Liverpool Transpennine services

[Whistler40145]

Does Newcastle warrant as many through services from Liverpool as present?

If the answer is no, several services could start at Manchester Piccadilly?

 

[ukrob]

Does Newcastle warrant as many through services from Liverpool as present?

If the answer is no, several services could start at Manchester Piccadilly?

I don't understand what you are asking. There is only one through service from Liverpool to Newcastle per day. It leaves Liverpool at 06.16 and splits into portions for Scarborough and Newcastle at York.

 

[OMGitsDAVE]

The many universities on the TPE network help produce a lot of luggage:
Liverpool x 3
Manchester (effectively x 3 although UMIST merged)
Huddersfield
Leeds x 2
Hull x 2
York
Durham
Newcastle x 2
Salford
Bolton
Preston
Lancaster
Carlisle
Glasgow x 2?
Edinburgh x 2?

Durham also has a campus at Thornaby, and Teesside University is located in Middlesbrough

 

[VideozVideoz]

Again, you state the case to perfection. Look to the future. When the Ordsall Chord is built, they will not be coming via Guide Bridge as at present, but will proceed from Stalybridge via the junction at Miles Platting, then through Manchester Victoria, Manchester Piccadilly then on to Manchester Airport.

Thank you! But you put 'Again, you state the case to perfection'.. when did I do it previously??

 

[Whistler40145]

Sorry, I didn't realise that only one train a day goes from Liverpool to Newcastle.

I presume the remainder of services go to Hull/Middlesbrough with some starting @ Manchester Airport/Piccadilly?

 

[OMGitsDAVE]

Sorry, I didn't realise that only one train a day goes from Liverpool to Newcastle.

I presume the remainder of services go to Hull/Middlesbrough with some starting @ Manchester Airport/Piccadilly?

There is only one or two that go from Liverpool to Middlesbrough.
The Liverpool services go through to Scarborough.

Therefore;
Middlesbrough - Manchester Piccadilly - Manchester Airport
Newcastle - Manchester Piccadilly - Manchester Airport
Liverpool - Manchester Piccadilly & Oxford Road - Scarborough

 

[Whistler40145]

The service certainly has changed over the years, the majority of trains served Newcastle.

I am showing my age now, the last time I did a TransPennine service to Newcastle was behind 47475 & a rake of Mk 2s!

Those were the good old days.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Thank you! But you put 'Again, you state the case to perfection'.. when did I do it previously??

This is a case for punctuation clarification You will see there is a comma after "again". Had there been no comma, your point would have been correct. But the fact that there was a comma, "Again, " referred to a previous posting that did ALSO "state the case to perfection".

But never mind. The point that you made in the entry that you originally made was full of sense and was deserving of praise!!

 

[VideozVideoz]

This is a case for punctuation clarification You will see there is a comma after "again". Had there been no comma, your point would have been correct. But the fact that there was a comma, "Again, " referred to a previous posting that did ALSO "state the case to perfection".

But never mind. The point that you made in the entry that you originally made was full of sense and was deserving of praise!!

Paul, yes i understood the comma after the 'again'! My question to you was WHEN did I previously state the case to perfection? Which post are you referring to?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Paul, yes i understood the comma after the 'again'! My question to you was WHEN did I previously state the case to perfection? Which post are you referring to?

Age is having a detrimental effect on my logic sensors!! This is very worrying.
What I ACTUALLY meant to say that the earlier case was posted by someone other than you.

The "AGAIN" referred to a repeat of a common sense reply... the first time was by ANOTHER person, the second time the SECOND one was you.

This shows that there are TWO people with common sense replies to a point that needed sensible clarification...all I did was to pick up on BOTH of your replies. Forgive me, I am going now to lie down in a darkened room!!!.

 

[VideozVideoz]

Actually this is very worrying for me as I read the whole thread before I posted to see whether what I was going to put had already been said! I never saw owt so I just submitted... I must read more carefully!

 

[Whistler40145]

Would it a timetablers nightmare to send FTPE services from Liverpool down to Manchester Airport, back through Piccadilly P13/14, the proposed Ordsall Curve, Victoria & Stalybridge to Leeds?

 

[Welshman]

Would it a timetablers nightmare to send FTPE services from Liverpool down to Manchester Airport, back through Piccadilly P13/14, the proposed Ordsall Curve, Victoria & Stalybridge to Leeds?

It certainly would be a nightmare for through passengers, with a good 30 minutes added to their journey time!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

It certainly would be a nightmare for through passengers, with a good 30 minutes added to their journey time!

Notwithstanding increasing the number of paths through the through platforms at Manchester Piccadilly.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Would it a timetablers nightmare to send FTPE services from Liverpool down to Manchester Airport, back through Piccadilly P13/14, the proposed Ordsall Curve, Victoria & Stalybridge to Leeds?

Dare I suggest running from Liverpool Lime Street directly through Manchester Victoria, then all points eastward. Or does this sound like the good old days?

 

[cheesecake]

Dare I suggest running from Liverpool Lime Street directly through Manchester Victoria, then all points eastward. Or does this sound like the good old days?

I don't see why that's not possible. Manchester Victoria's perfectly capable of seeing another train an hour in each direction. But it's probably because the service will be less used if it doesn't go through Piccadilly.

 

[Welshman]

Notwithstanding increasing the number of paths through the through platforms at Manchester Piccadilly.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Dare I suggest running from Liverpool Lime Street directly through Manchester Victoria, then all points eastward. Or does this sound like the good old days?

Yes, and not only like the good old days but good, common sense, too.
A faster journey without the Ordsall Chord ever getting off the drawing-board!

 

[Whistler40145]

Do all FTPE services from Liverpool have to go via Warrington Central & Manchester Piccadilly?

Why not alternate every other service to go via Chat Moss & Manchester Victoria?

 

[VideozVideoz]

Do all FTPE services from Liverpool have to go via Warrington Central & Manchester Piccadilly?

Why not alternate every other service to go via Chat Moss & Manchester Victoria?

Probably to do with the single line section?

 

[Whistler40145]

What single line section is that?

 

[VideozVideoz]

If you were going into Victoria, you'd have to come in via the single line section just before Salford

 

[Whistler40145]

I thought the line from Ordsall Lane Jn was double track?

So the junction at Salford is single?

 

[Nym]

no, it's double.

2 Track all the way from Liverpool to Victoria

 

[Whistler40145]

Where VideozVideoz had this info from I am not sure.

I knew it is Double Track!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Do all FTPE services from Liverpool have to go via Warrington Central & Manchester Piccadilly?

Why not alternate every other service to go via Chat Moss & Manchester Victoria?

What will happen to the Liverpool-Scarborough service once the Ordsall Chord project is completed as the existing running via the junction at Guide Bridge to Stalybridge will not be an approved pathway...the move being to relocate the Manchester to Stalybridge section via the junction at Miles Platting from Manchester Victoria. Do you think this will bring any problems to current areas served between Liverpool and Manchester that may lose their trans-Pennine links? We might as well look now at any such problems and to see how the train loadings may be different, let alone lower financial income earned by a different rail path between these two cities.

 

[ukrob]

What will happen to the Liverpool-Scarborough service once the Ordsall Chord project is completed as the existing running via the junction at Guide Bridge to Stalybridge will not be an approved pathway...the move being to relocate the Manchester to Stalybridge section via the junction at Miles Platting from Manchester Victoria. Do you think this will bring any problems to current areas served between Liverpool and Manchester that may lose their trans-Pennine links? We might as well look now at any such problems and to see how the train loadings may be different, let alone lower financial income earned by a different rail path between these two cities.

I suspect the existing service will run Liverpool - Earlestown - Man Vic - Stalybridge - Scarbrough, and a Liverpool - Warrington - Man Picc - Stalybridge - York service will be introduced.

I'm pretty sure I have read there is an aspiration to have a second TPE from Liverpool each hour.

However another plan (after electrification - which is not even planned yet) is to have Blackpool to Scarborough as a DMU and the Liverpool services would run to York using EMUs.

The short answer is nobody knows.

 

[WatcherZero]

From what I heard it would run
Liverpool - Earlestown - Man Vic then reverse back along ordsall chord Man Picc - Stalybridge - York. Warrington would be served by redirecting existing services namely an Man Airport service and would lose a direct service itself until the extra Pic platfroms were built allowing more Man Pic through services at which point it would likely be reinstated.

In the short term at least Warrington loses its service but Liverpools service is 10 minutes faster than before.

 

[ukrob]

From what I heard it would run
Liverpool - Earlestown - Man Vic then reverse back along ordsall chord Man Picc - Stalybridge - York. Warrington would be served by redirecting existing services namely an Man Airport service and would lose a direct service itself until the extra Pic platfroms were built allowing more Man Pic through services at which point it would likely be reinstated.

In the short term at least Warrington loses its service but Liverpools service is 10 minutes faster than before.

How does the Liverpool service become ten minutes faster when you add a reversal to serve both major Manchester stations? Ten minutes slower maybe. Sounds like total rubbish to me.

 

[Nym]

Liverpool Transpennine services will use CHAT MOSS ONLY and be routed via VICTORIA only...

Warrington is going to be dropped from the TPE Map, allong with the whole of the CLC route, chances are they'll have more stoppers or a semi-fast terminating at Piccadilly / Oxford Road

 

[northwichcat]

I suspect the existing service will run Liverpool - Earlestown - Man Vic - Stalybridge - Scarbrough, and a Liverpool - Warrington - Man Picc - Stalybridge - York service will be introduced.

I'm pretty sure I have read there is an aspiration to have a second TPE from Liverpool each hour.

Merseyrail do want 4 express Manchester services every hour, while it's currently 3 (Liverpool-Scarborough, Liverpool-Norwich, Liverpool-Man Airport.)

The draft Yorkshire RUS suggested Piccadilly-Huddersfield-York should be every 15 minutes with the Hull TPE service off pattern.

This sounds good for your suggestion but..

Merseyrail's plan for an extra Manchester express service was not approved.

The additional Piccadilly-York service was also rejected. The preferred alternative was an additional Piccadilly-Selby service with peak time extensions to Hull.

However another plan (after electrification - which is not even planned yet) is to have Blackpool to Scarborough as a DMU and the Liverpool services would run to York using EMUs.

That idea was one of the rejected electrification proposals, along with running an electric Man Airport-Doncaster service and a diesel Doncaster-Cleethorphes service.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Liverpool Transpennine services will use CHAT MOSS ONLY and be routed via VICTORIA only...

Warrington is going to be dropped from the TPE Map, allong with the whole of the CLC route, chances are they'll have more stoppers or a semi-fast terminating at Piccadilly / Oxford Road

Although that is speculation that most people believe to be true not what will definitely happen. The only thing confirmed is that EMUs will run between Liverpool and Manchester via Chat Moss and the PR has stated that because they'll be electric services they'll improve journey times.

 

[185]

I say extend the Hulls to Liverpool South Parkway.

Send the Scarboroughs via Victoria to Liverpool Lime Street.

The two Man Airports from Newc & Mboro can operate via Guide Pridge until the new curve opens at Castlefield.