LOROL to operate "24hr at weekends"

[Simon11]

It will provide good connections with quite a few night bus routes though and is a step in the right direction.

What happens on Crossrail will be interesting to see.

Looking at the timetable specification for bidders, it didn't mention 24hr working.

 

[Robertj21a]

Looking at the timetable specification for bidders, it didn't mention 24hr working.

Did it mention it on *any* specs for bidders, on anything, at any time ?

 

[cle]

Will all stations be open?

And how about frequency? I'd hope for at least 4tph.

Interesting but good with the Jubilee connection at Canada Water all night, so a route from SE London to the West End.

And will Crossrail be 24 hours? As Whitechapel would be another link.

 

[Robertj21a]

Will all stations be open?

And how about frequency? I'd hope for at least 4tph.

Interesting but good with the Jubilee connection at Canada Water all night, so a route from SE London to the West End.

And will Crossrail be 24 hours? As Whitechapel would be another link.

Surely, in this day and age, Crossrail has been designed for 24-hour operation ?

 

[samuelmorris]

I believe I read a long time ago that crossrail will not be 24 hours, but I'd certainly like it to be. 24 hour train to within walking distance of home would be bliss. No more 'last train' concerns as Stratford would I believe be served by two tube lines also seeing 24 hour operation at weekends.

 

[matt_world2004]

It would be more impressive if the announcement today if they were going to announce the development of triple tracking the whole network allowing which would allow the tube to run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. It would take 50 years but it would still revoloutionise transport in London

 

[RichmondCommu]

Surely, in this day and age, Crossrail has been designed for 24-hour operation ?

As others have pointed out further up the thread there would be no chance to carry out routine maintenance if Crossrail was a 24-hour operation, in particular within the central section.

 

[hwl]

As others have pointed out further up the thread there would be no chance to carry out routine maintenance if Crossrail was a 24-hour operation, in particular within the central section.

If the central section were bi directionally signalled with the option to swap tunnels in the middle you could run a 15 minute service on weekend nights

 

[cle]

How much maintenance should Crossrail need? Surely not huge possessions which couldn't be covered from 1am to 5am M-Th?

 

[RichmondCommu]

How much maintenance should Crossrail need? Surely not huge possessions which couldn't be covered from 1am to 5am M-Th?

In all honesty I'd assumed that forum members were suggesting that the route should be open 24 hours a day seven days a week!

However, huge possessions or not if the track or signalling requires inspection or maintenance surely you could not continue to run trains through the central section?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If the central section were bi directionally signalled with the option to swap tunnels in the middle you could run a 15 minute service on weekend nights

Well yes you could assuming that the signalling is indeed bi-directional. The only other problem would be ensuring that the planned alterations were properly communicated. Imagine the chaos if they introduced bi-directional operations on the Tube!

 

[cle]

I assume Friday and Saturdays at first, and next they should look at making Sunday hours the same as Saturday ones across the network.

In many countries, they just have a 'Weekends and Bank Holidays' timetable.

More important getting Sunday up to speed than being 24/7 I'd say.

 

[Southernrover]

So which promises do you think will not be honoured?

All of them!

 

[jon0844]

Even when services go 24 hours at weekends I assume there will still be times they will close for engineering work, as happens now. Only thing is that this time there might be deducted replacement buses or planned weeks to fit around other lines still operating.

 

[Robertj21a]

As others have pointed out further up the thread there would be no chance to carry out routine maintenance if Crossrail was a 24-hour operation, in particular within the central section.

That sounds like massive overkill. Other countries have trains running 24 hours but we are often told that we can't possibly do it because the infrastructure is too old (or some other 'easy' reason). Here you have a brand new line, so why can't it be done ?

This need for 'routine maintenance' (seemingly never ending) sounds like a handy excuse to avoid having to do anything different to what has been considered normal practice for decades.

 

[matt_world2004]

Could crossrail be 24 hours (albeit at a reduced frequency) by having 24 hour services on the great western mainline and shenfield metro and a single tracked shuttle service on the tunnelled and abbey wood section with the other section of track used for maintenance.

 

[LLivery]

Thameslink run 24 hr, 7 days a week from Bedford to Three Bridges meaning that its 24hr through the central section. Why on earth couldn't Crossrail do the same thing? 2tph on each branch seems reasonable. Whether its just weekends or all week, it probably will happen.

 

[Antman]

All of them!

Would you care to elaborate? Maybe provide some reasoning instead of making sweeping unsubstantiated statements.

 

[edwin_m]

Thameslink run 24 hr, 7 days a week from Bedford to Three Bridges meaning that its 24hr through the central section. Why on earth couldn't Crossrail do the same thing? 2tph on each branch seems reasonable. Whether its just weekends or all week, it probably will happen.

This may happen with Crossrail but I haven't seen anything to say it will. However if it does, stations with only slow/relief line platforms probably won't be served, so the service can run on either pair of tracks while maintenance takes place on the other pair. This isn't a problem for Thameslink as IIRC all their stations have platforms on both pairs of tracks. What happens in the Thameslink core?

On the Crossrail core it's a question of whether the 15-20min interval possible with one section of single line running is enough to support the demand. If enough people turned up to overcrowd the stations then it would probably be better not to run anything at all. However with modern infrastructure it ought to be possible to run both tracks all night at weekends with maintenance on weekday nights.

 

[Class 170101]

Similarly, I highly doubt we'll get anything any later between Gospel Oak and Barking (though I'm certain that there is already a demand for a service until around 01:00 when the Victoria Line finishes).

Clearly going forward the Victoria Line won't finish at 01:00 on Friday and Saturday nights.

However I see little reason from the maintenance side why both the Gospel Oak to Barking and NLL (between Stratford and Willesden Jn) Routes could run as a 24hour operation Monday to Friday nights as most of the time these lines are open for freight traffic through the night. Saturday night however is very unlikely as both Saturday and alternate Sunday nights are the main maintenance opportunities for these lines which aren't available in the week.

 

[Bald Rick]

Thameslink run 24 hr, 7 days a week from Bedford to Three Bridges meaning that its 24hr through the central section. Why on earth couldn't Crossrail do the same thing? 2tph on each branch seems reasonable. Whether its just weekends or all week, it probably will happen.

No it doesn't. It's 24h 6 days a week, with a 6 hour maintenance window every Sunday morning.

For the overnight service in the week, it's 1 tph each way for 4 hours to fit on the bidi. If there's a 24h service on Crossrail, that's what you can expect.

 

[Southernrover]

Would you care to elaborate? Maybe provide some reasoning instead of making sweeping unsubstantiated statements.

Election year nothing sweeping or unsubstantiated about that statement. It's a fact.
Politicians make promises to the electorate that in all honesty they haven't shared with the operators they are merely political wishes.
Speaking as someone who was heavily involved with the Jubilee Line extension back in 1998 the then Labour government promised it would be open for the millennium even though Westinghouse had 18months earlier pulled out of installing their version of the moving block signalling.
Political wish sometimes takes precedence over what's actually achievable and in the case of the JLE I can tell you it very nearly didn't happen.
The current government are running very scared and will promise you the earth in a run up to what could be the most open election in years.
So I stand by my comments.

 

[Busaholic]

Election year nothing sweeping or unsubstantiated about that statement. It's a fact.
Politicians make promises to the electorate that in all honesty they haven't shared with the operators they are merely political wishes.
Speaking as someone who was heavily involved with the Jubilee Line extension back in 1998 the then Labour government promised it would be open for the millennium even though Westinghouse had 18months earlier pulled out of installing their version of the moving block signalling.
Political wish sometimes takes precedence over what's actually achievable and in the case of the JLE I can tell you it very nearly didn't happen.
The current government are running very scared and will promise you the earth in a run up to what could be the most open election in years.
So I stand by my comments.

Because I qualify on grounds of age, I received a letter this morning from a certain George Osborne, MP, regarding Pensioner Bonds being available to buy up until May. The letterhead did happen to mention in slightly smaller print that he was also Chancellor of the Exchequer, in case that fact had passed me by. It was unashamed Tory propaganda and must come very close to breaching electoral law. If I thought it achieved anything, and if it didn't cost me a stamp, I'd write back saying, partly thanks to his policies, I have no spare cash whatsoever to invest in anything. Instead I'll vent my spleen here in the hope that the NHS will still be around to provide me with a new one if necessary.

 

[Robertj21a]

Election year nothing sweeping or unsubstantiated about that statement. It's a fact.
Politicians make promises to the electorate that in all honesty they haven't shared with the operators they are merely political wishes.
Speaking as someone who was heavily involved with the Jubilee Line extension back in 1998 the then Labour government promised it would be open for the millennium even though Westinghouse had 18months earlier pulled out of installing their version of the moving block signalling.
Political wish sometimes takes precedence over what's actually achievable and in the case of the JLE I can tell you it very nearly didn't happen.
The current government are running very scared and will promise you the earth in a run up to what could be the most open election in years.
So I stand by my comments.

Good try but I somewhat doubt that '....the current government are running very scared....'

 

[EM2]

Deleted - Bald Rick has already answered with better info.

 

[SaveECRewards]

Because I qualify on grounds of age, I received a letter this morning from a certain George Osborne, MP, regarding Pensioner Bonds being available to buy up until May. The letterhead did happen to mention in slightly smaller print that he was also Chancellor of the Exchequer, in case that fact had passed me by. It was unashamed Tory propaganda and must come very close to breaching electoral law. If I thought it achieved anything, and if it didn't cost me a stamp, I'd write back saying, partly thanks to his policies, I have no spare cash whatsoever to invest in anything. Instead I'll vent my spleen here in the hope that the NHS will still be around to provide me with a new one if necessary.

I can beat that. As a director of my own company I got a letter from David Cameron explaining what the government has done to reduce the tax burden for small companies.

Back on topic I'd be happy to see the ELL run 24 hours on weekends even if at sometimes it's not possible due to engineering works.

One thing we know though is operating a replacement bus service on the ELL is difficult due to buses not being able to use the Rotherhithe Tunnel but if closures were announced plenty of time in advance it would mean you could plan round them.

Is there any valid reason why there's guards on the NLL but the ELL with the same rolling stock in DOO? I could imagine the guards would be an extra cost that might make later running on the NLL not feasible.

 

[notadriver]

There are no longer guards on any Lorol services.

 

[deltic]

Election year nothing sweeping or unsubstantiated about that statement. It's a fact.
Politicians make promises to the electorate that in all honesty they haven't shared with the operators they are merely political wishes.
Speaking as someone who was heavily involved with the Jubilee Line extension back in 1998 the then Labour government promised it would be open for the millennium even though Westinghouse had 18months earlier pulled out of installing their version of the moving block signalling.
Political wish sometimes takes precedence over what's actually achievable and in the case of the JLE I can tell you it very nearly didn't happen.
The current government are running very scared and will promise you the earth in a run up to what could be the most open election in years.
So I stand by my comments.

All night running on LOROL and DLR has been considered for some time - its announcement is obviously timed with the election in mind although given it wont happen till 2021 on DLR I'm sure it will be announced many more times over the next 6 years.