though. I don't want to impose anything on anyone, either way.

I am not trying to belittle or denigrate a personal choice made by people for their own reasons. They should be free to both choose and express that choice.I have seen too much of the bad sides of marriage, the horrible way they end, the behaviour of people when marriage ends and the fall out that has on people.

I doubt i will be married. I know my gf has no desire to be married. Her first marriage was terrible and the divorce was awful. She suffered badly, both physically and emotionally, and doesn't want it again.

 

[Greenback]

Your point of view is very valid. I was not intending to suggest that you were trying to denigrate anything. I was merely trying to say that what may be a bit of paper to some, is a lot more to others. As I said it's very personal to the individual.

Similarly, I had no desire to suggest that anyone whose have a marriage fail did not take it seriously enough. What i was trying to say there was that if you don't think marriage is worthwhile, then don't get married just because someone else wants you to, or because you think it's expected of you.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I have seen too much of the bad sides of marriage, the horrible way they end, the behaviour of people when marriage ends and the fall out that has on people.

Conversely, I have seen many examples of the good side of marriage and of the contentment that a happy marriage brings. As I said before, my wife and I have been married for over forty years with no regrets whatsoever. Friends of both my wife and I have all been married for similar periods of time and all seem to be just as content as we are.

Is this a generational matter? I have seen attitudes to many of what once were status quo established matters change over the last thirty years and how society now views such matters in a totally different light. Much emphasis has been placed on liberalisation but I do ask the question if has this really been the "be all and end all" that was claimed for it by those who wished such a change to be so effected.

 

[DarloRich]

Your point of view is very valid. I was not intending to suggest that you were trying to denigrate anything. I was merely trying to say that what may be a bit of paper to some, is a lot more to others. As I said it's very personal to the individual.

Similarly, I had no desire to suggest that anyone whose have a marriage fail did not take it seriously enough. What i was trying to say there was that if you don't think marriage is worthwhile, then don't get married just because someone else wants you to, or because you think it's expected of you.

i appreciate that there is more to the "institution" of marriage than a bit of paper and that it is a very personal choice for people and I would never seek to limit that choice. I am interested in views on the subject and what people think.

 

[Greenback]

i appreciate that there is more to the "institution" of marriage than a bit of paper and that it is a very personal choice for people and I would never seek to limit that choice. I am interested in views on the subject and what people think.

I didn't think you would for a minute, Darlo! Anything I've typed is just my own personal view, and I strongly believe in a live and let live approach. I never saw much point in marraige myself, but when I met my missus I changed my views!

 

[Busaholic]

As someone who's been married since the 1960s (to the same person!) I'm, perhaps surprisingly, not going to give a kneejerk reaction and say, yes, what a wonderful institution and everyone should aspire to it. As the age of majority was still 21 at the time and my wife-to-be was 19 I had to have her father's permission to marry her! I'm not sure he was that willing to give it, but realising we were going to live together anyway, he consented. We both feel that we probably married too young (I was only 21, and had grown up in a rather stern household with consequent lack of many freedoms that would be considered standard today: also I went to a single sex school) and the marriage has been fairly stormy, but, hey, we've both survived to tell the tale.

 

[radamfi]

Would the people here who have had successful marriages say that it would not have been as successful if they didn't get married?

 

[Greenback]

Would the people here who have had successful marriages say that it would not have been as successful if they didn't get married?

I don't think it's possible to answer that question! I believe that our relationship has grown stronger down the years, but who is to say that wouldn't have happened anyway?

All I can say with some degree of certainty is that getting married was something that we both wanted, and that I suspect doing so has contributed to our happiness. Yet I think we'd have been happy anyway, even if we hadn't got married.

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

To me, marriage is beautiful thing and shows one of the greatest levels of respect and commitment towards a person...

I will be getting married next year (no jokes, Techniquest!) and I look forward to a long and happy relationship as a husband to she that is my wife. We've already discussed what we'd like out of the relationship and we're not looking for kids at the moment - just to be there for the other... And the other... And just curl up in front of the fire and hold each other

 

[ComUtoR]

Is it just as reasonable to get married for purely financial reasons ? What about those who do get married for the myriad of reasons other than love ?

Love isn't for everyone.

 

[Antman]

I don't think I'd get married if I had my time over again.

My sister and her long term partner had lived together for almost 12 years before, for reasons best known to themselves, they got married. Within 18 months they had split up and are now in the process of getting divorced.

 

[AM9]

Not necessarily, if the house was bought and paid for before the "other party" moves in then said "other party" has no financial interest in the property,the concept of "Common Law" does not exist and never has.
I am still amazed how many people still think if you live together for 2 years you have the same rights and obligations as married couples.

Before commenting on that sentence, you need to read the following sentence where I clearly qualified the statement, repeated here for your convenience:

"You need to understand that any long term relationship may end with that whether there is "a piece of paper and a ceremony " or not."​

Note the words in bold.
If a relationship becomes established, (married or not) upon breakup, any disputed private settlement may be challenged in court. If the court is satisfied that the parties have both contributed to the common wealth of the partnership, then it may determine that a proportional split in the shared wealth is appropriate. The longer the relationship endures before breakup, the more equal the shares become. Note, the contribution may not be monetary or material. A partner who keeps the family home in secure or good order whilst the other is out at work is seen as a contribution, so the breadwinner claiming that they are the only one who makes a contribution doesn't cut it with a court these days (unless there is a legally sound previous agreement in that respect).

 

[Merseysider]

To me, marriage is just a man-made concept and shouldn't define love or have any bearing upon how serious a relationship is. I've never had any burning desire to marry.

Being born outside of marriage, being atheist, and growing up with separated parents perhaps made me a little cynical, but I don't think marriage is necessarily important to the wellbeing of a relationship. More important is stability. if you're truly happy with someone then you've got decades to consider marriage so there's no point rushing into it.

That said, I've always been happier with a close group of friends I see regularly than (in hindsight) being in relationships and struggling to balance priorities. The absolute freedom of being single has given me the chance to see places and do things no girlfriend/wife would let me do this last couple of years, or would at least argue about

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

The absolute freedom of being single has given me the chance to see places and do things no girlfriend/wife would let me do this last couple of years, or would at least argue about

My partner allows me free reign to do anything I want... Even joins me sometimes for the fun

 

[Merseysider]

My partner allows me free reign to do anything I want... Even joins me sometimes for the fun

You really have got a keeper then!

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

You really have got a keeper then!

It is better than what you think... Techniquest knows, but he is sworn to silence

 

[TheNewNo2]

Is this a generational matter? I have seen attitudes to many of what once were status quo established matters change over the last thirty years and how society now views such matters in a totally different light. Much emphasis has been placed on liberalisation but I do ask the question if has this really been the "be all and end all" that was claimed for it by those who wished such a change to be so effected.

I don't think it's a generational matter so much as a matter of expectations, both societal and personal. It used to be that being divorced was something very shameful, and so even if a couple weren't happy together, there was that keeping them together. Moreover, nowadays we don't expect a marriage to be "make do", but to be love and happiness.

 

[Tetchytyke]

If a relationship becomes established, (married or not) upon breakup, any disputed private settlement may be challenged in court. If the court is satisfied that the parties have both contributed to the common wealth of the partnership, then it may determine that a proportional split in the shared wealth is appropriate

Hmm. I'm no divorce or property lawyer, but that isn't my understanding of the law.

You can sometimes acquire a beneficial interest in property without being the legal registered owner, e.g. you move in and can prove you paid half the mortgage, or otherwise contributed to the upkeep of the property. This is complicated where one person says they paid half the mortgage and the other says it was rent; obviously tenants or lodgers do not gain a beneficial interest in the property they're living in. The proof needed to acquire a beneficial interest is more than "we were going out for five years".

Generally, though, the court will not seize assets from one person and give it to another just because they were in a relationship.

There is no such thing as a "common law marriage" and, should a partner die intestate, their partner will not be their next of kin. The only relationships recognised by law are marriage and civil partnership; if you do not recognise your relationship in law then you do not get the legal rights from the relationship.

 

[CatfordCat]

Ultimately, my view is that whatever any combination of consenting adults want to do, that's up to them - including getting married or otherwise.

In terms of the law, the 'Living Together' website is a fairly good resource on what the law does / doesn't recognise for unmarried / non civil partnered* couples, and how to protect yourself / your partner from legal pitfalls.

There are a few times that the state does recognise a 'common law' partnership, but usually only when it works in the system's favour, e.g. means tested benefits, when an unmarried partner's income etc will be taken in to account

* - i did write 'un-civil partnered' first, but there's probably a few uncivil partners who are in a legally recognised relationship...

 

[Clip]

My partner allows me free reign to do anything I want... Even joins me sometimes for the fun

Indeed. And letting them go on at you for a bit every so often makes that even more worthwhile.

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

Indeed. And letting them go on at you for a bit every so often makes that even more worthwhile.

Oh, I let them go on at me, alright, but it sure ain't nagging me

 

[90019]

It is better than what you think... Techniquest knows, but he is sworn to silence

So when are you and Techniquest getting married?

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

So when are you and Techniquest getting married?

*heartily chuckles*

Cheeky sod, ain't you?

 

[RichmondCommu]

My partner allows me free reign to do anything I want... Even joins me sometimes for the fun

Does that include threesomes?

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

Does that include threesomes?

Sorry, RichmondCommu, but not with you...

 

[DarloRich]

Does that include threesomes?

surely the basis of any good marriage ;- )

 

[RichmondCommu]

Sorry, RichmondCommu, but not with you...

And yet you've never met me!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

surely the basis of any good marriage ;- )

I concur, as long as it doesn't involve other family members.