Locomotives Requiring Water

[zwk500]

I am no expert, but doesn't the mineral content in the water make a big difference to scaling, the risk of priming etc? So it's preferable to be choosey about where to pick up water if you have the option.

It does, although interesting a more recent example has gone the other way: I was meant to have a ride behind a mainline steam charter when involved in them for NR, but the day before our trip they had put some descaling solution into the water, which was very effective. Unfortunately, it turned out the scale had been plugging some leaks, so the newly descaled boiler suddenly couldn't keep pressure!

IIRC one of the reasons the Bluebell has its locos shedded at Sheffield Park is that the water there is very loco-friendly whilst the water at Horsted Keynes is quite the opposite.

I highly doubt the water supply was the main reason the Bluebell based itself at Sheffield Park - they didn't have a choice, as BR was still running services to Horsted Keynes over the Ardingly line. The very earliest bluebell services weren't actually allowed into Horsted Keynes itself, a temporary halt being set up instead.
You are correct thought in that the water supply at Sheffield park was plentiful as it was supplied from the river Ouse directly behind the station whereas Horsted Keynes did not have such a good source. Pre-closure it was apparently quite common for locos to try and stretch out the stop at Sheffield Park to top up the water.

 

[Ashley Hill]

I am no expert, but doesn't the mineral content in the water make a big difference to scaling, the risk of priming

Yes,hard water causes scale which builds up on the boiler tubes decreasing their efficiency. Locos also need washing out more frequently. Some companies used water softening equipment to help combat this.

 

[Rescars]

Agreed, but I don't think it affects the accuracy of, or is inconsistent with, what I posted. Steam road vehicles weren't high-tech and couldn't afford to be choosey.

Yes indeed. It seems that, despite all the recent press coverage about electric vehicles, there is nothing new about range anxiety!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 May 2022 ==

Stories like this really make me want to start a thread on the Glasgow and South Western Railway, presuming that's what GSWR is short for here. Some utterly bonkers stuff to be found there to say the least!

Yes, Glasgow and South Western indeed. Some of the tales are more wild west than Sou West, but still wonderful in the telling. So sad that there are no trains in Galloway these days - if there were, operating practices would no doubt be rather different!

 

[Strathclyder]

Yes, Glasgow and South Western indeed. Some of the tales are more wild west than Sou West, but still wonderful in the telling.

Wild West is right! Seemed to be a law unto itself at times, the old GSWR.

So sad that there are no trains in Galloway these days - if there were, operating practices would no doubt be rather different!

Very, very different I'd wager. Operating practices aside, that was a great loss to the Scottish network scenery-wise. The last word in bleak beauty.

 

[Rescars]

Wild West is right! Seemed to be a law unto itself at times, the old GSWR.


Very, very different I'd wager. Operating practices aside, that was a great loss to the Scottish network scenery-wise. The last word in bleak beauty.

How very true!

 

[Andy873]

Interesting things here.

If I can ask another basic question - how was the outlet opened for water at Great Harwood?

In the wonderful film Titfield Thunderbolt the engine pulls up to the water column, the parachute end is placed over the engine's tank and a chain is pulled to open the water. The chain is weighted down by a block of wood or something and when there is enough water, the weight is unattached from the chain and the water stops...

In an LMS training film, the outlet pipe arm is pulled across to the engine's tank by a chain and there is a wheel to open / close the flow of water which is attached the the arm itself...

The link below shows a rare photo of GH station looking East towards Rose Grove (Burnley) but I can't see a chain or wheel on the water column?

I bought a copy of this photo and have scanned it and zoomed in to study it closely but as I said I can't see how this column would have been operated?

Great Harwood Railway Station c1900 "RARE" 6x4 Photograph | eBay UK

This item is a photograph and is a reproduction that has been created from the original image and made into a digital file for printing. Approximate size 6" X 4" or 15cm X 10cm.

www.ebay.co.uk

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[John Webb]

Interesting things here.

If I can ask another basic question - how was the outlet opened for water at Great Harwood?

In the wonderful film Titfield Thunderbolt the engine pulls up to the water column, the parachute end is placed over the engine's tank and a chain is pulled to open the water. The chain is weighted down by a block of wood or something and when there is enough water, the weight is unattached from the chain and the water stops...

In an LMS training film, the outlet pipe arm is pulled across to the engine's tank by a chain and there is a wheel to open / close the flow of water which is attached the the arm itself...

The link below shows a rare photo of GH station looking East towards Rose Grove (Burnley) but I can't see a chain or wheel on the water column?

I bought a copy of this photo and have scanned it and zoomed in to study it closely but as I said I can't see how this column would have been operated?

Great Harwood Railway Station c1900 "RARE" 6x4 Photograph | eBay UK

This item is a photograph and is a reproduction that has been created from the original image and made into a digital file for printing. Approximate size 6" X 4" or 15cm X 10cm.

www.ebay.co.uk

Thanks,
Andy.

Andy - at the top of the tank, on the left as we look at it and just clear of the smoke deflector under the footbridge, there is a projection of some sort. My guess is that there is a chain hanging from this which when pulled opens the valve in the tank. But due to the limitations of camera/film or reproduction thereof the chain is too light (thin or however it can best be described) to have clearly registered on the postcard. I stress this is my guess, but looking at photos of similar tanks in "A Railway Modeller's Picture Library" by Chris Leigh (Ian Allan, 1995) this seems to have been a common method of operation of such tanks.

 

[Andy873]

I stress this is my guess, but looking at photos of similar tanks in "A Railway Modeller's Picture Library" by Chris Leigh (Ian Allan, 1995) this seems to have been a common method of operation of such tanks.

John, thank you, I see what you're describing. Above it there is some arm / pivot which when pulled down from platform level would lift the arm up at the other side. Connect that to the outlet value and we have a working system via a chain.

and just clear of the smoke deflector under the footbridge

You've also answered another question I had, I wondered what on earth they were - thanks!

I have one final puzzle about this water column:

My L&Y society book about the branch line says about the water column "was removed shortly after passenger services ceased" (Dec 1957), so that probably happened about 1958 / 59...

Now there are three photos, the first I can't show you due to copyright - but it was taken from the up platform with a family waiting for a holiday / summer Saturday train. Their clothes suggest early 1960's and the water column is still there.

The second photo is taken in the early 1960's from the footbridge, you can clearly see people waiting on the up platform for an excursion special but I can't see the water tank, I would have thought it would have partially blocked the view.

Photo from the footbridge:

Last Days of the North East Lancs Loop line - 45000GH - SteamingNorth.com ... (Click on a picture to open that album and then on a picture to enlarge it...........Pictures copyright of Author

www.steamingnorth.com

Now the next photo taken during the demolition (Oct - Dec 1965), you can see the station buildings etc being demolished - but there is a curious object on it...

This photo has (on the right and at the forefront) the lamp room in view. At the back of it (towards the up platform) there is what looks like a large cylindrical object on its side by the broken footbridge partially in view.

Is this the water tank?
if not, what could it be?
If it is the water tank, then the book must be wrong?

Photo of demolition:

Last Days of the North East Lancs Loop line - GH BackStation - SteamingNorth.com ... (Click on a picture to open that album and then on a picture to enlarge it...........Pictures copyright of Author

www.steamingnorth.com

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[bishdunster]

It appears you are misreading what you see there, as did I at first glance. The "cylindrical object" is an illusion, what i see is the somewhat distorted (by the demolition process) top "landing" of the footbridge and merging into the distorted top portion of the steps, thus giving the impression of something circular.

 

[Andy873]

It appears you are misreading what you see there, as did I at first glance. The "cylindrical object" is an illusion, what i see is the somewhat distorted (by the demolition process) top "landing" of the footbridge and merging into the distorted top portion of the steps, thus giving the impression of something circular.

Thanks for that, yes it does look like an illusion now you've explained it.

How much water would one of these typical branch line station water column's hold in one go? (i know it depends on the size of each one).

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[John Webb]

....How much water would one of these typical branch line station water column's hold in one go? (i know it depends on the size of each one).

Thanks,
Andy.

A look at photographs suggest that many of these tanks were around 6ft high and 6ft diameter, giving a volume of around 160 cubic feet. There are about 6.25 gallons to a cubic foot, so we arrive at a figure of some 1000 gallons.

 

[Andy873]

A look at photographs suggest that many of these tanks were around 6ft high and 6ft diameter, giving a volume of around 160 cubic feet. There are about 6.25 gallons to a cubic foot, so we arrive at a figure of some 1000 gallons.

John, thank you for that, I did wonder about the dimensions of the tank itself and that looks right to me. 1000 gallons, plenty there for a top up!

Thanks,
Andy.